Relationship with students
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Relationship with students
What kind of relationship do you guys have with your students?
e.g. do you bebo/facebook together? or do you do things with students externally.
Thanks
Charles
e.g. do you bebo/facebook together? or do you do things with students externally.
Thanks
Charles
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What kind of relationship do you guys have with your students?
e.g. do you bebo/facebook together?
e.g. do you bebo/facebook together?
We invited student pilots to our Christmas bash and a few came along, but AKAIK it is all 'arm's length' stuff as regards getting matey with students. OK once they're qualified, I'd say.
TheOddOne
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You keep it on a very professional and businesslike level. Students are not your friends, although you should be friendly towards them Remember, they are in your care, so do not do anything to jeopardise the relationship.
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Some of that seems a little backward to me. Romantic involvements no (well not until they are qualified). But to go as far as saying you can't become friends is a little far fetched. After all you do both share one common interest - flying! And it is likely that at least some of your students will have similar personalities to yourself.
As long as you brief, fly and debrief with them in a thorough and professional manner I don't see any problem with having a beer with them after flying or going to watch the football team you both support together is any great issue.
The student should feel that there is nothing he or she can't discuss with you and you both should enjoy flying with each other. If one of you isn't enjoying flying with the other there is a problem. Distancing yourself to much from the student can I think lead them thinking you are aloof and some sort of demi god or something. And remember you are not a better pilot than any of your students, just a little bit more experienced.
As long as you brief, fly and debrief with them in a thorough and professional manner I don't see any problem with having a beer with them after flying or going to watch the football team you both support together is any great issue.
The student should feel that there is nothing he or she can't discuss with you and you both should enjoy flying with each other. If one of you isn't enjoying flying with the other there is a problem. Distancing yourself to much from the student can I think lead them thinking you are aloof and some sort of demi god or something. And remember you are not a better pilot than any of your students, just a little bit more experienced.
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Geez, First couple of posters are a bit heavy! (IMO) Made many friends with students when I used to instruct. Still in touch with quite a few though I live hundreds of miles away. Personally I can’t see how forming friendships has any detrimental effect as long as you instruct well.
I feel that on a romantic level you have to be very careful. Students give a lot of trust to their instructor and it can be easy to handle the situation very badly.
Just my opinion.
LF
I feel that on a romantic level you have to be very careful. Students give a lot of trust to their instructor and it can be easy to handle the situation very badly.
Just my opinion.
LF
Dancing with the devil, going with the flow... it's all a game to me.
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Fact is: some instructors do click with a student in the romantic sense so far be it from me or anyone else to judge that! Most students are not pre-16 year olds therefore the professional responsibility associated with underage pupil scenarios is redundant here. If you teach the student what they need to know then you've done yer job. Period. The student is an adult and so is the instructor - if they then wanna go home together afterwards and make babies then that's their business. Not interested!
As for my relationship with my students - it's kept fairly arms length but we're out to enjoy ourselves whilst learning. But I've not yet had a student under my wing who I'd particularly wanna go and have a beer with to be frank! I fly and then I come home. I don't try to groom my students as mates - got enough in my private life ta!
As I said, I do have a laugh and a joke with my students, they appear relaxed around me which I like. For me personally, a relationship can be easily cultivated whereby you can switch to 'strictly business' mode as and when required. Leadership does not sit comfortably with some people, those types of instructors struggle to find a balance - that's a given with any managerial role unfortunately. In my experience, the instructors who are least flexible, least knowledgable and least amiable towards students are the insecure ones who cultivate the arms length relationships with students to avoid too much interpersonal communication work.
It's horses for courses most the time in this game and you find what works for you and your student and you stick with it. You find the groove and go with the flow. Next one walks in and it might be totally different..... for that given day. Nothing is ever set in stone, flexibility is a must so if some burd with big tits wants to ride me senseless after work then who am I to argue if it's helping her.... ahem...progress!
VFE.
As for my relationship with my students - it's kept fairly arms length but we're out to enjoy ourselves whilst learning. But I've not yet had a student under my wing who I'd particularly wanna go and have a beer with to be frank! I fly and then I come home. I don't try to groom my students as mates - got enough in my private life ta!
As I said, I do have a laugh and a joke with my students, they appear relaxed around me which I like. For me personally, a relationship can be easily cultivated whereby you can switch to 'strictly business' mode as and when required. Leadership does not sit comfortably with some people, those types of instructors struggle to find a balance - that's a given with any managerial role unfortunately. In my experience, the instructors who are least flexible, least knowledgable and least amiable towards students are the insecure ones who cultivate the arms length relationships with students to avoid too much interpersonal communication work.
It's horses for courses most the time in this game and you find what works for you and your student and you stick with it. You find the groove and go with the flow. Next one walks in and it might be totally different..... for that given day. Nothing is ever set in stone, flexibility is a must so if some burd with big tits wants to ride me senseless after work then who am I to argue if it's helping her.... ahem...progress!
VFE.
Last edited by VFE; 19th Feb 2008 at 20:07.
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The student is an adult and so is the instructor - if they then wanna go home together afterwards and make babies then that's their business.
As long as you have institutional authority over someone, you can't have institutionally sanctioned affairs with that person. You can, however, drink beer together.
and, for those completists who insist that the only law is written on tombstones.
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Personally, had a great Rappor with my instructors during my PPL which quickly created mutual respect between us and certainly confidence in them to see me through.
IMHO outside the classroom or aircraft i dont think it really matters as long as inside the student - instructor relationship is recognised and is respected.
IMHO outside the classroom or aircraft i dont think it really matters as long as inside the student - instructor relationship is recognised and is respected.
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On the romantic issue : captains with cabin crew, medical doctors with nurses,....so why not instructors with students. We all are only human so if a spark ignites.... But if this would happen, I would immediately no longer be instructing this individual.
