VISTA ???
Official PPRuNe Chaplain
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Witnesham, Suffolk
Age: 80
Posts: 3,498
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If it runs OK in safe mode, but plays up in "normal" mode, I'd go for the "one driver at a time" test to see what's upsetting it.
Alternatively, do a "reinstall repair" where you start as if you meant to install the operating system over again (ie not the "repair console"). Soon after the offer of the repair console, it will tell you it's found an existing installation and do you want it to attempt to fix that. You do.
Obviously, back up your important stuff to an external drive before you do that (use safe Mode).
Alternatively, do a "reinstall repair" where you start as if you meant to install the operating system over again (ie not the "repair console"). Soon after the offer of the repair console, it will tell you it's found an existing installation and do you want it to attempt to fix that. You do.
Obviously, back up your important stuff to an external drive before you do that (use safe Mode).
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Chez Sprog
Posts: 493
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yeah, Keef articulates what I meant to say, but are too thck to achooaly rite down
Safe mode helps you point the finger as mentioned above. Of course, if it blue screened, you may have a crash dump & if you have that, you can run debugger to find out what's killing it.
Safe mode helps you point the finger as mentioned above. Of course, if it blue screened, you may have a crash dump & if you have that, you can run debugger to find out what's killing it.
Seems I was a bit premature.
It will crash in safe mode (BSOD) when asked to do anything too tasking.
EG backing up files to an external hard drive. After about a minute of backing up it crashes. Attempting to use system restore causes it to crash also.
I have the codes from the BSOD screen though, but don't know how to interpret them. Searched MS website etc but it's not finding my specific problem. Where do I find this debugger? Is it a generic program or is it part of the windows suite?
"Reinstall repair" looks favourite.
Thanks again for your continued advice.
It will crash in safe mode (BSOD) when asked to do anything too tasking.
EG backing up files to an external hard drive. After about a minute of backing up it crashes. Attempting to use system restore causes it to crash also.
I have the codes from the BSOD screen though, but don't know how to interpret them. Searched MS website etc but it's not finding my specific problem. Where do I find this debugger? Is it a generic program or is it part of the windows suite?
"Reinstall repair" looks favourite.
Thanks again for your continued advice.
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Chez Sprog
Posts: 493
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Google on windbgr or windows debugger & have a look here:
How to solve Windows system crashes in minutes - Network World
It can be a bit involved, but it's a great tool - provided you can stay alive long enough to actually run it of course.
How to solve Windows system crashes in minutes - Network World
It can be a bit involved, but it's a great tool - provided you can stay alive long enough to actually run it of course.
Official PPRuNe Chaplain
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Witnesham, Suffolk
Age: 80
Posts: 3,498
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I've tried many times to get to the bottom of a problem using that BSOD debugger, and never yet succeeded. I don't think I have the patience (or is it the luck?) needed.
Sometimes there's useful information in the event log; sometimes I poke chips and it crashes, telling me which one to unplug and reseat. Sometimes the reinstall-repair fixes it.
Most often, I describe the problem on a forum and a kind person who knows pops up and tells me exactly what to do. Once I've learned how to fix a particular problem, I remember for hours!
Sometimes there's useful information in the event log; sometimes I poke chips and it crashes, telling me which one to unplug and reseat. Sometimes the reinstall-repair fixes it.
Most often, I describe the problem on a forum and a kind person who knows pops up and tells me exactly what to do. Once I've learned how to fix a particular problem, I remember for hours!
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Chez Sprog
Posts: 493
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hmm, I've used debugger a few times & it's always shown me the path. One thing with bsod's sometimes the bsod itself will clue you in, sometimes the error report on reboot will.
For example, my xp box is bsod'ing every twenty minutes or more at the moment. When it goes, the bsod states atidvag2.dll has caused windows to stop working and the system will be shut down.
Ati eh? Bit of a clue there. Sure enough, disable the graphics card & the system ticks along nicely albeit with 1982 graphics. Point being, corrupted files can sometimes be helpfully named. Doesn't do it everytime, but a fair few.
With the debugger, you must, must have an up to date set of symbols for it or it won't work.
For example, my xp box is bsod'ing every twenty minutes or more at the moment. When it goes, the bsod states atidvag2.dll has caused windows to stop working and the system will be shut down.
Ati eh? Bit of a clue there. Sure enough, disable the graphics card & the system ticks along nicely albeit with 1982 graphics. Point being, corrupted files can sometimes be helpfully named. Doesn't do it everytime, but a fair few.
With the debugger, you must, must have an up to date set of symbols for it or it won't work.
Quick update..
Disabled graphics card driver, still BSODs.
Tried the repair install but got a BSOD during that process too.
