Pudnucker

Team,

Run a very busy company and have an active old mind. Sometimes find it very difficult to get to sleep. I bought some one a night nytol that does the trick (its a fairly stong antihistamine). Have also tried the herbal one which is good. I don't use either if i'm planning on flying the next day but what is the medical view of using these and holding a pilot's licence (is there a recommended time (eg 24/48 hours) that you should be off them)?

Evanelpus

As someone who spent a long time long distance flying, mainly overnight, I too suffered from getting some sleep on a flight.

Until the day I flew from Heathrow to Moscow with BA. Got chatting to one of the FA's and she told me to try a couple of black coffes and use Baileys minatures as milk. I'll try anything once and it worked for me. Two or three of those and I was sleeping like a log, only downside was I was always ready for the loo as soon as I woke up!!

Try it, it may work.

skol

Try Halcion-low dose at first. Already put one post up about it but if want more info let me know. Spent 35 years long haul, 25 using Halcion to get a decent rest. First 10 years l/h were hell. Nothing like it.

gingernut

If you're keen to pursue the herbal route, try a camomile tea.

Tastes like sh*t but seems to do the trick.

Sooty

Highly unrecommended, not sure on the legalities. Believe it may be illegal in some countries.

Problem is the after effects. Traditional sleeping tablets like Diazepam (temazapam) have a short half life i.e. you don't feel drowsy 8 hours later. Still they're on the banned substance list in many countries and still comes up in a urine sample 72 hour later!! With Nitol and other anti histamines they still affect you a long time after. I know I have tried them and felt like crap for the whole next day!!

There was fatal crash out of Birmingham several years ago I believe with a Challenger. The autopsy revealed anti histamines in the blood stream, they put a large amount of blame on fatigue and the use of this drug!

In my company the cabin crew were issued a detailed bulletin (which I can't seem to find) about the problems with Nitol and similar substances.

My recommendation is keep away from it when flying!

A hot bath and a glass of red does the trick for me

Ali Sadikin

Can anybody offer any alternative guidance to aviators on sleep aids like :
a) valium?

b) Lunesta, Ambien, Unisom?

c) Melatonin

My AME said Valium is a no no, Lunesta/Ambien/Unisom requires a 14 hour free period before flight duty. He has no opinion on melatonin.

Slats One

Skol,

You have spent 25 years on Halcion?

The you are a very lucky pilot to still be one.

Go do some research man.

I have a foresnic medical research backgound, and some minor, flying skills.

Perhaps your most revealing comment is the, years , you have been taking it.

I mean this uncritically in the spirit of care.

Be well and best wishes.

Oh and even herbal nytol- which I use -needs careful handling over time due build up. As for the fact that some people pop anti-histamine based tablest like sweet to ensure duty, no- stop me now.

richatom

Like others have reported, Nytol leaves me feeling dreadful the next day and I no longer take it.

I'd advise also against remedies that include alcohol - alcohol is a stimulant and although it makes me drop off early my sleep is usually disturbed and I wake up early.

If need to get a good sleep before a very early flight I find hard exercise about four hours before bed-time is the best remedy. I have a C2 rowing machine at home and a half hour on that guarantees a good sleep.

In my flight bag I carry some herbal sleeping pills which I use if I am on the road.

kuntakinte

Sleep aids...well 14 hours is about right. My quack said twice the dosage effective period. Each dosage period lasts about 7 hours. Hope it really helps.

flower

Go to your pharmacist get a pill cutter and cut your Nytol in half, enough to help you drop off to sleep but doesn't leave you with the same awful drowsiness the next day. Of course should only be used once in a while and definitely not before a duty.

As a life long insomniac I have tried most things, warm milk , warm bath ( the bath should be about 2 hours before you wish to fall asleep) but no TV or reading anything good, find a most dull book that doesn't stimulate the mind . Also the room shouldn't be too warm or too cold. I also find a soft feather pillow one you can sink your head into helps.

Dea Certe

5-HtP is an amino acid which can be purchased in most drug stores/chemists shops. It's helped me sleep and has no side effects I know of. Also, L-tryptophane is back on the shelves. It's also an amino acid found in milk and turkey and why one might feel drowsy after a turkey dinner. My doctor told me 500 mgs up to one gram can be taken. It usually takes about an hour to work but the sleep is natural and no morning after grogginess.

Dea

Hawk

L-tryptophane is found naturally in many food products. These products may well be back on the market again, but please check with your general practitioner before taking this product in a concentrated capsule or tablet form. Regulations may vary internationally.

sitigeltfel

Use of Nytol was given as a contributing factor in the fatal accident involving Challenger N90AG at Birmingham airport, UK. The appendice in the report dealing with the toxicology aspects can be read here.

http://www.aaib.dft.gov.uk/cms_resou...Appendices.pdf

cats_five

My suggestions (do in order!):
1) 20-30 minutes walk
2) an enjoyable meal with a glass of wine
3) an orgasm
4) have the World Service on quietly on the radio

englishal

I swear by Melatonin. I use to to change sleep patterns a lot and it doesn't have any of the side affects of Nytol (and it works).

Dan Gerous

I have a lot of bother trying to get to sleep, which is mainly due to noise. I use those crushable ear plugs you can get, and that helps a lot, and read a novel to "tire" the brain. (A novel with short chapters is best). My sleeping problem is mainly due to noise, and the slightest sound can wake me. I don't know if this will be any good if your brain is just to active to settle down.
Danny

Pilot Pete

Got to endorse that. Get some exercise in. We are all sedentary compared to years ago. We (modern western man) eat different food (less fruit and veg), do little exercise and work longer hours on strange shift patterns compared to years ago. It is no wonder we don't sleep as well as we should.

Since last September I have been rowing on a Concept 2 rower, aiming at a target of 1 million metres by August to raise money for Breast Cancer. I do 2-3 rows a week (usually 10,000 metres) which takes just under 40 minutes. I then do an hour on the free weights and I have put on 9lb in muscle, lost some fat and look a whole lot better, plus I now get better quality sleep.

When I used to be in the Army I slept like a log. Try going up and down a few hills with some weight on your back, fantastic for quality sleep!

Can't fit exercise in? It is a lifestyle choice. If you watch 30 minutes TV a day you could do exercise. If you do longhaul take your swim trunks and goggles and thrash out 30 lengths in the pool before lying on the sun lounger oggling the crew! Use the gym facilities in the various hotels you stay at. Run round the big parks that EVERY city has. Its all about lifestyle choice. Do yourself a favour and exercise! Can't be beaten for improving the quality of your sleep.

PP