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Let's get real....Job losses to come!

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Let's get real....Job losses to come!

Old 29th Mar 2020, 01:54
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: usa
Posts: 24
Let's get real....Job losses to come!

So I must admit I never thought I would be saying this but I do think most of us will be out of a job soon ( not just pilots ). The question is - what will our package be? Will they try mitigate letting people go by getting rid of housing? Maybe force people onto COS18? A pay cut for the next few months? No pay?
Sign or leave type situation? Last in, first out ( which begs the question about all the DEFO's on the 747 )? Force a group of pilots ( 777 ) on unpaid leave?

Above are all nasty rumours...

What is everyones thoughts out there? Trying to get everyones take on the situation.

Be safe out there
herewego75 is offline  
Old 29th Mar 2020, 02:17
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rsb
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: UK
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Seniority or not?

Seniority within fleet for upgrades so I’m sure that will be the case for lay offs too.....
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 02:42
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Join Date: Mar 2014
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What exactly is the point in this thread?
Isn't it bad enough what is happening to our industry and many others, the large number of people that have died, and the pain we are all going to suffer as a result of COVID-19.
Can't we, please, just try to stick to reality instead of nasty rumours.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 03:11
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Join Date: May 2019
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Originally Posted by never ready View Post
What exactly is the point in this thread?
Isn't it bad enough what is happening to our industry and many others, the large number of people that have died, and the pain we are all going to suffer as a result of COVID-19.
Can't we, please, just try to stick to reality instead of nasty rumours.
I agree totally. If my future life under the Corona threat is going to be endless days of listening to know-it-alls predicting the end of life as we know it, may as well kill me now.

None of us know how this will play out, so why just add to the fear-mongering?
Be as positive as possible, help your neighbours, catch up with family and friends. Be kind.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 03:12
  #5 (permalink)  
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At no point is this thread a rumour. Please read it again. I have said the above are nasty rumours! If you not living under a rock at the moment, rumours are circulating on social media groups like wild fire!
I am simply asking people ( once again read my initial message ) what is their thoughts and take on the situation. Many of our seniors have been through a lot in this airline and they have great insight. Maybe some here actually know what's going on?

I absolutely agree with you, its terribly sad with regards to what is going on around the world regarding COVID-19, but we need to know or get some advice about what is to come in the near future.

Be safe everyone.

herewego75 is offline  
Old 29th Mar 2020, 03:21
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: HKG
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Don't worry about what you can't control.

The company might try various things on, but they really can just get ******.

Take a moment to read your COS:In the case of termination of employment due to redundancy, Company Officers will be considered homogeneously with all Officers listed on the CPA Common Redundancy Lists. Termination will apply in reverse order of date of joining as listed on the CPA Common Redundancy Lists, i.e. last in first out.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 03:32
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Join Date: Mar 2001
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Are CoS18 on the redundancy list?
Will they lay off pilots on the 747 and train replacements? Who knows, but I do think that we are about to find out fairly soon.
Fly747 is online now  
Old 29th Mar 2020, 03:34
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Hong Kong
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As never ready said, what's the point of this thread? Last year Aus had 300,000 infections and 900 deaths from the flu, and we kept flying. So far Covid19 has killed 14 in that country. It sounds like the "cure" (total economic and societal breakdown) might be worse than the disease.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 03:35
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CR, unfortunately, I don't think that a CRL exists, ie, all the TUs couldn't get to an agreement about it.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 03:52
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Appreciate some of the replies! if you feel this post has no point then please don't read it. This network is for rumours and discussions. If you don't like this one then don't read it. Simple.

But in my opinion ( which this entire thread is "in my opinion" ), and it's great we live in a world that we allowed to express our opinions, this is the worst time the aviation has seen. Hearing people that lived through SARS and GFC08 - planes were not parked as the are now all over the world.
I have just read the VIRGIN needs a bail out? Any info on this from former colleagues?
Friends of mine are on unpaid leave all over the world. So I would like to know what is coming for myself and my family.

FYI - 99% of threads on this group are pointless. However it gets discussions going etc.

