German AF: Testpilot w/ an TAC Airlift background?
 

Hi there,

I just went through the screening for flying personnel in the Luftwaffe and left with an outcome I would like to discuss here. The psychos and flying instructors gave me a clearance for the
fast jet track, however, the medics did not. Due to a Spondylolysis (=a small gap within my backbone), one disk in my lower vertebra is in a *slightly* increased danger of moving while under high-G pressure - consequently, I "only" received a medical for transporters.

Flying fast jets at the AF has always been my dream and now, knowing that this will never be possible for me, I have to make a hard decision (namely not taking the opportunity and finish my business studies or quit my studies and join the AF).

I would like to assess the opportunities I have as an airlift pilot. I will study Aeronautical Engineering and then go through the flying training, followed by assignments on the C-160 and, later on, the A400M (hopefully:rolleyes: ).

Do I just have the chance to get a TP slot with this kind of training? Could the appearance of my medical problem in my files (which in practice doesn't affect me, according to my doc, I am just rejected from the fast jet track for 'insurance reasons') prevent me from getting access to the "really interesting" TP flying jobs I would like to do?

And, please don't laugh: Do I need a jet fighter medical for the astronauts corps?:}

Thanks for your input,

Barnstormer1982

Barn,

I foresee a few problems. First off, although an airlift background is no bar to TP (at any of the establishments I am aware of) - lack of a FJ medical is. Multi guys fly fighters various on the course and therefore need to have the medical 'ticket' for it.

From a military perspective, if you have an appropriate medical, the right experience and the right quals then you can apply for TP. There is a lot of competition to even get invited for selection, you then have to get through selection (and the course!).

You need to pass a more stringent medical than FJ for astronaut selection. I can provide you some very detailed info on the medical for (NASA) astronaut selection if you wish to see the standards etc.

Is there any way they can fix/patch/mitigate your condition? It's probably worth investigating (I have no medical training so I have no idea).

Cheers,

MT

Hi Mobius,

thank you very much for your info. Yes, there indeed is a way to correct this problem via surgery, but it does not seem to be very advisable. I've asked my doc during the examination if there was any opportunity and he ended up laughing:

"Is there any way to correct this problem, sir?"
"Yeah, it would be possible by surgery. But I can't advise you to do it, given that you are perfectly healthy"
"Apparently I am not, otherwise I would get my FJ medical"
-Laughter- :suspect:

I will keep on looking for solutions and would be very pleased if you actually could provide me with info for the astronaut selection. Especially the no-go items in the medical with respect to spine conditions would be interesting....

The assessment instructor pilots in the AF said that I could, from my skills, virtually fly everything - too bad that a small missing part of bone is disqualifying me for that. I wonder: Was it god who took it away?:rolleyes:

Greets
Barnstormer

Barn

PM for you.

Try a different doc.

MT

It would be wise first to be a pilot, before planning a TP career. I know the german AF very well, and there is nearly no chance to be a TP resting on a "plan".

What do you think, straight into the TP job from kid and pedestrian to fast movers? Oh boy, check your attitude. Why should the AF burn millions to a kid that isn't interested to be a soldier on the military way, only planning a career? You should only join the AF if you want to be at first a commissioned officer, ready to make the military job in the dusty foreign countries. If the AF tells you to go to Osama-land, will you answer them, " No, i'm only ready to be a TP"? :ugh:
Looking at your words i advice, go on on the bookkeepers way.

:\ :suspect:

Sorry tecpilot, you got me terribly wrong. I am joining the military (after my service as a conscript followed by two years of studies) in the first place to do the right thing, fight injustice among the world and serve my country. Might sound rather artificial but that is what is bringing me back in the first place, preventing me from a civil career in which I could earn - with respect to financial rewards - way more.

I would like to discuss AF career possibilities objectively in this thread, and not have another of these endless "Soldier first" discussions. If I planned to join the AF only for own career goals, I surely would have been dropped out during the selection.

Apologies will be accepted.


Cheers
Barnstormer

Barn,

PM in your box.

MT :-)

doesn't sound like

:p :bored: :confused:

If you want to be a pilot and commisioned officer it couldn't be a question of jets or big ships. Thousends of rejected candidates every year have a better understanding. Unfortunately the medics and promoters doesn't also understand especially in germany with their strong believe only in digits and the newest science. That costs the AF every year some really good applicants written off by medics and some million bucks burned short time later to outwash "virtually" pilots during the training.

I've very little experience of the German military, but a friend (and one of the best Test Pilots I've ever flown with) lost his job with Eurofighter in Germany after failing his medical - as I recall as a result of back problems from a much earlier ejection from an F4, after many years of fast jet flying in the RAF since that ejection. Germany may be a little more strict medically than some other countries.

If you are shooting for Astronaut, Barnstormer, without doubt military TP is by far the most common route, and fast jet is preferred. But don't convince yourself it's the only route - the majority of the ESA Astronauts for example are in fact mission specialists, not pilot astronauts. Typically the background to such a person is:-

- Very good science or engineering degree
- Fair bit of flying experience
- Fluent English and/or French, conversational (minimum) in the other
- (Preferably) Doctorate in something experimental (not, ever, computing).
- (Preferably) Significant test flying experience.
- (Normally) aged 28-38 at application.

So, your approach, if you make it (and don't get too confident, for goodness sake) of an Aero-Eng degree + military (ideally test) flying is not going to do you any harm in that regard. But in the meantime, put 110% into both the degree and the military flying you are acccepted for, there is nothing "second best" about either career and the chances of being accepted by ESA are incredibly small, no matter how talented and fit you are.

ESA itself publishes a (quarterly?) newsletter on it's manned spaceflight activities. As a citizen of an ESA member state, you're entitled to it free and, although I've not looked for a while, I'm pretty certain you'll find details of how to subscribe on their website somewhere. Past issues have included a lot of information on Astronaut selection, training and recruitment, so you could do worse than find a library that keeps back copies.

And good luck with whichever career - there's nothing on your list of options that isn't rewarding and worthwhile, but probably nothing easy either !

G

Genghis,

thanks very much for the input. I will see what I can find out about the newsletter.


Greets
Barnstormer