The golden rules - to be a safe pilot
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shy torque
even before the efis/moving map displays and all the magic
I sat there over the overcast, with my chart on my lap, or in my favorite plane, in a very convenient place that the engineers came up with.
with cross radials, dme or not, I knew where I was and what places were suitable for landing within gliding distance (all engine out) or emergency descent for the myriad of reasons.
''fate is the hunter'' the hole of exquisite design...think about it.
if you are just sitting there, not considering options, above the overcast...even over the ocean and distance to shipping lanes...well good luck to you.
even before the efis/moving map displays and all the magic
I sat there over the overcast, with my chart on my lap, or in my favorite plane, in a very convenient place that the engineers came up with.
with cross radials, dme or not, I knew where I was and what places were suitable for landing within gliding distance (all engine out) or emergency descent for the myriad of reasons.
''fate is the hunter'' the hole of exquisite design...think about it.
if you are just sitting there, not considering options, above the overcast...even over the ocean and distance to shipping lanes...well good luck to you.
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Words fail me.
flarepilot... I just don't know where to start.
Just when you think the opinions on pprune couldn't get any more farcical or ridiculous, there's still someone out there left to surprise you.
flarepilot... I just don't know where to start.
Just when you think the opinions on pprune couldn't get any more farcical or ridiculous, there's still someone out there left to surprise you.
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Didn't say anything about not knowing where you are in IMC. You said;
Let's say you fly a 777 from Europe to Australia, are you seriously suggesting having a knowledge of all suitable fields, open areas, roads and waterways in mind for a possible forced landing along the whole route?
Let's say you were the PIC of that A340 that flew from Singapore to New York over the pole. You're over jagged pack ice for 100s of miles in all directions, let's say it has a thick covering of fog and you're flying at night. Would you find a good spot to put the aircraft down in a forced landing at all points in this flight? No. You wouldn't.
The "golden rule" the OP was after here is that as a professional pilot you cannot plan for every conceivable scenario. Sometimes you'll be called on to react. This really is very basic stuff.
even if you are in a nice jet, with multiple engines, there may be a time you have to land off airport so always have a field, open area, road, waterway etc in mind on which to land.
Let's say you were the PIC of that A340 that flew from Singapore to New York over the pole. You're over jagged pack ice for 100s of miles in all directions, let's say it has a thick covering of fog and you're flying at night. Would you find a good spot to put the aircraft down in a forced landing at all points in this flight? No. You wouldn't.
The "golden rule" the OP was after here is that as a professional pilot you cannot plan for every conceivable scenario. Sometimes you'll be called on to react. This really is very basic stuff.
Last edited by Artie Fufkin; 29th Dec 2013 at 01:19.
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artie
I gave you three examples of jets that had to land now...only they didn't and everyone died.
if I was flying over the pole and there was a massive fire in the cabin that couldn't be contained by the few hand fire extinguisher on board I know what I would do
what would you do just fly along waiting for everyone to die?
and if my ''route'' (gotta love it) was europe to australia I would damn well pull out some charts and take a look at things along the way. and in this modern world, I could just google some sat images of the terrain and take a look.
for many reasons I chose domestic flying, even though my airline certainly offers its large share of over seas flying.
and I even took out WAC charts and sectionals to familiarize myself with the world below me.
you can think ahead...that's what a professional pilot should be doing...and yes, some places you just have to say...sure hope I don't have to land down there.
there are two kinds of pilots...when faced with an emergency type one says: what do you think we should do?
the other says: this is what we are GOING to do.
so, fly along fat dumb and happy...type 1
I gave you three examples of jets that had to land now...only they didn't and everyone died.
if I was flying over the pole and there was a massive fire in the cabin that couldn't be contained by the few hand fire extinguisher on board I know what I would do
what would you do just fly along waiting for everyone to die?
and if my ''route'' (gotta love it) was europe to australia I would damn well pull out some charts and take a look at things along the way. and in this modern world, I could just google some sat images of the terrain and take a look.
for many reasons I chose domestic flying, even though my airline certainly offers its large share of over seas flying.
and I even took out WAC charts and sectionals to familiarize myself with the world below me.
you can think ahead...that's what a professional pilot should be doing...and yes, some places you just have to say...sure hope I don't have to land down there.
there are two kinds of pilots...when faced with an emergency type one says: what do you think we should do?
the other says: this is what we are GOING to do.
so, fly along fat dumb and happy...type 1
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Flarepoint you are being ridiculed because you seem to be suggesting that even flying at cruise altitudes of 35-40,000 feet at a ground speed of 550 knots you are sitting on the flight deck with a VFR map nominating suitable off airfield landing sites even though you may not be visual with the ground. I am sure I have misunderstood the point you were trying to make. I still fly light aircraft and when I am flying around I am looking out the window for suitable landing areas not consulting a map.
When flying an airliner I will always have an idea of suitable airfields en route with 100 NM range rings around them as a guide to glide distance. When flying outside of Europe I will always have open at the correct place the relevant IFR chart and note the sector frequencies should I lose comms but if you still maintain that you do what I precised in my first sentence then I make the following conclusions:
1. Your company provide an infinite number of 1/4 or 1/2 mill charts or you fly over a very limited route network. You could perhaps have access to electronic charts.
2. After a long flight you would be mentally exhausted.
3. Your efforts at PNF or PF would be more productive in other areas.
4. You have little excess capacity/time to engage with your other crew members.
OR
You are not a commercial airline pilot (other than a very small local operator such as Loganair).
To answer the OP question. I think most of the posts so far have been pretty sound and are regurgetated lessons learnt from over 100 years of aviation. With regard to handling non normal situations I would add gather as much information as possible from as many sources as possible BEFORE making your decision and don't be affraid to review and amend your decision if things change. Another mnemonic
D Diagnose the problem
O Options generate
D Decide course of action
A Assign tasks and Actions
R Review decision
Happy New Year to all regardless the size of aircraft and area of the world you fly in.
When flying an airliner I will always have an idea of suitable airfields en route with 100 NM range rings around them as a guide to glide distance. When flying outside of Europe I will always have open at the correct place the relevant IFR chart and note the sector frequencies should I lose comms but if you still maintain that you do what I precised in my first sentence then I make the following conclusions:
1. Your company provide an infinite number of 1/4 or 1/2 mill charts or you fly over a very limited route network. You could perhaps have access to electronic charts.
2. After a long flight you would be mentally exhausted.
3. Your efforts at PNF or PF would be more productive in other areas.
4. You have little excess capacity/time to engage with your other crew members.
OR
You are not a commercial airline pilot (other than a very small local operator such as Loganair).
To answer the OP question. I think most of the posts so far have been pretty sound and are regurgetated lessons learnt from over 100 years of aviation. With regard to handling non normal situations I would add gather as much information as possible from as many sources as possible BEFORE making your decision and don't be affraid to review and amend your decision if things change. Another mnemonic
D Diagnose the problem
O Options generate
D Decide course of action
A Assign tasks and Actions
R Review decision
Happy New Year to all regardless the size of aircraft and area of the world you fly in.
