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All its going to take is a crash.

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

All its going to take is a crash.

Old 30th Oct 2017, 09:23
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Hong kong
Posts: 33
All its going to take is a crash.

I hate to say it but with all the experienced guys leaving after ARAPA, an incident/accident is inevitable. It's only a matter of time(not to win). Cathay's shortsightedness is going to cost the next generation of management, crew, shareholders, passengers and ultimately HKG!!

Everyone is going to pay.

Thank god I'm outa here.

It's been real guys, enjoy!
CowardlyPilot is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2017, 07:51
  #2 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: with the other ex-CX pond scum (a zoologist was once head of Flight Ops)
Posts: 1,782
They budget for hull losses.
Captain Dart is online now  
Old 31st Oct 2017, 08:03
  #3 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: HK
Posts: 36
To be fair so does every airline in the world - it is called insurance. If an airline thought it's risk of a hull loss was zero they would save the expense.

Which would be stupid, given that hull losses can happen quite happily without the help of crew, experienced or otherwise (for example - Sri Lankan getting its planes BBQ'ed by the Tamil Tigers, or Malaysian airlines getting shot down by the Russians, or writing off an A330 due to undeclared dangerous goods)
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Old 31st Oct 2017, 09:33
  #4 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: hongkong
Posts: 398
I wonder if you can hedge hull loss
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Old 31st Oct 2017, 09:39
  #5 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: HK
Posts: 36
Of course you can. Again it is called insurance... You can also hedge your house burning down, or your early death
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Old 31st Oct 2017, 11:00
  #6 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: somewhere above the sea
Posts: 193
Freehills, I think Cathayís hedging has corrupted/confused your idea of hedging.
Hedging is where you invest to offset or reduce a risk.
Insurance is where you pay someone else to assume the risk for you.

In both cases the investment or premium are supposed to be less than your potential losses. In Cathayís case they have lost far more than they ever would have if theyíd bought on the spot market.

Hence itís not been hedging- itís been gambling.
ron burgandy is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2017, 11:28
  #7 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: HK
Posts: 36
Ok we are going way off topic, but gambling and insurance are the same thing.

I gamble that I will die before the insurance company thinks I will. I donít mind losing the bet though!

CX are poor gamblers, that we know
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Old 31st Oct 2017, 14:31
  #8 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: London
Posts: 1,539
CX are poor at everything. There, fixed it for you.
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Old 31st Oct 2017, 18:23
  #9 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 22
And all those locals with 10+ years experience flying regionally around Asia are absolutely unsafe?
Handicapped for their entire career because they didn't have 2,000 hours flying in the bush of Australia before they joined CX?
triple7driver is online now  
Old 1st Nov 2017, 03:44
  #10 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Crew bunk
Posts: 133
It's not the lack of joining experience that will handicap them for their entire career. What will do that is the same thing that will cause a HKG taxi driver with a decade of experience to pump his gas pedal like there's no tomorrow, or cause them to fight to get on an elevator before it empties. No amount of experience can fix the culture of spending your entire life in Hong Kong as a local.
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Old 1st Nov 2017, 04:31
  #11 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2009
Location: VHHH Ocean 2D
Posts: 726
Wearing coats because its November, even though its still 28'C outside.
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Old 1st Nov 2017, 04:55
  #12 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 112
I saw a gweilo wearing a scarf round his neck in Central the other day. They should bring back capital punishment for that sort of thing.
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Old 3rd Nov 2017, 16:40
  #13 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: U/S
Posts: 282
You mean an Austronaut?
Average Fool is offline  
Old 4th Nov 2017, 05:49
  #14 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: lagos
Posts: 856
Coward Pilot the name really is fitting. This thread is a little scary, it's almost like you are hoping for an incident to occur.

Really do feel sorry for you lot
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Old 4th Nov 2017, 05:54
  #15 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Space
Posts: 0
We aren't hoping at all, not one bit. But, we are all expecting. Only then will all the fears, complaints, reports, letters, stances and thoughts about the current management be shown to be true. And then they will blame the pilots.
Curtain rod is offline  
Old 4th Nov 2017, 06:56
  #16 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: London
Posts: 1,539
Curtain, you are mostly correct, other than the last point. Once that inevitable event occurs, the management WILL get the blame, because people like us will make sure of it.
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Old 4th Nov 2017, 19:27
  #17 (permalink)  

Join Date: May 2001
Location: Some hole
Posts: 2,067
Donít they self insure ?
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Old 5th Nov 2017, 07:52
  #18 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2002
Location: up here, everyone looks like ants!
Posts: 966
Nope. USD2 billion per aircraft, per event. Underwritten by Lloyd's.
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Old 5th Nov 2017, 15:00
  #19 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Asia
Posts: 142
That's only two years worth of hedging losses, might as well save the premiums and self insure.
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Old 29th Nov 2017, 14:24
  #20 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 2
The lack of quality local FO's is the reason that I gave up. I couldn't take one more day of having to fly each and every sector (because the FO couldn't safely do so) as well as intervening to give correct info on ATC calls when the spiky haired brigade to my right messed up. This is from a corporate and not an airline perspective, but reading some of the postings on this forum indicate it's no better with an Airline.

Interestingly these FO's also seem to have a habit of parker pen entries in their logbook when one actually bothers to look in depth at their previous experience, probably hundreds of hours of non existant experience in some cases. Yet these types of pilots continue to find work and feel that they are untouchable due to their gold bars and uniform, and when I look at these Junior FO's who really cannot communicate in English with ATC it does make me smile when I see they have awarded themselves an extra stripe making 3 bars after flying a couple of sectors with me.

But ultimately blame lies with the training center or at least a certain one (you know who you are) that hand out command type ratings like candy in the hope that their center continues with its 99.9% first time pass rate, and the problem is then passed to the Captain on the line.
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