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Displaced Local Crew

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Displaced Local Crew

Old 30th Nov 2020, 01:04
  #161 (permalink)  
Rie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Wan Chai
Posts: 231
Dragon, how can you use the term "rightful"?

No Dragon pilot has not immediate right to work for Cathay just because they are a pilot. It is a different company (even if in the same group) and as such any individual wishing to apply must prove their own worth through the proper interview process. Just ask any pilot/cabin crew from a LCC with a sister mainline carrier. They would have had to interview to make the move.

As I have said before it is not too hard for a company to declare candidates unsuitable. The cadet process is a clear indicator of this.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 01:19
  #162 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: CLK
Posts: 370
Hilarious that “expats” are fighting to remain in a job/salary that will never allow them to live well in HK or to save enough $$$ to move back home and retire early.
The good days at CX are officially over, take the hint and make your preparations to move on.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 02:12
  #163 (permalink)  
hyg
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: hong kong
Posts: 140
Originally Posted by controlledrest View Post
If Immigration Department isn't doing as CX tell them, it makes it harder for CX to close the bases and honour the contract....with recent disregard for honouring the contract, engaging staff and doing the right thing I suspect we can expect the bases to close and those on them to be cut loose.
Immigration Dept doing as CX tells them?? what era are u living in?? the CCP now owns CX, it's CX that will do as told, what do you think those 2 'non-voting party nominated secretaries' in the board are for
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 02:30
  #164 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: HKG
Posts: 59
Rie

I think he means CX took the KA 320 (as they did the 747) and the routes.

Who in their right mind would want to work for CX anyway. Any notion of contract or career has to be viewed cynically wouldn’t you think?
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 02:51
  #165 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: The Dog House
Posts: 34
Can confirm a few JFO's recently have only had visa's renewed for 3 months, there are also crew overseas with expired visas the company are looking at.

Wondering why if the immigration department was going to keep these renewals going there would be any changes at all, best of luck to anyone needing a renewal in the next few months...
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 03:29
  #166 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 128
what do you mean crew overseas with expired visas the company are looking at? People on leave, you can't be talking about based guys because I thought they didn't have nor need visas for Hong Kong?
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 04:55
  #167 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Rabbit Hutch
Posts: 154
Some crew on leave, SLS or extended UPL have foolishly let their visas lapse. Sounds like they won’t be coming back at all.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 05:33
  #168 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: FUMOD
Posts: 62
You’re funny Farman. Who do you know who is fighting to stay in Hong Kong? For the next two years, for most (747 excepted) it’s rent paid and free money for no work. These expats for whom you seem to have such contempt will be gone when it suits them as will the long term loyal passenger base when they keep hearing the PAs in barely understandable chinglish.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 05:48
  #169 (permalink)  
Rie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Wan Chai
Posts: 231
Dragon Pacific

I would hope not to see a return of those people. Your visa if you require one is your responsibility just like tracking the expiries of your licence. It is not the duty of the company. To leave and not return in time is utterly idiotic.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 06:54
  #170 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: By the sea
Posts: 130
A little empathy fellas. This would have been an easy bear trap to fall into. Can’t wait to share a flight deck with either of you pair.
I’m calling bs on it by the way.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 07:35
  #171 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: HKG
Posts: 59
Dragon Pacific

It might be impossible to get back if you were locked down in Aust.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 07:57
  #172 (permalink)  
Rie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Wan Chai
Posts: 231
pill, I and many others kept track of my expiries for my 2 year and then my 3 year before gaining PR. How can you have empathy if you have been through the same thing multiple times and you made sure to have the paperwork sorted in time for renewal.

I understand people have chosen to leave to be with families during this time but its not hard to come back, write a letter to the government (with a flight ticket attached stating why you are needing it rushed) and have your renewal sorted within 3hrs. If Billy boy and his for droogs can get ready for a little of the old in-out then there is no stopping any FO/SO from doing the same with their application. Just make sure no lashings of the old ultra-violence.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 08:54
  #173 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Hong Kong, SAR.
Posts: 164
Wow, I am so impressed you never made an administrative lapse, and have a little spreadsheet to warn you at the appropriate time.
You don't know the individual situations these people find themselves in, so better just be quiet about how organized you are yourself and how easy it is to just pop over and out to Hong Kong to get your visa.
There are some countries out there with some very hefty restrictions.

