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Bases no longer an option.

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Bases no longer an option.

Old 3rd Jul 2013, 14:36
  #21 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 463
90 c is equivalent to 7.0 :1
80c is equivalent to an exchange rate of 6.0:1

I am of the belief that a certain number of our A scaler brethren are awaiting a 6 infront of their exchange rate before they book the rate at which their fixed benefit provident will move to AUD. The timing is critical and could make a huge difference to the final sum. Given most of them are trainers could see a interesting response from cx to attempt to keep them on the corporate tit.
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Old 3rd Jul 2013, 14:43
  #22 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: 1/2 Here & There
Posts: 26
A scale are on the starting blocks !
Full fare tickets at the ready
Another 10 % drop in the OZ
And they're off !
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Old 3rd Jul 2013, 15:11
  #23 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: hong kong
Age: 65
Posts: 1

When the South Pacific Peso (AUD) goes below USD$ 0.90 it enters the world of free fall. When it goes below USD$0.80 you will see an exodus of people descendants of those "hand picked by a Magistrate" plus a few "imports" to "God's own Country". They are not irreplaceable, however they will leave a large hole. Interesting times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 3rd Jul 2013, 16:18
  #24 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Smogsville
Posts: 1,426
April 2nd 2001

$3.74 HKD to $1 AUD

Please bring it on
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Old 3rd Jul 2013, 16:50
  #25 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Hong K ong
Posts: 233
@ Liam

I don't like the angle you spoke about housing. (U may be near the end of your career, but buffer up a little pls for the benefit of those below u.) Its a f...g struggle living in these times and this is the last fort, so keep the sharp up...
and avoid such talk.

With Housing I can barely justify living here.
Although some days with massive inflation going on (despite having had a long run a QE in the US) I'm considering locking in back home now already.

Recently I worry that when QE ends that inflation & prices will raise even more back home.

So if housing is messed with in anyway- It's a very easy decision.

SLS for 25yrs, its done already one digit changed from a 1 to a 2.

Anyway lets move this to AoA forum.

In the mean time
ANZ SO Recruitment is happening - Refer to Pacific section.
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Old 3rd Jul 2013, 19:04
  #26 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ask Crew Control
Age: 42
Posts: 242
I bet you a pound to a penny that almost none of them will leave, even as much I would love driving them to the airport. Money has nothing to do with these guys. Egos get in the way. At the moment they are Bloggs the Senior Check and Training Captain at Cathay Pacific or Bloggs the Senior Captain at Cathay Pacific. If they leave they will be Bloggs down the road at number 14.

The Cav
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Old 3rd Jul 2013, 22:01
  #27 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: HKG
Posts: 142
Be wary of our housing situation..the enemy lies within....

Two Russian men Vladimir and Georgi have been best friends for most of their lives.
Vladimir finally gets enough money to buy himself a goat.
Georgi is extremely jealous that his friend was able to afford the goat having wanted one for himself for a great while.
One day they are walking down the street and stumble upon a lamp.
Georgi picks it up cleans it off and lo and behold a genie appears.
The genie tells the man that he will grant him one wish, anything he wants.
Well the mans mind having been on nothing but his friends new goat thinks up his wish.

He turns and tells the genie. I have been so jealous of Vladimir's goat and have wanted one of my own for so long but was never able to afford one and now I have the chance to be equal........ I want you to kill my friends goat.

Be wary...human nature (and the nature of our current political climate) is alive and well at Cathay Pacific.

Let's fight to get EVERYONE on FULL HOUSING, or at a minimum, index the HKPA.

As much as it may offend your liberal friends, desire to go UP yourselves, and applaud those already there, don't desire to bring others down.

For those who are up there, FIGHT for those below you. Reach out your hand. What does that look like? It means expending political AOA capital to raise the tide. iCadets are members in almost full force, let's get them up!

Success for more, not equal poverty. (yes, any degradation to our current housing, would be tantamount to forcing a career change for many)


Last edited by ASH1111; 3rd Jul 2013 at 22:29.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 00:16
  #28 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 762
Success for more, not equal poverty.
Agree 100%
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 09:48
  #29 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Krug departure, Merlot transition
Posts: 536
Spot on Ash1111, but good luck with that. Just look at the reaction by many of our pilots to suggestions of fighting for housing for the Paris-based FCNs forced to HKG. No, he can't have it if I can't!

Sadly we are short-sighted: when given a choice between allowing someone else to reap a benefit and ensuring that no-one gets any benefit, many will choose the latter.

