DFO Update and DEC's!!!
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It comes down to integrity and leadership
Liam - If an individual is trying to make a political statement,
it is still a factor that one would have to consider, re his
effectiveness if continuing into discretion. If my deciscion
was not to continue, then no I would not dob him in.
I am aware that some of my colleaugues differ, in that they
don't have wide enough shoulders, but thats probably due to
a spine deficiency. Incidentally, the Companies monday
morning reaction is not a factor I consider, Im old enough
and ugly enough to weather that.
So thats it, call me old fashioned, but its a leadership and
example type of thing. It's my decision, I carry the can,
thats what we get paid for. End of story.
CmGzlr (very distasteful name - no pun intended)
C&T - no and yes, depending on how you look at it.
Saturn - further apologies for the continued tangential thread divergence
it is still a factor that one would have to consider, re his
effectiveness if continuing into discretion. If my deciscion
was not to continue, then no I would not dob him in.
I am aware that some of my colleaugues differ, in that they
don't have wide enough shoulders, but thats probably due to
a spine deficiency. Incidentally, the Companies monday
morning reaction is not a factor I consider, Im old enough
and ugly enough to weather that.
So thats it, call me old fashioned, but its a leadership and
example type of thing. It's my decision, I carry the can,
thats what we get paid for. End of story.
CmGzlr (very distasteful name - no pun intended)
C&T - no and yes, depending on how you look at it.
Saturn - further apologies for the continued tangential thread divergence
Last edited by mephisto88; 12th Jan 2009 at 07:05. Reason: Speeling
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Mephisto88 thanks for the candid reply. Wholeheartedly agree that many CNs will take a different stance. Whilst not saying they are wrong, it is nonetheless something that we all need to be aware of if we advocate bringing industrial matters onto the Flight Deck.
I don't think this thread has drifted much... but if Saturn wants it back on track; here are some questions for him;
1. How has the Company's treatment of the ex-Oasis pilots breached his contract?
2. Has he applied for a Freighter Command? If not, why not?
3. The AOA did not decide to employ the ex-Oasis pilots, NR and GMA did. Why not write to them expressing your disapproval?
I don't think this thread has drifted much... but if Saturn wants it back on track; here are some questions for him;
1. How has the Company's treatment of the ex-Oasis pilots breached his contract?
2. Has he applied for a Freighter Command? If not, why not?
3. The AOA did not decide to employ the ex-Oasis pilots, NR and GMA did. Why not write to them expressing your disapproval?
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Just Say No!
At last count there were roughly 55 guy's in the "Q" for command on freighter. ALL are on the CX seniority list and have been here for some time. ALL were required to take and pass a PCA. All are Cat A'd. Most have been waiting for a year and have been told another year. The YVR argument does not stand as there are a number of guy's waiting for other bases including JFK. NR's arguments are for the the fact they had no plan for all the freighters and again fell into the sewer but came out with a trout in their pockets. If Oasis had not shut down they would be struggling. THIS IS A VILOATION OF THE COS AS IT SAYS NO DIRECT ENTRY CAPTAINS PERIOD. The Oasis guys are NOT required to take a PCA. They are offered DEC right off the bat. I met some of them during their interviews. The direct entry FO RAPID COMMAND thing is utter non-sense! Argue what you will but this must NOT be accepted and MUST be stopped! If we accept this why not DEC's on pax fleet on bases? You know their is a moral side to a contract as well. But CX does what ever it wants when it wants. Enough is enough. Man I hope the AOA does something and soon otherwise we need to pack it in boys and girls.
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
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You know their is a moral side
There has been a subtle change though. CX was once owned and run by British, Australian and American and observed the morality of those countries. CX is now much more a Chinese run company and will follow the Chinese moral code, ("Over you go, here is the bat").
The expats of British, Australian or American origin actually have no real influence any more, or do they?
Or have I missed something?
The expats of British, Australian or American origin actually have no real influence any more, or do they?