Again, have a little empathy.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 09:38
  #174 (permalink)  
Rie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Wan Chai
Posts: 231
There is difference between an administrative lapse vs your working visa for a company in a country you legally cannot reside without holding. I am not perfect at all but I'll be damned if I forget something that will cost me my job.

Would you go to your next sim/line check and forget your licence and expect it was signed off? Maybe you forget about your medical and just hope that it was re-issued? The same goes with an employment visa.

If you take a look at any of the quarantine help groups on Facebook. There are dozens every day day asking if their PR status is going to run out as they are due for the 3 year check in. The answer always comes back the same that there are no allowances made even with COVID affecting access. So these people fly into HK for quarantine, tick the box and fly back home again. Many families I know have taken children out of school and returned home this year to keep their children safe but have always come back when needed for work commitments. One I know has even done this process 3 times with quarantine on each end.

Oasis, which are the countries from which these crew reside that are strict enough right now to not let a non-resident travel?

Last edited by Rie; 30th Nov 2020 at 09:59.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 10:41
  #175 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Hong Kong, SAR.
Posts: 164
Australia case
You come to Hong Kong to renew your visa. So you have to quarantine in HKG for 14 days, 2-3 days to do the visa, then fly back and then quarantine again for 14 days.
Inducing travel this means you have to block off about 33 days out of your schedule for the pleasure of renewing your visa.
You have to admit this can be a challenge for many people.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 10:53
  #176 (permalink)  
Rie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Wan Chai
Posts: 231
100% on your side regarding the hardships. It is astonishingly hard for all even those who are trapped inside HK, so many people have not seen family for a very long time. A LCC pilot I know without dental coverage has had to fly to their home just to get a dental work done and accepted the quarantine on both sides. Saved them money at least.

Australian pilots I know have gone home, quarantined and returned. It was based on their non-resident status so they are free to go as they see fit. Based guys on the other hand will have a hard time but nothing a work visa/PR can't solve if it comes to that.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 21:02
  #177 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Hong kong
Posts: 39
HK Immigration only does their assessment on whether a local can do the job, and if a foreigner is really needed, only at the initial application for the visa. All subsequent renewals, this is not assessed and the only subsequent checking is you previously abided by the visa rules and the company still sponsoring your visa. A check to see if there is local talent to do your job is NOT performed for visa renewal.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 21:48
  #178 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: HKG
Posts: 299
Originally Posted by hyg View Post
Immigration Dept doing as CX tells them?? what era are u living in?? the CCP now owns CX, it's CX that will do as told, what do you think those 2 'non-voting party nominated secretaries' in the board are for

Got point, my mistake. I've been here for too long.

Must have been a bit of a bitch initially for the Swire Smooth Brains to be told what to do, but a relief when their orders matched their own moral compass and complete disregard for the peasants.
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Old 30th Nov 2020, 23:47
  #179 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Rabbit Hutch
Posts: 154
rustyoldtin

It was always a requirement for renewal that there shouldn’t be local that can do the job as per the original application. It may have been that there previously was no need to rigorously check.

Quote: Such applications will be considered only where it is satisfied that the circumstances upon which the applicant acquired his/her current immigration status remain unchanged.

It would appear that successful lobbying of Immigration and of Jeremy Tam by those pilots recently made redundant means that proper consideration of the local pilot market is now being made for renewal of a work visa.
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Old 1st Dec 2020, 00:07
  #180 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: CLK
Posts: 370
The matter now has visibility and will be enduring.

However it might be a double trap for those HK PR's who seek to gain from it as it will only be a matter of time before the other pilot citizens of China decide that they would prefer to live and work in Hong Kong.

Market forces abound
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