Replacement Pilots Check Here
 

There are Cx aircrew who have joined under the ban.

What's it like? Any hostility? Any problems in groundschool? Please let us know!!

Likewise, I posted recently for current employees to explain why I should not join. No posts. Come on you militant union types, explain why being unemployed is better than being paid $(US)60k+/1st yr. All this talk about life being expensive in HK. Check out life w/freighters elsewhere as a FO. It rocks.

I want the 49ers to work, but as an outsider even I have worked out that they were sacked because they were militant and active union members. It is political; please stop saying they were innocent! We are not stupid.
I DO NOT want to cross a picket line but the union reasons are pathetic. Stop the upgrades!!!!! Then I will understand.

Ignorant Fool

Hustler,

Hate to lower the debate to this level, but if that is the best answer you can give to people who, through no fault of their own have been put in a terrible position by your union....

YES YOU ARE!

Given the depth of Hustler's vernacular, I guess he must be a 49er. I sympathise with him more than he would like to understand - if that is so. Binginterviewed doesn't understand that 50 odd pilots were selected, for whatever reason, for summary termination. That was a disgusting act and should not be seen as anything else. Now we have both parties involved in the dispute taking intimidatory actions, threats and bullying. For me, the tragedy remains that most, if not all, of the 49ers could have been re-employed by now. The disunion, by supporting its own members acceptances of upgrades etc actually filled the 50 odd slots from within its own ranks - unbeleeevable. And expects the young aircrew to not take slots - unbeleeeevable. There is no merit in the ban, supported by IFALPA/USALPA/TWU/MWU/Sinn Fein or whomsoever. It just doesn't cut the mustard.

If there is no merit in this ban why are all the IFALPA associated unions supporting it? Answer there is merit. Unionism and collective bargaining is about sticking together. Do not cross a picket line and have self respect and admiration for the rest of your life. The alternative is to be forever known as a scab. Believe me the stigma will last.

Madrabbits. Picket line, what picket line? Other posts have more clearly enunciated that AOA members have taken your position either Capt or FO. You must see the futility of the ban, it is patently an absurd mechanism for this situation. I would want you to get your job back in a beautiful world but, I am afraid the horse has bolted too far. There was a time when company sympathy was with you and the opportunity for re-employment was there. I know, interview to assess company loyalty and all that. It would have been very unpleasant and still is. Seems this disunion loves tossing the 'scab' epithet about, did so after ASL as well. But is there really an honourable solution to this? Not with the current committee, not with the pilot body becoming more and more fragmented, not with the growing body of opinion against the Claytons ban in force. Check the voting on the 'Is the ban fair' post, twice as many respondents think it is unfair with no upgrade ban provision, and they are right. It is unreasonable in the extreme to expect young aircrew to refuse employment whilst they know that AOA members have taken upgrades etc from within the Company. The courses are filling and I find it difficult to blame them.

I love watching the Freehills (union busters) argue with themselves!!!

Madrabbits,

Merit just because IFALPA supports it?? Think again, when I question my reps at ALPA about this issue, they all seem to agree that it is a "funny situation" what HKAOA is trying to pull, however, other unions apparently have to offer their support, regardless of fairness, so that they will reciprocate in the future... I think this support is merely political!

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Nudger,

Well, I would not mind, but they might, so let me get my MEC/LEC's official position on paper and I will fwd to you.

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Nudger, you are certainly correct on most counts. Certainly few outside of CX understand the dispute. I am inside CX and I don't. Other than the 49ers issue that is. The 'attacked workforce' has certainly done a bit of attacking as well, enough I fear to have placed all of us in the discomfiting position we find ourselves. And certainly enough to have cost the jobs of 49 odd of our fellows. Do you really believe that ND can keep his promise and get those unfotunates re-instated? I believe he is standing again for the next committee and will no doubt preach more of the same, emphasis on more. How can you keep preaching the same sermon? Change is what is needed and I mean change in people and strategy from the AOA. If the rumour is true that ND approached JHH direct to bypass senior operations management - and was severely rebuffed (recently), then I fear it was just another example of poor reading of a situation and places all of us in an even less tenable position. I want the AOA to survive, I want as many of the 49ers as feasible back at work - neither of these things is likely at the moment.

sorry to dissapoint you nudger, but the leader of the AFAP Brian McCarthy said those exact words about how every union in the world is watching and it didn't mean cat sh*t in the end. pilots spent a lot of money getting qualified i still owe the bank mega bucks. i spent years in GA working my ass off and i don't intend throwing it away for a union. my Dad was in the TWU and a good labour voter and it worked out OK for him because that was 30 years ago. you have to move with the times and there is nothing wrong with the pay or conditions in Cathay Pacific. sorry, but the AOA has got it wrong this time. your so called scabs won BIG time in the '89 dispute so don't come the union is always right.there are no scabs here in Hong Kong, just guys trying to earn a living.

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.....and just as interesting watching the "union guys" have a go at one another...just what I hoped for....enlightened discussion.:D

How right you are. You are THE MAN. The purveyor of truth and justice to everyone except the AOA. Hey, I thought that was MY job!!

(Truth, justice and the elimination of starch, that is)

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you are a confused man nudger, suggest you get out of all this stressful union mess and have a holiday. the gentleman you wanted to talk to about MEC/LECs was southflyer i believe! :mad:

Who did what to who??

Nudger, dude, you can attack my credibility all you want if that makes you happy. As far as a reply, I will give you a reply; as far as me getting a reply from the union, well that is another matter, in that instance you might be right, but lets be patient. Can you handle that?