Or have I missed something?
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Cx Cos
As one with only great memories of my time with CX I am constantly amazed by the whingeing coming from some present day employees. If CX is such a terrible company to work for why not find another employer? Most of those whingeing have probably either forgotten the conditions under which they were previously employed before getting a job with CX, or else have always been whingers.
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....or maybe it -once- was a great place to work. Things have certainly changed, and part of the problem is guys like you advising people of what a great place this is, only to have them realize too late that things are nothing like the "good old days."
Most of us certainly remember our previous jobs, and gave up good rosters, seniority, pension and income to start at the bottom and make a career with Cathay; much based on the very advice of "Old Fellas" like yourself.
But it was advice that was 10 years old. Most of us believed that the company would honor their pledges when it came to careers and basings. Only to be met with DEFOs and DECs being daggered into our backs.
Most of us certainly remember our previous jobs, and gave up good rosters, seniority, pension and income to start at the bottom and make a career with Cathay; much based on the very advice of "Old Fellas" like yourself.
But it was advice that was 10 years old. Most of us believed that the company would honor their pledges when it came to careers and basings. Only to be met with DEFOs and DECs being daggered into our backs.
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Ok Old Fella - I'll bite.
Since you were with CX (retired?), things have change alot. In my 10+ years with the company, I have seen most of the 'gentlemanliness' simply disappear. And that boils down to penny pinching and COS degradation by a bunch of merciless managers out to make some quick bucks for selling their souls. FYI, my Uncle was a long time F/E and he just rolls his eyes back in disgust when I tell him the latest news - whether it be blatant COS busts (love the words 'normally' etc), 'interesting' interpretaions of COS or whatever.
And don't even go there with the 'if you don't like it bugger off elsewhere' diatribe. Most of us have invested a huge amount of time in this company. To give that all up and head to the bottom of the heap elsewhere is dumb. Any employee should have a reasonable expectation that COS should remain the same or similar unless negotiated changes are made. A sign or be fired ultimatum does not fit that description by the way!
I suspect you are of the generation that was able to call the shots, have the best years of aviation and have retired comfortably with your package and super intact. For that, I am very happy for you. I just regret not being part of that generation.
Since you were with CX (retired?), things have change alot. In my 10+ years with the company, I have seen most of the 'gentlemanliness' simply disappear. And that boils down to penny pinching and COS degradation by a bunch of merciless managers out to make some quick bucks for selling their souls. FYI, my Uncle was a long time F/E and he just rolls his eyes back in disgust when I tell him the latest news - whether it be blatant COS busts (love the words 'normally' etc), 'interesting' interpretaions of COS or whatever.
And don't even go there with the 'if you don't like it bugger off elsewhere' diatribe. Most of us have invested a huge amount of time in this company. To give that all up and head to the bottom of the heap elsewhere is dumb. Any employee should have a reasonable expectation that COS should remain the same or similar unless negotiated changes are made. A sign or be fired ultimatum does not fit that description by the way!
I suspect you are of the generation that was able to call the shots, have the best years of aviation and have retired comfortably with your package and super intact. For that, I am very happy for you. I just regret not being part of that generation.
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Cx Cos
Busy Bee, I sold nothing, just appreciated the COS I enjoyed, did my job and retired with my good memories. That said, there were however some who whinged and bitched, having totally forgotten about the conditions under which they previously worked and which led them to CX in the first place. As for those citing advice given by others such as myself as a major factor in seeking to join CX, that sounds like a "cop-out" to me. I accept that many have put a huge amount of time into CX and that things change. Maybe the AOA ought to grow some balls and go to bat for those unhappy with their lot, that is if the majority feel hard done by.
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On the bright side it will never get worse than it is now. When else will cx get the chance to hire so many pilots who are fo's for 1 day and fast tracked to the left seat? Am I missing something or is that just really direct entry captains called something else to fool you guys? Ha ha ha.
