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Brexit and Engineers

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Old 25th Sep 2018, 20:33
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tux
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Brexit and Engineers


Any LAME’s here considering converting their licence from U.K. CAA to Irish IAA or similar incase of no deal Brexit?

It seems a popular transfer with pilots, how about engineers?

Discuss...
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Old 25th Sep 2018, 23:00
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Going on the information issued by the Government recently, I'm going to have to look into it I think. I work overseas (outside of Europe) for a company that has EASA 145 & 147 approval so currently recognises my licence and any training I do through them can go my licence. However, come March next year it maybe the case that it will be changed to a UK CAA B1 of which it is unclear if my company will even recognise. It will all come down to whether they generalise it as a ICAO standard licence but haven't seen any info from QA on it as yet.

The other questions is, if I did convert to another EASA NAA licence, do I effectively surrender my UK licence and any entitlement to a future UK CAA licence post March?

So, has anyone been down this path and any recommendations as to which NAA would be the best? It used to be the case that the UK CAA EASA AML was the one to have!

The CAA micro site is https://info.caa.co.uk/eu-exit/licensed-engineers/ for those that do not subscribe to Skywise.

Last edited by Tom Sawyer; 26th Sep 2018 at 00:32. Reason: Add question.
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Old 25th Sep 2018, 23:32
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For everyone's information, DfT has just published a detailed clarification of possible outcomes. As to the best NAA, given the EASA-wide standardisation of regulations, it's effectively down to which one is the easiest to deal with. I'd bet on smaller countries.
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Old 26th Sep 2018, 13:50
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I don't think we should panic, but we should be investigating all our options and be prepared. I have just looked out my CAA license cover ready for the replacement license which be issued (I believe).to cover all those who are resident or employed in the U.K. whose EASA license was issued by the CAA. The CAA are not noted for their alacrity in reacting to changing circumstances. Many people, who meet the requirements, have already licenses issued by the state in which they are working. But I believe that by March next year something will be in place, the U.K. aviation industry is not going to stop. I haven't worked in Europe for a number of years so I am not sure if going to another EASA state for a license will need some kind of residency or employer requirement, but I suspect that it might. Along with many engineers I have a foreign (non EASA) license, and shortly may have another. Will be interesting if they will be accepted by EASA land airworthiness authorities for validation
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Old 28th Sep 2018, 15:16
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Red face engineers & technicians

I want to write easa part 66 module exam, which is best training center uae ,please guide me
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Old 1st Oct 2018, 18:11
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The CAA is at least doing something in preparation for Brexit: On LinkdIn there are adverts for Part 21 Design & Production Surveyors to form a new section for the UK - I assume BCAR solutions for UK designers, manufacturers and test houses...and there are quite a few of those to convert!
I would assume that the CAA's initial response, once the future is confirmed, would be to send all UK LAE's a letter explaining what to do next - and attempt to avoid a panic driven mass conversion crisis (again).
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Old 1st Oct 2018, 23:41
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Originally Posted by sankara View Post
I want to write easa part 66 module exam, which is best training center uae ,please guide me
Quite stunning Irony.
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Old 2nd Oct 2018, 23:08
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Originally Posted by Rigga View Post
The CAA is at least doing something in preparation for Brexit: On LinkdIn there are adverts for Part 21 Design & Production Surveyors to form a new section for the UK - I assume BCAR solutions for UK designers, manufacturers and test houses...and there are quite a few of those to convert!
I would assume that the CAA's initial response, once the future is confirmed, would be to send all UK LAE's a letter explaining what to do next - and attempt to avoid a panic driven mass conversion crisis (again).
The mass conversion crisis because British companies and people stick their heads up their backsides when change is mentioned? Seen that and have been affected by it.
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Old 3rd Oct 2018, 19:08
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In the last change of Licences JAR66-Part66, there was a cross-over period of five years - the longest life of a Licence - to prevent people panicking and clogging up the renewal/replacement system....and it generally worked.

So, using that example, with a two year period the CAA is likely to get a bit bunged upIF the EASA folk don't reciprocate with a like-minded deal. (incidentally, it will be political pressure, not EASA pressure, that denies a reasonable deal in aviation). We all hope it won't come to that and a reasonable deal will emerge.

Don't forget that the writing on the website is about the WORST outcome.