Tried to reinstall VISTA, got a BSOD.
Next job I think is a complete format of hard drive and clean install.
Any suggestions as to why I shouldn't do that?
I have it all backed up now so there's no issue there and I have all the drivers.
I had a look at the debugger and to be honest it looks a bit beyond me.
Thanks again for your help.
Disabled graphics card driver, still BSODs.
Tried the repair install but got a BSOD during that process too.
Tried to reinstall VISTA, got a BSOD.
Next job I think is a complete format of hard drive and clean install.
Any suggestions as to why I shouldn't do that?
I have it all backed up now so there's no issue there and I have all the drivers.
I had a look at the debugger and to be honest it looks a bit beyond me.
Thanks again for your help.
More bang for your buck
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: land of the clanger
Age: 82
Posts: 3,512
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You will need to find the BSOD causes before you format/re-install otherwise you'll end up with a right mess.
Sounds definitely hardware related, remove and reseat the ram and all other cards, also lift the arm and reseat the processor.
If that doesn't do it change the psu.
Sounds definitely hardware related, remove and reseat the ram and all other cards, also lift the arm and reseat the processor.
If that doesn't do it change the psu.
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Chez Sprog
Posts: 493
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well I was plain wrong. My Bsod was reporting an Ati driver crash & turned out to be something (probably mobo) else.
If you're going over all ends up, try removing all expansion cards & rebooting, adding one at a time. Knowing you Turin, you probably have sound, graphics & tv cards on board.
If you're going over all ends up, try removing all expansion cards & rebooting, adding one at a time. Knowing you Turin, you probably have sound, graphics & tv cards on board.
Well here's the thing..
It now will only boot from the OS disc to the install/repair utility.
Have removed the two Ram cards (individually) removed the TV tuner card, only the graphics card now but need an adapter for the cable.
Now time for a stupid question.
When removing and refitting a CPU is it absolutely essential to apply a new layer of thermal paste between heatsink and CPU or can I just refit it with the residue of the original paste intact.
All the websites I see say to apply new paste, however these are aimed at building new systems or upgrading not refitting the same componants.
Just asking.
It now will only boot from the OS disc to the install/repair utility.
Have removed the two Ram cards (individually) removed the TV tuner card, only the graphics card now but need an adapter for the cable.
Now time for a stupid question.
When removing and refitting a CPU is it absolutely essential to apply a new layer of thermal paste between heatsink and CPU or can I just refit it with the residue of the original paste intact.
All the websites I see say to apply new paste, however these are aimed at building new systems or upgrading not refitting the same componants.
Just asking.
Last edited by TURIN; 5th Sep 2009 at 15:03. Reason: Bought some thermal paste from local shop. £2.99
Spoon PPRuNerist & Mad Inistrator
When removing and refitting a CPU is it absolutely essential to apply a new layer of thermal paste between heatsink and CPU
SD
Official PPRuNe Chaplain
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Witnesham, Suffolk
Age: 80
Posts: 3,498
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I would agree with SD on the paste, albeit if the existing paste is still soft you might get away with it. I've never yet taken a heatsink off and found the paste soft, mind.
Most Intel chips of fairly recent manufacture have a temp sensor in 'em, and that can be read by stuff like Everest (the free version will do). If that shows anything over about 60 degrees, worry.
Most Intel chips of fairly recent manufacture have a temp sensor in 'em, and that can be read by stuff like Everest (the free version will do). If that shows anything over about 60 degrees, worry.
Well, I took no chances and refitted my processor with fresh paste.
Interestingly, the temp shown in the BIOS is set at 55 deg and the fan is maintaining that.
Diagnosing this BSOD is becoming a nightmare as now it will not boot from the hard disc at all. Gets to the options page (Safe Mode, Safe Mode with Network, Normal etc) but will not boot from any selection, it just goes into a loop and returns to the same page again. It will boot from the setup disc to the install/repair diagnostic but it can not automatically fix the fault, gives an "error during setup" in the fault details list.
I can't disconnect the video card as that is the only means of connecting to a monitor/tv. I thought I had a VGA socket on the mobo but it turns out it's a DE-9 not a DA-15. (All my monitors/tvs have VGA DA-15)
So, it's either off to the repair shop or start purchasing hardware to swap in and out.
Much of the stuff on t'internet suggests conflicts between the video card/driver and onboard sound but my system has run for the best part of 2 & 1/2 years without major problems so why would it just fail now?
One 'fix' touted around the net is to disable C1E in the BIOS.
Another is to jump the CMOS. A complex manouvre involving turning the pc off moving a jumper, pressing the on switch with power off.........zzzzzzz
I personally suspect the hard drive, but that is just a hunch.
