The latest Slido drivel
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The latest Slido drivel
So, the latest Slido answers just once again confirm (beyond any doubt) that this management is tone deaf and clueless as to the bottomless depths of contempt that the pilots of this airilne hold them in.
AT attempts to convince pilots that not only are they not supposed to be concerned with grossly increasing upgrade times (she says she is 'aware' of the concerns, but tellingly doesn't mention ANY solution). She then insults our intelligence by mentioning 12 year 'wide body' Command upgrade times. AT, being a 'wide body' Captain doesn't make up for not being able to live properly or support a family. Of course, you have convinced yourself that 'wide body' command is all we care about. Guess what, most of us have figured out that the CX 'shiny jet syndrome' is a guaranteed road to career hell. That is why most pilots in this airline are well on their way out the door. You have lost all trust and credibility and nothing you or any of your sycophants say will prevent you losing hundreds if not thousands of your pilots to your competitors.
You go on to mention that our 'package is competitive' based on 'bench-marking' legacy airlines. When you consider that almost no pilot in this airline can even afford to purchase his own home, and can barely afford rent never mind school fees, medical and planning retirement, to insult us by suggesting that 'all is well' with our compensation is just more evidence for a prudent and sensible pilot to make plans to leave, as soon as possible. Every month they delay is a month less of seniority where they will next be employed.
Oh, and btw, those DEFO's that you seem to be counting on. Two of them have told me just this past week that they have already been hired by airlines back in Europe. One of them stated that he has never seen such a dysfunctional company in his life, and can hardly wait to be back home. The only people that still think CX provides a 'rewarding career' are those of you in management, who obtain that career at the expense of the hard working line pilot.
AT, every single week you provide more confirmation that you do not value your aircrew, do not care about our concerns and are willfully conspiring to destroy what little value there is left (note: very little). While our major competitors back in OUR home countries rapidly are expanding, rapidly raising pay, rapidly increasing profit sharing bonuses and rapidly increasing overall benefits, you come out with weekly threats against a package that is already well behind our expectations, and falling further behind each day. There is NO reason to remain with CX. You provide no hope or visibility towards a sustainable career, one that individuals can have confidence in being able to provide for them or their families. You have failed to lead, inspire or display integrity. You are unfit for purpose, and should just go.
AT attempts to convince pilots that not only are they not supposed to be concerned with grossly increasing upgrade times (she says she is 'aware' of the concerns, but tellingly doesn't mention ANY solution). She then insults our intelligence by mentioning 12 year 'wide body' Command upgrade times. AT, being a 'wide body' Captain doesn't make up for not being able to live properly or support a family. Of course, you have convinced yourself that 'wide body' command is all we care about. Guess what, most of us have figured out that the CX 'shiny jet syndrome' is a guaranteed road to career hell. That is why most pilots in this airline are well on their way out the door. You have lost all trust and credibility and nothing you or any of your sycophants say will prevent you losing hundreds if not thousands of your pilots to your competitors.
You go on to mention that our 'package is competitive' based on 'bench-marking' legacy airlines. When you consider that almost no pilot in this airline can even afford to purchase his own home, and can barely afford rent never mind school fees, medical and planning retirement, to insult us by suggesting that 'all is well' with our compensation is just more evidence for a prudent and sensible pilot to make plans to leave, as soon as possible. Every month they delay is a month less of seniority where they will next be employed.
Oh, and btw, those DEFO's that you seem to be counting on. Two of them have told me just this past week that they have already been hired by airlines back in Europe. One of them stated that he has never seen such a dysfunctional company in his life, and can hardly wait to be back home. The only people that still think CX provides a 'rewarding career' are those of you in management, who obtain that career at the expense of the hard working line pilot.
AT, every single week you provide more confirmation that you do not value your aircrew, do not care about our concerns and are willfully conspiring to destroy what little value there is left (note: very little). While our major competitors back in OUR home countries rapidly are expanding, rapidly raising pay, rapidly increasing profit sharing bonuses and rapidly increasing overall benefits, you come out with weekly threats against a package that is already well behind our expectations, and falling further behind each day. There is NO reason to remain with CX. You provide no hope or visibility towards a sustainable career, one that individuals can have confidence in being able to provide for them or their families. You have failed to lead, inspire or display integrity. You are unfit for purpose, and should just go.
Last edited by Trafalgar; 17th Feb 2018 at 03:12.
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No thought required. They are bad.
AT highlights the advantages of a 12 year wait for a wide body command yet pays you less than the 2 year wait for a narrow body command at our sister airline and then tells us how it’s a competitive package.
The mind boggles.
AT highlights the advantages of a 12 year wait for a wide body command yet pays you less than the 2 year wait for a narrow body command at our sister airline and then tells us how it’s a competitive package.