I waited until my JAR license expired to renew/replace it the the new 'standard'. Now, luckily, all my Types are all lapsed so I don't NEED my licence like most guys that can see this...I can wait.
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Old 4th Oct 2018, 16:19
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can't do anything at present without giving up your CAA licence . You can only hold EASA from one country.
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Old 4th Oct 2018, 20:33
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Originally Posted by bvcu View Post
can't do anything at present without giving up your CAA licence . You can only hold EASA from one country.
Absolutely correct! and the reason it is not really productive to do anything before there is a decision - so why start worrying now...
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Old 4th Oct 2018, 22:25
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I'm betting it will be take a felt tip cross out EASA and add CAA...carry on.
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Old 4th Oct 2018, 22:44
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Nutloose. have you read the document?
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Old 4th Oct 2018, 22:57
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I have but I also remember the changes we went through getting the 66 sorted, mine only finally got corrected about a year ago.
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Old 20th Oct 2018, 20:56
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Originally Posted by NutLoose View Post
I have but I also remember the changes we went through getting the 66 sorted, mine only finally got corrected about a year ago.
Mine has never been correct,despite many arguments with licensing and somehow at last renewal they lost my light aircraft entitlement.

Be better if we actually get engineers doing engineer licences rather than box ticking clerks

Ttfn
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Old 20th Oct 2018, 21:48
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Don't forget that, before JAR/EASA 66 came to power, the internationally appreciated CAA BCAR A,C,E,X,I & R almost ruled the world. The new BCAR will undoubtedly mirror the EASA 66 classifications and rank as an ICAO equivalent AML - without the 'level' playing field of EASA vagueness.
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Old 24th Oct 2018, 23:17
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Originally Posted by Rigga View Post
Don't forget that, before JAR/EASA 66 came to power, the internationally appreciated CAA BCAR A,C,E,X,I & R almost ruled the world. The new BCAR will undoubtedly mirror the EASA 66 classifications and rank as an ICAO equivalent AML - without the 'level' playing field of EASA vagueness.
BCAR A regulations can be a lot more vaguer that PART M, PART 145 or 147 if you read them (and I have read them). Yes EASA have removed B1 and B2 from support staffs for Base Maintenance. You only have to walk across the road from your office to find out how that works. C Cert still signs off the check and B1/B2 staff do DIs, SSIs and any defects. Guys at A cert level can do the same certs as A guys on the line, but as approved mechanics. Their training across the road is no cornflake packet job, whatever the rampent geriatic ex L holder will shout. Line has not changed. Get a type rating under the changes of 2012. No active interest. You do the job and the guy that should oversign your OJT is trained to do so, company authorised to do so and is doing an ORAL examination of the task as you are doing. You do a list of 50% of every ATA chapter going. true it is not a Basic AML oral, but a good OJT type rating assesor should be doing the same as a CAA suyveror as his role. It is objective to the process, not subjective. British companies stuck their head in the sands and by god did it cost me. I have heard old skool BCARs tell me they blagged shite. And got away with it. Time will tell what happens and we will find out were we are with out people's bullshit and views of the past will be the same as the furture.
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 12:18
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Originally Posted by ivor toolbox View Post
Mine has never been correct,despite many arguments with licensing and somehow at last renewal they lost my light aircraft entitlement.

Be better if we actually get engineers doing engineer licences rather than box ticking clerks

Ttfn
My pearl was having a full group rating but in the same breath an aircraft in the said group listed separately with an airframe limitation on it. simply because at 66 kick off it was listed out of the group incorrectly as a complex aircraft and by the CAA's own listed definitions would only have attained the complex performance by having the wings sawn off and having it fired out of a cannon.
It was then later correctly added to the group, but was still listed both in and out of the group on my licence', Pointing out I could certify it under my group rating, the letter from the CAA clerks telling me you can have a full group rating but without all of the aircraft in the said group had my jaw on the floor, the if it's not in the group then you cannot have a full group rating fell on deaf ears until thankfully someone of late realised the farce it was and corrected it at my last renewal.

Ohh I wish for a simpler time when you asked the question what is its MAUW and is it pressurised and that was it, without having to refer to lists of types to see where it resides today.
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Old 25th Oct 2018, 14:19
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I just wish you could get thru to talk to someone who understood what you are on about. I recently tried to contact the Licensing section & used the email link direct from the website only to have the email doesn't exist message, got thru on the phone & after 10 minutes was told the email address on the website is incorrect it has an extra dot in it. Finally sent the email & got an automated reply telling me that it could take 18 working days to reply to a non technical question & up to 30 for a technical one. We pay high fees for this service & you wouldn't except it from anyone else you would just swap provider.
if this is the future we're all doomed.
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Old 2nd Nov 2018, 03:35
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I wish we could go back to those days instead of feeding the money hungry beauracracy......
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