As we say we're I'm from, envy is a very ugly beast.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 10:05
  #30 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Age: 42
Posts: 980

The problem with the Paris based FCN is not housing. I think the majority agreed that if they moved back to the right seat then full expat benefits should be paid. The problem is the complete disregard for the seniority system if these guys received full expat benefits. It is not a case of if I can't have it then neither can he. It is a case of someone in HKG receiving full expat benefits as a CN out of seniority. If these guys moved back to the right seat then they would receive full expat benefits and a CN slot would open for the rightly eligible pilot at the top of the FO seniority, who would then be a CN claiming expat benefits.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 10:10
  #31 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: N.A.
Posts: 40
Totally agree, Sloppy.

The best thing about our last "pay deal" wasn't the pay at all. It was getting rid of freighter commands, or early commands or half-commands or cheap, lukewarm commands or whatever you want to call them. All they ever did was undermine us.

Last edited by dogleg; 4th Jul 2013 at 10:23.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 11:26
  #32 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Wherever I lay my hat.
Posts: 111
Excellent post, Ash.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 12:26
  #33 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Asia
Posts: 514
thread drift...

SloppyJoe is right on the money...Any FCN who wants to be in HKG can have full expat benefits as long as he sits in the seat his seniority allows...nothing more, nothing less...

Is that too much too ask...?
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 13:22
  #34 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: crewbag
Age: 47
Posts: 293
Right on, Sloppy.

Take their rightfull place with three stripes on the housing-included seniority list, and everybody's happy. But keeping their command - the one I turned down because of the crap conditions they accepted - is not going to happen. Period.

If they can't swallow their pride and accept the right hand seat then so be it. I'd stand shoulder to shoulder protecting their right to expat benefits if it wasn't for the fact that they are robbing me of my command while they're at it. Not the best example of the type of solidarity they cry out for.

Last edited by quadspeed; 4th Jul 2013 at 13:29.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 13:39
  #35 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Krug departure, Merlot transition
Posts: 536
...Any FCN who wants to be in HKG can have full expat benefits as long as he sits in the seat his seniority allows...nothing more, nothing less...
But was that not the whole point about the Paris-based freighter guys, they did not want to come to HKG at all. They were forced to choose between giving up their commands (which no-one -especially in CX- would in their right mind do) or not getting housing. As such it was a win-win for the company, as they simultaneously saw a way to reduce their crew complement on bases while increasing the number of HKG-based crew on local terms, sadly accompanied by barely-concealed glee by some colleagues still affected by freighter-angst.

However this thread risks derailing into another freighter-bashing vs. freighter-whingeing thread which is pointless. The big picture here is that there are basically two big attractions left to being a pilot in CX: the receipt of proper, indexed housing if you are in HKG, or a basing. Both of these seem to be in the crosshairs.

By focussing on our colleague's goat or lack thereof, we simply hasten the demise of the few remaining bright spots in our jobs (ie basings and housing).

Braced for the inevitable incomng.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 18:27
  #36 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Hong K ong
Posts: 233
@ main dog

I agree with u.

We should have stood bye that all FN CPT get full housing and stay as Cpt.
The big win is not letting CN work for less in left seat and not setting a precedence for local CN. ( yes u can whine and we loose some, but see the bigger picture )

EVEN better is to force those without SNR back to the right seat!! If not then as above.

But too allow someone to fly in the left seat for less is a failure for every single pilot in this company.

Unforgivable how 'stupid' we are at times.

We seriously need to think longterm stratergies as a cohesive and proffesional group.

How much synergy and guidence can we all offer to our leaders?

Stand tall folks.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 18:38
  #37 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 155
Good post Ash, however it took only 3 further posts to show why we will never unite.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 20:06
  #38 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Smogsville
Posts: 1,426
No, he can't have it if I can't!
Along the same lines as a 10,000 hr "cadet" can't have expat terms, he didn't do the hard yards and have 1,500 hrs when he joined.

Why do pilots always feel the need to kill the goat? Is it a symptom of a seniority based career?

Last edited by SMOC; 4th Jul 2013 at 20:13.
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Old 4th Jul 2013, 22:29
  #39 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2002
Location: up here, everyone looks like ants!
Posts: 956

FCN retain command on return to HKG? Really?

I disagree. Our seniority is the only thing we have left of an otherwise decimated career.

You're suggesting rewarding those who chose to CORRUPT the concept of a seniority based career path by PROTECTING their seats?

What about protection for the hundreds of FOs who respected the concept, waiting their turn in HKG?

Having been on the receiving (shaftee) end of the ASL debacle, I can assure you the major reason I chose to stay in CX was my OPTION to not fly freight (and sit next to a lesser experienced JUNIOR as his FO) - an option which no longer exists.

I've nothing to lose or gain by either swing of the pendulum.

I'm suggesting you set aside any selfish motives you may have and think of the greater good.

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Old 5th Jul 2013, 04:14
  #40 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,167
I hear ya buddy.

1/ seniority
2/ seniority

would you like to guess what 3/ is?
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