Cessna 150 with good compression but oil in #4
Helping my AP do the annual on my 1976 Cessna 150M. Continental 0-200 engine about 100 hours beyond TBO. Purchased about a year ago.
Plane has always run strong and steady with no issues. Run-ups always with identical 50RPM drop. No hesitation, no sputtering. Oil pressure is always right on the money. Compression was all in the high 70's....76 - 78 (out of 80) and above. Same as when the plugs were changed in October of 2019. When we pulled the top plugs yesterday, I looked inside and saw some oil in #4 and that one plug was a bit blacker than the others, but not by much. Pulling the bottom plugs and #4 was wet with oil. The others were dry. No oil was detected back at the October 2019 plug change. Only around 25 hours on the engine since then. Also, the oil analysis from October found nothing unusual. Cutting the filter open back then and spreading it out found nothing. AP thinks it's just the ring gaps lining up. Can I have good compression and still have oil leaking into the cylinder? Your help and guidance is most appreciated. Thanks! |
I'm no expert on aircraft piston engines, but I've rebuilt plenty of car and bike engines over the years.
If you're getting good and near identical compression on all cylinders I doubt it's anything serious. I would guess it's probably just oil filtering down from the head and entering the cylinder via an open valve. If you wanted to be sure run the engine again and put the #4 in a position with both valves closed, leave it for a couple of hours and have another look. |
Originally Posted by chesterspal
(Post 10778465)
Can I have good compression and still have oil leaking into the cylinder?
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Originally Posted by wrench1;10779736...
Since you're over the TBO, which for an O-200 is pretty good, you'll probably start having other issues as well....
If anyone has overhaul experience with the 0-200 and can provide some guidance as to where the oil is leaking from, that information will be helpful to me. Thanks |
We have a similar problem with an 0-200 with 400 hours since TBO and the engine it replaced did the same. It doesn't seem to affect starting or mag drop. I am not an engineer and there are a couple of issues over the behaviour of oil that puzzle me. The second one is that, when we check the oil level when the engine has been standing for a day or so, the level on the dip stick is always a good half inch above the limit. When you wipe the dipstick and recheck, the indicated level is normal. This suggests to me that, as the engine cools, the oil draining back into the sump gathers into odd places such as No 4 cylinder head and the dipstick tube. We have found that, if we stop the engine at the end of the day by slowly winding the mixture back, we get less problems with oil in No 4.
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Thanks for this reply. Losing lots of sleep over this and good to know I'm not alone with this issue and even with a low time engine, to boot. Hopefully, we can both get some help on this forum to sort this all out.
Originally Posted by pulse1
(Post 10780031)
...when we check the oil level when the engine has been standing for a day or so, the level on the dip stick is always a good half inch above the limit. When you wipe the dipstick and recheck, the indicated level is normal.
This suggests to me that, as the engine cools, the oil draining back into the sump gathers into odd places such as No 4 cylinder head and the dipstick tube. We have found that, if we stop the engine at the end of the day by slowly winding the mixture back, we get less problems with oil in No 4. Can this potential uneven heat issue also tell us something? BTW: I get around 225 degrees F on cylinder #1 so this is not a very hot running engine by any standard. |
Originally Posted by chesterspal
(Post 10779797)
If anyone has overhaul experience with the 0-200 and can provide some guidance as to where the oil is leaking from, that information will be helpful to me.
Originally Posted by chesterspal
(Post 10779797)
TBO for GA aircraft has largely been discredited as an arbitrary manufacturer's figure. No longer used by the US military or the airline industry.
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Originally Posted by wrench1
(Post 10780631)
The cylinders on an O-200 have always been a weak link... if you can get a set of original cylinders to last 3000 hrs on a O-200, more power to you.
Not quite. While I don't understand what your use of "US military or airline industry" has to do within the context of an O-200, certain aircraft can legally operate beyond engine OEM TBO limits. I'm fairly certain my issue and that of Pulse 1, above is not cylinder/ring related. That the oil is coming from elsewhere. |
Originally Posted by chesterspal
(Post 10780697)
I never said these were OEM.
Originally Posted by chesterspal
(Post 10780697)
There are more scientific methods for determining when to overhaul an engine based on fact.
Originally Posted by chesterspal
(Post 10780697)
I'm fairly certain my issue and that of Pulse 1, above is not cylinder/ring related. That the oil is coming from elsewhere.
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If you were getting some blowback past the rings I would expect the oil to be slightly darker than the norm, did you reinstall the plugs run it again and recheck?
Although a lycoming have a read https://www.cessnaflyer.org/maintena...intenance.html https://www.cessnaflyer.org/maintena...intenance.html https://generalaviationnews.com/2012...ug-oil-fouled/ |
I'd suspect worn valve guides allowing oil into the cylinder.
Your compressions will be good but eventually the valve/s may not seat properly or begin sticking when the stem/guide clearances increase. |
Originally Posted by stevef
(Post 10781616)
I'd suspect worn valve guides allowing oil into the cylinder.
Your compressions will be good but eventually the valve/s may not seat properly or begin sticking when the stem/guide clearances increase. |
Usually, oily spark plugs in these engines is coming from piston rings(s). You may have good compression/blow-by values but problem propably lies on oil ring(s), not in compression rings only. Valve guides may be worn, but especially on O-200 you will start having another problems very soon. (sticky valves) You may also have rotated rings, and gaps are parked on lower side of the piston circumference but this also greates bigger compression lost if all of them are in bad position.
Need to remember that Continental valve guides are located higher than oil supply, oil is coming via pushrods and directed to valve head and rocker axles. Guides are hiding behind valve spring and its retainer, so oil is not flowing over them directly. There is oil mist and oil everywhere under rocker covers but guides are located in fairly "dry"-ish area. |
It's disappointing when a thread originator doesn't respond to advice and suggestions one way or the other. I've had this several times but this one will be the last. I've got plenty of other things to do, just like the others.
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