Voluntary Overtime
 

When the AOA negotiate (?) the new FTL's, it should be a non-negotiable condition that overtime is entirely up to the individual accepting it, ot not. Period.

Further, keep in mind ladies and gents that FTL's are there as a LIMITATION, NOT a target to aim for with rostering.

The AOA has to stand up and do what's right before tails start finding their way into hillsides due fatigue.
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:mad:

Yeah we gave that one away (700 hrs per year) a few years back old chum, that and our 5-4-3 and our.....oh that old chestnut!
As for fatigue rostering, i love the new terms, "fatigue management scheme" for eg. What about the "fatigue avoidance scheme", that is the one i am on. Problem is, as it is everywhere, the government bodies are bending over for the airlines, allowing this sort of thing to happen. We have the AFTLs which is a legal document that the company hides behind, "its legal"!
The buck stops with the pilot, if you are fatigued you MUST call in sick as you are not fit for duty!!! There are plenty of ways to report fatigue patterns, the problem is, people just dont bother (too tired). The AoA could only manage a 60% turn out for the questionair, something that would only take 5 min of your time and a great benefit to the union to see where we think they need to improve. How can we just sit back and expect the AoA to do everything for us when we cant even be bothered ourselves!!!!!!
I am on contract compliance and i manage my fatigue, it really isnt that hard!!!!

Some history.
We used to have the option of doing only 700hrs per year. Unfortunately these hours did not include leave, reserve, sims, office duties and were not factored up for 2/3man crewing. Long haul was factored down by 2hrs per sector.

So to take a typical roster of 3 ULR patterns, the total block hours could be around 78 but then you reduce that by 12hrs (6 x 2) to 66. Each trip was usually 5 days (now 4 days) so we could only do three or so ULRs a month as the 5-4-3 days off rule meant each trip and recovery was 10 days.

For short haul it was just straight hours. If you flew 700hrs then it equates to 798hrs today.

So whether shorthaul or long haul you would end up flying around 798-820hours in todays system, not counting leave, sims, reserve, office days or ground duties. If you count in all the non flying extras it equates to over 100 hours. That gives an annual target in the 900s which is not far off the current 84credit hour system.

So the 700 might look appealing but it is not far from what we have now.


Onto the 'negotiating' part. What WMD will the AOA have to force CX to compromise on something so important? It would be in CX's interests just to let the RPs lapse and go back to rostering to the AFTLS.

NC - you are spot on about that part of our history. You are also spot on about the company just letting the current agreement lapse and go to AFTL's. The AOA has no magic weapon. The membership's response to the survey was appalling. If I was a Cathay manager, I would be looking forward to the end of the year.

i have a genuine question, care to share why the membership response was appalling?

Apparently the membership response was reasonable unloke the non-members response.:confused:

monster
 

totally agree..voluntary OT and what about this stupid G day payment...same dosh whether you fly 50 mins to taipei or 15 hours to lax..what flaming moron agreed to that?
oh yes now i remember the same prat that forced a second vote on support for the 49-ers...left out in the cold permanently.
along with our ULH protection...great job MG

Here is the reason why us of the non members did not respond.

Because you @!$$!@!$@ did not respond to your emails, i sent 3 requesting a logon only to be ignored, must of been ST personal email that was posted, he tends to ignore the wishes of the majority.

Heres my wishlist.

Overtime is volentary.
All current SOs get to bid for any FO position first and then do a review panel first to asses suitabiliy, this direct enty FO business esp on PAX is unaccetable and against the SO's COS.
Pay the same tax rate on housing that the KA boys do.
Get credit for sitting at home on reserve instead of going on that bike ride or to Macau.
Not losing credit when you divert into Incheon as you ran out of hours and have to PX home.

Thats a start but we all know what STs answer to those is... "its the comanys train set"

BTW the only thing on the list that actually cost the company money is the last two points and they would save far more than it will cost them if CC says not to go into discretion causing massive disrupts.