Interestingly, the temp shown in the BIOS is set at 55 deg and the fan is maintaining that.
Diagnosing this BSOD is becoming a nightmare as now it will not boot from the hard disc at all. Gets to the options page (Safe Mode, Safe Mode with Network, Normal etc) but will not boot from any selection, it just goes into a loop and returns to the same page again. It will boot from the setup disc to the install/repair diagnostic but it can not automatically fix the fault, gives an "error during setup" in the fault details list.
I can't disconnect the video card as that is the only means of connecting to a monitor/tv. I thought I had a VGA socket on the mobo but it turns out it's a DE-9 not a DA-15. (All my monitors/tvs have VGA DA-15)
So, it's either off to the repair shop or start purchasing hardware to swap in and out.
Much of the stuff on t'internet suggests conflicts between the video card/driver and onboard sound but my system has run for the best part of 2 & 1/2 years without major problems so why would it just fail now?
One 'fix' touted around the net is to disable C1E in the BIOS.
Another is to jump the CMOS. A complex manouvre involving turning the pc off moving a jumper, pressing the on switch with power off.........zzzzzzz
I personally suspect the hard drive, but that is just a hunch.
I had it set up to auto update from MS. So it is possible that a driver has buggered it but it all went pear shaped relatively slowly.
First noticed MCE freezing occasionally, then I had the initial BSOD which said "A clock interrupt not received on a secondary processor within the allocated time interval....Stop 0x00000101."
At least I could boot the machine at that point but it has now degenerated to "Uncorrectable hardware error.....Stop 0x00000124."
This latter stop is apparently very common and not necessarily a hardware issue.
I dunno, Anyone want to buy a shiny silver box that goes "beep"?
First noticed MCE freezing occasionally, then I had the initial BSOD which said "A clock interrupt not received on a secondary processor within the allocated time interval....Stop 0x00000101."
At least I could boot the machine at that point but it has now degenerated to "Uncorrectable hardware error.....Stop 0x00000124."
This latter stop is apparently very common and not necessarily a hardware issue.
I dunno, Anyone want to buy a shiny silver box that goes "beep"?
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Chez Sprog
Posts: 493
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I just had a look round another place & chanced on a thread with a guy who got the same bsod/stop error messages as you.
After exhaustive testing, removing coponents/software/rebuilding, he narrowed it down to the cpu or the motheboard. Swapped the cpu & the system was fine so deduced it was either the cpu or the cpu/mobo interface.
Either way, a few quid to spend to right things it would seem.
After exhaustive testing, removing coponents/software/rebuilding, he narrowed it down to the cpu or the motheboard. Swapped the cpu & the system was fine so deduced it was either the cpu or the cpu/mobo interface.
Either way, a few quid to spend to right things it would seem.
I think you may be right but I want to try a format and clean install with default drivers first. Wish me luck?
Thanks for everyones help.
I'll let you know how I went on.
Thanks for everyones help.
I'll let you know how I went on.
Guess I must be the other lucky one 
Trot around the globe with my Tesco £495 special running Vista.
I load and process Gb's of data daily with not so much as a glitch.
I remember well the universal whinging about XP being loaded with unnecessary bells and whistles, totally bloated they said. Lousy operating system !
Now of course it is the darling of the universe.
I think to many folks do too much twiddling with their kit and end up in deep doo-doo.
The guys that I know who suffer with Vista-itis for sure fall into this catagory.
Not making a blanket statement here just an observation.
PS. I run three machines, Win2k, XP and Vista.
No problem
Trot around the globe with my Tesco £495 special running Vista.
I load and process Gb's of data daily with not so much as a glitch.
I remember well the universal whinging about XP being loaded with unnecessary bells and whistles, totally bloated they said. Lousy operating system !
Now of course it is the darling of the universe.
I think to many folks do too much twiddling with their kit and end up in deep doo-doo.
The guys that I know who suffer with Vista-itis for sure fall into this catagory.
Not making a blanket statement here just an observation.
PS. I run three machines, Win2k, XP and Vista.
No problem
Official PPRuNe Chaplain
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Witnesham, Suffolk
Age: 80
Posts: 3,498
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My inclination (as hinted above) would be to plug in a different hard drive and see what it does. I have an old clunker 40GB IDE that I keep for such exploits.
It may need to have an operating system installed on it, but if the BSOD recurs after that, you know you're down to Mobo or CPU. I've never had a Mogo or a CPU die on me. I've had lots of hard drives pop their clogs (well, three of them, anyway).
It may need to have an operating system installed on it, but if the BSOD recurs after that, you know you're down to Mobo or CPU. I've never had a Mogo or a CPU die on me. I've had lots of hard drives pop their clogs (well, three of them, anyway).