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Industrial Peace - GMA Verbal Diarrhoea

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Industrial Peace - GMA Verbal Diarrhoea

Old 2nd Nov 2018, 00:00
  #61 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Never You Mind
Posts: 80
Our current CoS 99/08 is all about 84 hours. For a system like JCR to work to maximum efficiency it needs to work within a target window (for rank, fleet and base) without financial penalty due to overtime. This window would typically be 8-10 hours and crew members would be advised to bid a band of hours when constructing their bids for the next roster period if they want to maximise their chances of getting their preferred flying.

CX knows this and will of course seek to raise the OT threshold to accommodate efficiency without overtime.

I would suggest that our chances of a real pay rise in current "negotiations" would be limited for a variety of real and fabricated reasons. Far better to seek current base pay for say a target band of 70-80 credit hours prior to OT kicking in with the commitment to the introduction of JCR/PBS within 6 months of ratification.

4Wire highlights the other issue JCR will blow a fuse over is two radically different CoS (not just pay scales, everything is different and the concept of credit hours doesn't even exist in the documents). There is a simple solution to that problem as well. One CoS, but which one...

To keep staff happy, or perhaps just keep them, CX need to play the money card or the lifestyle card or some combination of both. Everybody has their own point of balance on the $$$vlifestyle seesaw but on the assumption they wont show us the money the other option should be pursued.
Mill Worker is offline  
Old 2nd Nov 2018, 00:10
  #62 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Location: Location
Posts: 7
They have a target window currently.

0 - 84 hours. That should be flexible enough I would think.
dash4blind is offline  
Old 3rd Nov 2018, 06:17
  #63 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: No where
Posts: 747
If you just take a step back and view the situation objectively, it is a shocking realisation as to how far this company has degraded the position of "pilot". To such a degree that there cannot be a legitimate claim of it still being suitable for a career. I don't really understand anymore just what the aim of our management is, but the result will be the most dysfunctional airline in the industry (and we are not far off now). The most appalling aspect of all is just how little regard the management have for any consideration of lifestyle, family cohesion, health or security in retirement. They are using all of us, and their intent is to use each of us up, then throw us away. If you can't see that, then you really are blind. This company is finished as a career airline. Time to get out while there is still other opportunities. Anyone who stays will surely bitterly regret it.
Air Profit is offline  
Old 3rd Nov 2018, 07:52
  #64 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: HK-CRoC
Posts: 573
Bingo

Originally Posted by Air Profit View Post
If you just take a step back and view the situation objectively, it is a shocking realisation as to how far this company has degraded the position of "pilot". To such a degree that there cannot be a legitimate claim of it still being suitable for a career. I don't really understand anymore just what the aim of our management is, but the result will be the most dysfunctional airline in the industry (and we are not far off now). The most appalling aspect of all is just how little regard the management have for any consideration of lifestyle, family cohesion, health or security in retirement. They are using all of us, and their intent is to use each of us up, then throw us away. If you can't see that, then you really are blind. This company is finished as a career airline. Time to get out while there is still other opportunities. Anyone who stays will surely bitterly regret it.
AP

Dead on however I think what you meant was "Professional Pilot". They don't want professionals anymore and they have supplanted "Professional Flight Crew" with pay by the hour drivers, hired off the street or as I call them Upper Uber operators where, it's just a job.
That comes with near worthless benefits and literally buy the hour (COS18) variable income.
How is it we are at a place where Cos08 and certainly COS18 so called Professional Pilots with a small family will never be able to purchase a home and ironically can't qualify for subsidised housing !

We have all sat idly buy and witnessed this phenomenon with many in our ranks actively assisting in the degradation.

Last edited by Flex88; 3rd Nov 2018 at 09:51.
Flex88 is offline  
Old 3rd Nov 2018, 08:47
  #65 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: far west
Posts: 150
I would also add to purchase an ad in every aviation magazine and advertise in a negative way about this place. Potential pilots need to know what sort of trash will wait for them if joining this circus.
+ 1 for strike
positionalpor is offline  
Old 3rd Nov 2018, 09:05
  #66 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
Posts: 505
Originally Posted by positionalpor View Post
I would also add to purchase an ad in every aviation magazine and advertise in a negative way about this place. Potential pilots need to know what sort of trash will wait for them if joining this circus.
+ 1 for strike
Great suggestion which the GC has rejected out of hand siitng "lack of funds"
unitedabx is offline  
Old 3rd Nov 2018, 09:59
  #67 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 392
I happen to know that is not true.
OK4Wire is online now  
Old 3rd Nov 2018, 11:17
  #68 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
Posts: 505
Originally Posted by OK4Wire View Post
I happen to know that is not true.
The matter was discussed and SCMP, Hong Kong Standard and China Daily were approached for quotes. Deemed too expensive. Apple offered a full page for free but GC decided it was too anti CX and declined offer.
unitedabx is offline  
Old 3rd Nov 2018, 18:27
  #69 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Polar Route
Posts: 1,917
Flew with a brand new SO the other day with decent experience pre-CX. I told him he should leave before he wastes any more time here. He looked at me like I was from Mars. The shiny widebody jet syndrome still has massive recruiting, but not retaining, appeal. Therefore, we get barely-pilots and only the dumb (unable to leave) pilots stay. Great airline!!! TTW.
cxorcist is online now  
Old 3rd Nov 2018, 22:10
  #70 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Posts: 38
Cxorcist,

So which are you, the barely- pilot or the dumb-unable-to-leave pilot?
Liam Gallagher is offline  
Old 4th Nov 2018, 01:42
  #71 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Polar Route
Posts: 1,917
Originally Posted by Liam Gallagher View Post
Cxorcist,

So which are you, the barely- pilot or the dumb-unable-to-leave pilot?
The golden handcuff pilot. Which are you Liam?

Obviously, no golden handcuffs for guys on HKPA.
cxorcist is online now  
Old 4th Nov 2018, 01:25
  #72 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Asia
Posts: 515
Originally Posted by cxorcist View Post


The golden handcuff pilot. Which are you Liam?

Obviously, no golden handcuffs for guys on HKPA.
Unless they bought a boat
AQIS Boigu is offline  

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