Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Flying Instructors & Examiners
Reload this Page >

New PPL Examinations Paper Release

Flying Instructors & Examiners A place for instructors to communicate with one another because some of them get a bit tired of the attitude that instructing is the lowest form of aviation, as seems to prevail on some of the other forums!

New PPL Examinations Paper Release

Old 29th Sep 2014, 13:37
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,823
And lets face it the cheaters which must include current instructors for them to get out so quickly don't really care about screwing it up for everyone else.
mad_jock is offline  
Old 29th Sep 2014, 16:20
  #22 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: EGYD
Posts: 1,074
I don't get why they don't watermark the papers with each ATO name or who the papers are issued to. They are obviously printing them on an individual basis rather than mass producing so that'd be a very simple first step to prevent them leaking.

Those whose papers appear in the public domain would be ineligible to receive papers in the future.

Also, the CAA has a vehicle for the exam delivery it wouldn't take much for them to deliver E-PPL exams.
In fact some countries get very confused when they get an application with the PPL exams signed off by a GR as most other countries the PPL exams are only administered centrally by the CA.
BigGrecian is offline  
Old 30th Sep 2014, 05:25
  #23 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,823
2 min job to remove water mark.

There is things out there that giggle with the wording and letter spacing to let you know where things are from but i would have thought there are to many copys to do it with.

As this issue has been active all the time i have been in aviation, I suspect its just an outright refusal by the caa to admit its not fit for use. And there arn't huge numbers of ppl's falling out of the skys. So apart from the sheer bad taste that cheating gives it doesn't seem to be having an effect on flight safety.

Back in 2k you could get a copy of the papers in the barras for 3 quid and the previous time i had seen them they came with a hooky copy of ms simulator in the early 90's, so its hardly a new problem.
mad_jock is offline  
Old 30th Sep 2014, 06:33
  #24 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Europe
Posts: 6,116
When the PPL Confuser first appeard it was a direct copy of the actual exam questions; the author actually obtained tacit approval from CAAto publish it; the person involved had never seen the PPL exams and didn't recognise the questions!

As for watermarking, very simple to remove, the CAA can't even afford maps, so I doubt they would move away from batch printing.

The answer is clear, publish the questions, that way the quality can be monitored and if prospective pilots learn what they need to know surely that is better than answering meaningless questions of dubious quality.
Whopity is offline  
Old 5th Oct 2014, 16:04
  #25 (permalink)  
B61
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 72
They could at least eliminate the byte-sized learning for each exam (followed by instant dumping of what has been learned) by setting just one exam, split into sections.

It does not even have to be 120 questions. Can just be 100, as with the PPAER exam in Canada.

Followed by an oral exam, 90 minutes duration.

This could be taken with any current ground examiner.

It would be best if each examiner was given access to an online portal. They could then login so the student could do the exam.

They already have this with ASPEQ, so it's not as if the software does not exist.

The overhead of printing out many exam papers is cumbersome and insecure. As a method it has really reached the end of the line.
B61 is offline  
Old 6th Oct 2014, 09:26
  #26 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 413
Most FAA orals last less than 10-15 minutes now with the same questions asked to every candidate.

If you think the FAA system is better you clearly up to date with the current reality of the system in use.
Don't talk sh1te. Mine ranged from 3.5 - 6 hours each for CPL/IR/CFI/II, and I know others in more recent times which are still taking a lot longer than 10-15 minutes. I did make a point of going to a decent outfit though, and not somewhere I knew I could have crap piloting skills and lack of knowledge and scrape through, simply by paying money - like most of the places in Europe that teach button-pushing airline crews, and not single pilot operating skills.

What I will say, is that if you learn at a flight school with its own DPE's, then it is likely the instructors there will know what/how the DPE's like to test, and enure the student is up to scratch. For example, they know that a particular DPE likes to discuss altimetry and density altitudes etc, so they ensure the student is up to speed on this particular subject. Obviously, the student must be able to answer any questions on the day, but if the DPE tests thoroughly, with relevant questions, and the students have a good grasp of these "more likely to be tested" aspects, then it's no bad thing. I don't think it's cheating either.

