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Training ban broken

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Training ban broken

Old 3rd Jun 2019, 07:34
  #101 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by unitedabx
Surely time to up the game. If TB is being circumvented then apply FULL CC.
FULL CC. Lol. There is no leverage in CC. Leverage is gone. Yet people seem only concerned with their ďpreciousĒ levy money and who marked up a PDF document highlighting the fact they were idiots. Any momentum instantly disappeared. Own goal. Itís over. We lost. Time to move beyond.
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Old 3rd Jun 2019, 08:53
  #102 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TurningFinalRWY36
What more could be doing with CC, we already don't answer the phone or acknowledge notifications. I go to work when Im rostered and don't when Im not
During the last CC period the following were in force :

1. Taxy speed not to exceed 10 kts.
2. No directs enroute.
3. CFP fuel and nothing less.
4. All NOTAMS to be read by every pilot in the crew before flight.
5. No Commanders discretion EVER.
6. Tough night down route then call in fatigued.
7. No RETI.
8. Fly one step below opt.
9. Don't accept or request high speed climbs or descents.
10. Jumpseats released ONLY to pilots.
11. Report to briefing at STD minus 90 minutes at HKG not one minute before.
12. On every TPMS click "for manager attention" and force them to actually read all reports.
13. After your sim don't indulge the likes of JW with two hour debriefs. Walk out after the alloted 30 minutes.
14. Email GBS services every week asking for a reference letter. Or use My Letter if you can.
15. Request your full uniform entitlement.
16. Don't indulge the "scabs" on the flightdeck. Checklists only.
17. Officially, no landings to FO's. This forces them into the sim for landing recency and cloggs the system within weeks.

And thats just off the top of my head. Every little helps.
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Old 3rd Jun 2019, 09:18
  #103 (permalink)  
 
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Unitedbax, you sound very emboldened now that you are retired!
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Old 3rd Jun 2019, 09:23
  #104 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by unitedabx
During the last CC period the following were in force :

1. Taxy speed not to exceed 10 kts.
2. No directs enroute.
3. CFP fuel and nothing less.
4. All NOTAMS to be read by every pilot in the crew before flight.
5. No Commanders discretion EVER.
6. Tough night down route then call in fatigued.
7. No RETI.
8. Fly one step below opt.
9. Don't accept or request high speed climbs or descents.
10. Jumpseats released ONLY to pilots.
11. Report to briefing at STD minus 90 minutes at HKG not one minute before.
12. On every TPMS click "for manager attention" and force them to actually read all reports.
13. After your sim don't indulge the likes of JW with two hour debriefs. Walk out after the alloted 30 minutes.
14. Email GBS services every week asking for a reference letter. Or use My Letter if you can.
15. Request your full uniform entitlement.
16. Don't indulge the "scabs" on the flightdeck. Checklists only.
17. Officially, no landings to FO's. This forces them into the sim for landing recency and cloggs the system within weeks.

And thats just off the top of my head. Every little helps.
Untitedabx,
You realise most of your fellow pilots are laughing at your list right now? Get real, the company has found ways around CC, and we get no leverage out of it.
Report on time, do your work like a true professional. When fatigued, then call it a day. But your version of CC does no justice to the pilot profession.
We really are our worst enemies.
​​​​​​
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Old 3rd Jun 2019, 09:26
  #105 (permalink)  
 
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unitedabx most of the things you have listed there have nothing to do CC. That is just sticking it to the company
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Old 3rd Jun 2019, 09:32
  #106 (permalink)  
 
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Not only that the list has zero items that bring pressure to bear on the company. They are all easily circumvented with a change in the manuals or only serve to antagonize fellow employees. My favorite is the requesting letters. They could employ 3000 letter writers and still save money by not giving us what we want. All those items might make us feel better, but they donít do anything to achieve the goal.

The reality is that we have one move left. And it isnít to change the make-up of the GC or tweak the rules. We all know what it is, but nobody is going to do it.
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Old 3rd Jun 2019, 09:37
  #107 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tiredofstupidity
Not only that the list has zero items that bring pressure to bear on the company. They are all easily circumvented with a change in the manuals or only serve to antagonize fellow employees. My favorite is the requesting letters. They could employ 3000 letter writers and still save money by not giving us what we want. All those items might make us feel better, but they don’t do anything to achieve the goal.

The reality is that we have one move left. And it isn’t to change the make-up of the GC or tweak the rules. We all know what it is, but nobody is going to do it.
You can't even say the word "STRIKE".