On the friendship/social issue : in my company we are all for a long time far away from friends, family and comforts of home. So yes, we do meet, students and IP's in the few restaurants or clubs. And these encounters are also a channel to get feedback from them about their moods, feelings, etc... that you would not observe on the training base.
On the friendship/social issue : in my company we are all for a long time far away from friends, family and comforts of home. So yes, we do meet, students and IP's in the few restaurants or clubs. And these encounters are also a channel to get feedback from them about their moods, feelings, etc... that you would not observe on the training base.
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Surely guys you mean "rapport" not Rappor?? Or is this some guru I have yet to meet?
Seriously though, i tend to find that the relationship that develops over time with many of my students, is more of a mentoring role as they gain experience and qualifications and even when they are airline captains they still seem to ask for advice (but maybe that's because I am female and more like their older sister or auntie??)
Seriously though, i tend to find that the relationship that develops over time with many of my students, is more of a mentoring role as they gain experience and qualifications and even when they are airline captains they still seem to ask for advice (but maybe that's because I am female and more like their older sister or auntie??)
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Dinger,
theres no issue of an abuse of power. You're dealing with an adult who can make their own mind up about any relationship of any type. you're not clergy. you're not a doctor - you don’t have to stick your finger up their bottom - i can understand that that makes things more complicated!
that said, if i were involved with someone as an instructor, or as a student, i would fly with someone else, as flying is best taught in an atmosphere which is not clouded by other issues. thats just common sense.
i always wonder when i see stories of father and son or husband and wife flying a commercial jet. how willing are they going to be to dob the other in for being pissed, or for flying below minimums... And presumably they both ate the same meal the night before?!
theres no issue of an abuse of power. You're dealing with an adult who can make their own mind up about any relationship of any type. you're not clergy. you're not a doctor - you don’t have to stick your finger up their bottom - i can understand that that makes things more complicated!
that said, if i were involved with someone as an instructor, or as a student, i would fly with someone else, as flying is best taught in an atmosphere which is not clouded by other issues. thats just common sense.
i always wonder when i see stories of father and son or husband and wife flying a commercial jet. how willing are they going to be to dob the other in for being pissed, or for flying below minimums... And presumably they both ate the same meal the night before?!
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Since most students and most instructors are male, and most are hetrosexual (this is assuming they have the same sexuality profile as the general population), the times romance could pop up must be pretty limited...
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Most but not all. The exceptions include the classical Lawrence Sperry (inventor of autopilot) and Mrs. Waldo Polk:
http://www.milehighclub.com/about/founder.html
http://www.milehighclub.com/about/founder.html
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Different note
I heard a story about an Instructor who said to his student:
"When you address me you will refer to me as SIR"
This was thought to be a joke HOWEVER he was deadly serious on this.
*After hearing this, you can imagine where the student went... relocated*
Just thought I'd put it out there since we discuss instructors who are inflexible.
Facebook wise I have many friends both student and instructors. As student to Instructor we kept things at a minimum, rarely went for pints. On one occasion my instructor joined us for 1 pint since we finished our CPL test. That's about the extent.
To this day we are well friends.
As for romantic relationships I think it can develope HOWEVER one should avoid it. I mean you can't really be teaching someone whilst also in a relationship with them.
Better to reassign them to someone else and perhaps even in a different school.
1/60
"When you address me you will refer to me as SIR"
This was thought to be a joke HOWEVER he was deadly serious on this.
*After hearing this, you can imagine where the student went... relocated*
Just thought I'd put it out there since we discuss instructors who are inflexible.
Facebook wise I have many friends both student and instructors. As student to Instructor we kept things at a minimum, rarely went for pints. On one occasion my instructor joined us for 1 pint since we finished our CPL test. That's about the extent.
To this day we are well friends.
As for romantic relationships I think it can develope HOWEVER one should avoid it. I mean you can't really be teaching someone whilst also in a relationship with them.
Better to reassign them to someone else and perhaps even in a different school.
1/60
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As for romantic relationships I think it can develope HOWEVER one should avoid it. I mean you can't really be teaching someone whilst also in a relationship with them.
Better to reassign them to someone else and perhaps even in a different school.
Better to reassign them to someone else and perhaps even in a different school.
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About the same as they can teach them to drive a car.
ie it works for a select few but for others.......
I know quite a few instructors who have ended up in long term relationships with thier students. The common factor is that most of the students never complete thier PPL.
As for being friends with the student it all depends on the instructor and student.
Its a bit like other forms of work. Some folk become friends with customers and socialise with them others do not. Some solders are quite happy going for a pint with there NCO's but most are not. Its not wrong but shouldn't be considered normal.
ie it works for a select few but for others.......
I know quite a few instructors who have ended up in long term relationships with thier students. The common factor is that most of the students never complete thier PPL.
As for being friends with the student it all depends on the instructor and student.
Its a bit like other forms of work. Some folk become friends with customers and socialise with them others do not. Some solders are quite happy going for a pint with there NCO's but most are not. Its not wrong but shouldn't be considered normal.
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Can flight instructors teach well their own beloved, spouses, children, siblings or parents?
About the same as they can teach them to drive a car.
I'm teaching my 15-yr-old to fly and he's perfectly amenable to instruction. I can't even get him to tidy his room or comply with anything else, homework etc but he's a different person in the plane. I think motivation has a lot to do with it (on both sides)
TheOddOne.
Got a couple of mates who are ex students. One who got his PPL, the other where I moved on and he's still training, and he still asks my advice.
On the other hand, have also been teaching a (long time) friend to fly. And he still hasn't done his bloody Air Law......
On the other hand, have also been teaching a (long time) friend to fly. And he still hasn't done his bloody Air Law......