Im still very positive about our airline and going forward!! You are correct JHW - lets be positive and help people! Information is key.
herewego75 is offline  
Old 29th Mar 2020, 03:56
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Originally Posted by OK4Wire View Post
CR, unfortunately, I don't think that a CRL exists, ie, all the TUs couldn't get to an agreement about it.
The tu's have been trying to get access to this mysterious CRL since it first appeared in COS 08.
See the HKAOA's latest letter to DFO.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 04:13
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herewego75 is doing what any sane person should do in these circumstances. Looking for a Plan B. To those of you who aren't and are just sticking your heads in the sand "good luck". I am assuming those same people don't bother with medical or house insurance, don't build their escape routes on Y1 ( cause it will never happen ), spend all their salary each month because their pension pot will keep them going. Our jobs as pilots is to plan for the worst and hope it never happens. The world we find ourselves in today demands a Plan B and even C and D.
But you guys go ahead and live in total denial and while you're at it look at some of the very real discussions going on in this website outside Fragrant Harbour and you will see herewego75 is spot on target with his opinion.

Take a look at American Airlines. In far better financial shape than CX. Redundancy packages have been negotiated already and been snapped up by senior pilots. Here in HKG the AOA is silent.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 06:53
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Qantas has all of the above contractual ‘protection’ and 20,000 are on indefinite leave WITHOUT pay....
wake up ********
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 08:43
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 466
Herewego make up your mind, t’s a rumour, then its not, now it is again
I dont blame you son, you are scared.
This will blow over. It may take a while but it will blow over.
Look after your wife and your kids. Forget about the job as there’re is NOTHING you can do to effect whatever result is coming.
Your family is the only thing of importance.
Not shiny jets.
Not money.
Not career.

Unitedabx....**** off
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 09:13
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
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Originally Posted by OK4Wire View Post
As never ready said, what's the point of this thread? Last year Aus had 300,000 infections and 900 deaths from the flu, and we kept flying. So far Covid19 has killed 14 in that country. It sounds like the "cure" (total economic and societal breakdown) might be worse than the disease.
Mentality like this was exactly what got the world to this dire situation in the first place. From every metrics known this is simply not a flu. Ignorance and arrogance have caused many to suffer.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 09:18
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Originally Posted by OK4Wire View Post
As never ready said, what's the point of this thread? Last year Aus had 300,000 infections and 900 deaths from the flu, and we kept flying. So far Covid19 has killed 14 in that country. It sounds like the "cure" (total economic and societal breakdown) might be worse than the disease.
More people die of flu than car crashes. Bet you wore a seatbelt the last time you drove a car though.

... Thought I’d join in with the comparing of two totally different and unrelated causes of death to justify ignoring one of them because a totally unrelated one is more deadly game.

The other options were avoiding bee stings, surfers taking measures to avoid being eaten by sharks, and not playing cricket during a thunderstorm...
VariablePitchP is offline  
Old 29th Mar 2020, 14:32
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
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If you look back at the 1997-98 Asian Financial Crisis an entire fleet (747 Classic) was given away plus engineering support to PIA. All the Flight Engineers were made redundant in Reverse Seniority Order, and rehired to the CX Freighter Shambles in Seniority Order...
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 15:26
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Join Date: May 2018
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I think we’re about to find some very selfish people when/if redundancies happen.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 20:07
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Originally Posted by OK4Wire View Post
As never ready said, what's the point of this thread? Last year Aus had 300,000 infections and 900 deaths from the flu, and we kept flying. So far Covid19 has killed 14 in that country. It sounds like the "cure" (total economic and societal breakdown) might be worse than the disease.
Not might be, most assuredly will be. Hopefully this will begin to dawn on the powers that be sooner, rather than later.
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Old 29th Mar 2020, 20:10
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
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Your early warning sign will be the announcement of a voluntary redundancy scheme soliciting voluntary resignations and retirements. Look carefully at those packages, because that's the best the company will offer. After that, all bets are off. This is exactly how it is going to play out.
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