Oh and 10 of those points listed came directly out of the Delta Airlines union "guidelines for CC" and I think they are treated pretty well these days.
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Old 3rd Jun 2019, 13:47
  #108 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by unitedabx
During the last CC period the following were in force :

11. Report to briefing at STD minus 90 minutes at HKG not one minute before.
Little wonder CC is having limited effect if you were signing on 20 minutes earlier than required @unitedabx

STP
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Old 3rd Jun 2019, 15:17
  #109 (permalink)  
 
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In reference to all above, the nihilism and apathy among nearly all CX flight crew and in particular the AOA GC is palpable..!!

As you sow, so shall you reap !


#CXit

Last edited by Flex88; 3rd Jun 2019 at 16:01.
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Old 3rd Jun 2019, 22:39
  #110 (permalink)  
 
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Is rather follow that list, then give up like most of you over here. Not a lot of fight in you, oh well... why donít you step aside, let others carry your burden...
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Old 4th Jun 2019, 03:52
  #111 (permalink)  
 
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And by fighting, what are you expecting to achieve? Curious!

Originally Posted by Oasis
Is rather follow that list, then give up like most of you over here. Not a lot of fight in you, oh well... why donít you step aside, let others carry your burden...
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Old 4th Jun 2019, 05:22
  #112 (permalink)  
 
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I hope to achieve the polar opposite of greasing it up and taking it in the rear.
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Old 4th Jun 2019, 05:53
  #113 (permalink)  
 
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And how’s that working out? Apart from your brave posts of what a hero you are on an anonymous forum, what have you actually managed to achieve with 4 years of ‘pretending’ to be the man when it comes to contract compliance? I suspect the list of victories is a very short one. (I’ve stoically followed the game plan...just can’t see what keeping on following that plan will do apart from hurt ourselves and let sub-standard volunteers into training).


Originally Posted by Oasis
I hope to achieve the polar opposite of greasing it up and taking it in the rear.
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Old 4th Jun 2019, 07:53
  #114 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Hugo Peroni the V
And howís that working out? Apart from your brave posts of what a hero you are on an anonymous forum, what have you actually managed to achieve with 4 years of Ďpretendingí to be the man when it comes to contract compliance? I suspect the list of victories is a very short one. (Iíve stoically followed the game plan...just canít see what keeping on following that plan will do apart from hurt ourselves and let sub-standard volunteers into training).




So are you just advocating "giving up" ? Unless you have a strategy you will be walked over again and again by the management. Sure you can "rollover" but what does that say about YOU ?
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Old 4th Jun 2019, 08:25
  #115 (permalink)  
 
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United, I don't think the only 2 options are "giving up" or "staying the course".

In some cases (like this one), "not giving up" means doing the same sh!t over and over for decades thinking it's making a difference to the management. Surely we are smarter than that?! Many, many years of "not giving up" while watching management not only change but actually grow little children into our current managers!

There is a better course, but it involves canceling everything, regrouping and starting again, something that our "cult" or "religious" system will simply not allow.
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Old 4th Jun 2019, 10:31
  #116 (permalink)  
 
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Far from it. Iím just saying the plan isnít working and we are losing and suffering as a result. Einstein once said that insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result and that is exactly what we are doing.
Originally Posted by unitedabx
So are you just advocating "giving up" ? Unless you have a strategy you will be walked over again and again by the management. Sure you can "rollover" but what does that say about YOU ?
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 10:49
  #117 (permalink)  
 
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OK4Wire and Hugo Peroni the V have this absolutely spot on.

How long can the AOA keep doing the same thing over and over and over and still accept getting regularly shafted by a giant pineapple?
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 11:07
  #118 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Roy De Kantzow
OK4Wire and Hugo Peroni the V have this absolutely spot on.

How long can the AOA keep doing the same thing over and over and over and still accept getting regularly shafted by a giant pineapple?
got any better ideas?
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 11:15
  #119 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Hugo Peroni the V
Far from it. Iím just saying the plan isnít working and we are losing and suffering as a result. Einstein once said that insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result and that is exactly what we are doing.

you know what is insanity?
i just read the aoa negotiations update.
-they are still saying there is no more money
-we can get a pay increase to match inflation, but only if we increase productivity. so in other words, for us to make the same amount of money in real terms, we have to work harder. All the while, pilots are leaving in droves..
And you know your yearly increase does not even come close to inflation....
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Old 5th Jun 2019, 16:09
  #120 (permalink)  
 
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There are a number of very talented pilots who would make excellent training captains but have not put their names forward out of respect for the TB . Yet sadly there are so many that are perfectly content to screw over their fellow pilots.
The AOA can only achieve any improvements if the pilot group are all prepared to back them yet this lot are undermining their efforts
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