Obviously, it can be abused by the folks BigGrecian talks about, but I would suggest that such abuse is not as mainstream as he suggests.
sapperkenno is offline  
Old 6th Oct 2014, 12:37
  #27 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: EGYD
Posts: 1,074
but if the DPE tests thoroughly
The examining standard implemented by the Orlando FSDO DPE's is comical from my experience.

I would agree on the CFI because that is a specific authorisation which not all DPEs have.

The rest of the DPEs you can just pick those which don't bother with half of the stuff as long as you pay them. They meet at 8 do paperwork for half an hour because their all so old they don't know how to use IACRA, then they talk for 15-20 minutes and fly at 9. That's the timetable a lot of schools even use in their scheduling. It's comical. The idea behind it is great but there is absolutely zero practical oversight from the FAA other than their annual/semi-annual check ride.
BigGrecian is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2014, 11:51
  #28 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: York
Age: 49
Posts: 773
Has everyone received the revised papers yet?
Mickey Kaye is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2014, 12:37
  #29 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: UK,Twighlight Zone
Posts: 25
Nope. Not heard a thing about them.
S-Works is offline  
Old 8th Oct 2014, 08:10
  #30 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 126
Yes had them for over a week.
Treadstone1 is offline  
Old 8th Oct 2014, 13:53
  #31 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: EGYD
Posts: 1,074
Yes had them for around 10 days.
BigGrecian is offline  
Old 9th Oct 2014, 09:33
  #32 (permalink)  

PPRuNe FirstOfficer
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Surrey, UK
Posts: 137
First impressions? Are they a great improvement since last revision?
FirstOfficer is offline  
Old 9th Oct 2014, 10:37
  #33 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Europe
Posts: 6,116
The same questions, just less of them!
Whopity is offline  
Old 9th Oct 2014, 11:59
  #34 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Quite near 'An aerodrome somewhere in England'
Posts: 25,656
However, as much of the utter dross which could be deleted in the time available was $hitcanned, I gather. But some of the 'least worst' had to go back in as otherwise it would have been impossible to generate 3 x 120 questions before the deadline to which they were working.
BEagle is offline  
Old 10th Oct 2014, 10:41
  #35 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: uk
Posts: 929
I believe the process was outsourced, so why the rush?
BigEndBob is offline  
Old 10th Oct 2014, 11:51
  #36 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,823
Can you guys that are in the system and know the right Deptment to speak to please post who people should be contacting to find out where their papers are.

I have had three requests now for the pirate bay link for the papers from people reporting to be schools requiring them. And/or to just email them copy's

As you might understand I am not getting involved with that sort of nonsense. I haven't downloaded them or looked at them and certainly don't want to be involved in distributing links to illegal copy's.
mad_jock is offline  
Old 10th Oct 2014, 12:11
  #37 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: EGYD
Posts: 1,074
[email protected]
BigGrecian is offline  
Old 15th Oct 2014, 06:05
  #38 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: York
Age: 49
Posts: 773
Online Exams on there way?

Pulled straight from the General Aviation Red Tape Challenge Panel report: government response

The new syllabi will be notified to EASA as
an Alternative Means of Compliance with full implementation in the latter
half of 2015. This will be completed in conjunction with the introduction
of on-line PPL exams.
So it would look like they are on there way.
Mickey Kaye is offline  
Old 15th Oct 2014, 08:11
  #39 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: UK,Twighlight Zone
Posts: 25
Be interesting to see how online papers are administered and paid. PPL exams are a good extra income for us.......
S-Works is offline  
Old 15th Oct 2014, 08:49
  #40 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,823
Well i do feel that you will loose out bose but in all honesty its better if the schools have absouletly as little to do with the theory exams and results as possible. I know its a big brush but I have never seen them conducted as per the regs in any school i have been in. And the documentation of the results has been universally poor as well.

If they do turn cyber that is a huge blackmail stick which is used by some schools on students gone.
mad_jock is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.