The mind boggles.
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"The mind boggles...?". It's enough to make you mentally ill. That is a great example of how dysfunctional and venal this management is. Yet ANOTHER reason to leave and build a proper career elsewhere.
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Some facts on time to upgrade
I thought I would interject and add some prognostications that are, hopefully, based on solid assumptions. I will put more 'flesh' on my work on our own internal forums. But just thought anyone wanting to join should have a more accurate idea of what to expect in terms of upgrades.
Assumptions
Using last five years average for command upgrades, FO upgrades.
SO to FO
If you joined on 1st Jan 2018 you can expect to upgraded to SO in four(4) years. Having said that, almost 25% of our FOs last year were DEFOs. If that continues then the time to go from SO to FO would be five(5) years.
Joining till command date
Based on the last five years it would be 21 years.
What effect has the training ban had? If I ignore 2016-2017 and used 2013-2015 figures, I get the same time for SO-FO but the command time will increase to 27 years. Ironically, since management have prioritised commands in 2016 and 2017 (we are halfway through getting about 50 shiny new airbuses) the command time will reduce dramatically to about 17 years.
Now my maths is inherently flawed as I am using a simple average on a growing organism. However - for the last 3 years we haven't been growing. We actually were smaller mid 2017 than we were at end of 2014.
So I think if we continued to grow at the rate we did for the two decades before the training ban, a more realistic time to command would be just over 14 years. Time to FO would reduce very slightly - maybe 3.4-4.5 years.
TLDR
SO to FO 4-5 years
SO to CN 14-17 years
Assumptions
Using last five years average for command upgrades, FO upgrades.
SO to FO
If you joined on 1st Jan 2018 you can expect to upgraded to SO in four(4) years. Having said that, almost 25% of our FOs last year were DEFOs. If that continues then the time to go from SO to FO would be five(5) years.
Joining till command date
Based on the last five years it would be 21 years.
What effect has the training ban had? If I ignore 2016-2017 and used 2013-2015 figures, I get the same time for SO-FO but the command time will increase to 27 years. Ironically, since management have prioritised commands in 2016 and 2017 (we are halfway through getting about 50 shiny new airbuses) the command time will reduce dramatically to about 17 years.
Now my maths is inherently flawed as I am using a simple average on a growing organism. However - for the last 3 years we haven't been growing. We actually were smaller mid 2017 than we were at end of 2014.
So I think if we continued to grow at the rate we did for the two decades before the training ban, a more realistic time to command would be just over 14 years. Time to FO would reduce very slightly - maybe 3.4-4.5 years.
TLDR
SO to FO 4-5 years
SO to CN 14-17 years
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Excellent posts Traf. All potential Cathay new joiners take heed.
I joined 14 years ago, now a 2 year captain, and I wouldn't recommend this airline to my worst enemy, and actively push new joiners I fly with to look elsewhere for a better airline career.
I'm on my way out too.
I joined 14 years ago, now a 2 year captain, and I wouldn't recommend this airline to my worst enemy, and actively push new joiners I fly with to look elsewhere for a better airline career.
I'm on my way out too.
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I'm cat A'd and waiting for a command upgrade course date and I wouldn't waste two weeks of seniority at my next airline to wait and finish a command course at cx if it comes down to that. That's what this place is worth anymore.
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Two Aussie girls on the train last night:
blonde: "so what are your plans?"
brunette: " waiting for Qantas course"
blonde: " i'm heading down tomorrow for an interview next ****"
brunette: " I hear ***** is also attending the same one"
blonde: " I also heard ***** and ***** will be there as well"
brunette: " can't wait to leave this show"
blonde: " me neither. My bf is moving back next month, so will I"
brunette: " i'm off sick, heading to the GC tomorrow, via Singapore"
blonde: " staff travel, another good reason to leave"
brunette: "that and every other reason"
b and b: "laugh"
Verbatim.
blonde: "so what are your plans?"
brunette: " waiting for Qantas course"
blonde: " i'm heading down tomorrow for an interview next ****"
brunette: " I hear ***** is also attending the same one"
blonde: " I also heard ***** and ***** will be there as well"
brunette: " can't wait to leave this show"
blonde: " me neither. My bf is moving back next month, so will I"
brunette: " i'm off sick, heading to the GC tomorrow, via Singapore"
blonde: " staff travel, another good reason to leave"
brunette: "that and every other reason"
b and b: "laugh"
Verbatim.
You know I’m as annoyed, dismayed or confused with this outfit as the next guy but I’m really getting sick and tired of all this bs bravado crap in here.
Time to take a Pprune holiday I think.
Time to take a Pprune holiday I think.