QF Strikebreakers!
 

Here's a heads-up for all of those, mostly ex AN crew, who have been shortlisted in the recent QF recruitment drive.

If you were one of those contacted by QF in Sydney this morning and innocently asked if it would be okay if they forwarded your personnel 'jacket' to MAM for a possible two days training over the weekend and a subsequent three days work early next week then before you say yes, do yourself a favour and ask 'what th...?'

What's happening early next week I hear you ask? Well, not much really, oh, apart from the very real possibility of industrial action by your colleagues presently incumbent at the big Q. Say around Tuesday between, say, 0200 - 1200 hrs.

Think long and hard before committing to such folly because as surely as night follows day, as soon as you no longer serve a useful purpose they WILL hang you out to dry. Who will you have left to turn to after that happens, oh, only your friends and colleagues who have been attempting to pursue their legitimate industrial claims.

This isn't to say I have a personal axe to grind against either Geoff or Maurice. They have been kind enough to allow me to indulge my expensive personal passion....flying, that is! I only use that term because a job actually PAYS the monthly bills.

They are simply looking after their own business interests and hey, they've both got bank accounts to fill too you know, fairs fair.

Well, next week will be the time for us to look after our business interests. United we stand, divided we don't stand a snowballs!
I know that some of you aren't in a strong position and could do with the cash. Join the club. But they know that too and the best time to take advantage of people is when there is a weakness in the line.

Next week will come time to hold the line, take the pain, suck it up. If we don't do this now it will just be the start.

:mad:

Agree with you whole heartedly Alpha Bravo, however, how will Qf treat those on the short list if they decline their most generous offer. There is the very real fear that they will never get that "call" for training school if this offer is refused. Am soooo very glad that I am not in their position. Tough call for them. :eek: :confused:

This "very generous offer" , bear in mind, was offered with as little as 2 days warning.

Any decline would be understandable as most people holding down current employment would not be afforded much flexibility by their superiors, a predicament i am sure QF would understand and be expecting.

I dont want to fly, as cabin crew anyway, which gives me the benefit of viewing this situation objectively.

Pop quiz for you;

You currently work for an operator doing a job you dont really enjoy, waiting for a start to do the only thing that makes you happy,

Your dream job HR team give you a call and offer you a spot you didnt apply for, for 3 days of work, and 3 days of work only, which present a set of circumstances that at best are described as dubious,

If your current employer gets wind of this, its back to the enemployment office,

And if you do happen to take it on, upon successfull transition to mainline
one day , you can look forward to many years knowing how people who live in leppar colonies feel...

What do you do?? What DDDOOOOOOO you do??

It's all well and good to sit there and say "if they want it bad enough they will do it", but that B.C. is the very argument that has been the basis of people getting shafted in this industry from day 1.
As long as people take these appointments without giving serious considerations to what it may be doing to the industry as a whole, the good old days of flying, which I am proud to say I was once a part of, are well and truely gone.

?
 

Sideline....does QF offer people on the shortlist permanent anymore or is it like Air New Zealand where successful applicants get offered temp contracts and pray for rollover??

Alpha Charlie Bravo

I can see where your coming from, but can also see the other
side of the coin for the ex AN F/As, this is possibly their best/only
chance to fly again, and if I were in their position would most
likely go for it, and to hell with the consequenses.

One might be surprised just how many QF has shortlisted
as aspiring F/As and if the present encumbants are not happy
with their lot they can be replaced by people that would
be more than happy with the present pay and conditions.

Just a thought.

I received one of those calls. There is seriously no way I would enter into strike breaking no matter how much I wanted the position. My family lived thru the pilots dispute so i know how that one goes.

Anyways...what I would be interested in - is finding out more about what this is about. The phone call was very vague not much information was given out. I called friends working currently for mam and none of them had any idea on it either.

Furthermore I did contact the union who stated that this would not be a strike breaking situation...so I am at a bit of a loss and very confused as to a 3 day working contract.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Lastly given 1 days notice to uphold a 3 day contract position to then be put back on the shortlist to me would be highly rude of qantas to give you a thanks but no thanks for not accepting a last minute very sketchy deal.

If they offered conditions of pay...areas of travel..terms etc...and gave a little more time ..then maybe.

It will be very interesting to see where this one is heading

unions
 

This is slightly off the topic but I was just wondering if there is alot of pressure for cabin crew to join unions????

I work in QFCL and there is ALOT of pressure from union representatives wanting me to join...but as far as I can see there is no reason for me to join...not when I'm trying to apply for cabin crew.

Recent update:

I spoke with a current MAM casual who stated that they also had been given the call after the shortlisters were called. My friend said he wasnt interested and said he felt quite pressured by them but also stuck to his guns.

The union from what I understand have received severals calls on this matter.

The qantas person who initially contacted me on behalf of MAM said they would contact me back yesterday afternoon...no call has come since...and I hope they are at least polite enough if this doesnt go ahead to offer explaination calls to those they have weighed down with this...that would be the least they could do.

Somehow I dont think this will go ahead...but i do tend to agree with Alpha bravo charlie...think before you take this on board.

3 days contract work (scabbing) to end up back on a shortlist
with no guarantees and a lifetime of being blacklisted for being a scab

Vs

Saying no and awaiting the outcome.

I'm not interested! Sometimes your own conscious is more important than 3 days work with no guarantees. Think about it

What really irks me - is to think of what this industry is coming to.

The games they play with peoples lives!

Isn't the strike next week??? Are these people trained??? What does CASA have to say about this???

Isnt it only a stopwork meeting to get feedback on the EBA negotiations? However it begs the question, why do cabin crew feel they are worth more than all the other QF employees who manage to get by on what was it now 3% increase? :confused:

QF StrikeBreaker?????????
 

I am currently a Sydney based MAM casual who was called late yesterday afternoon from QF HR asking, if I was available on the weekend for a 1 day 747 saftety Training day, & available next week to do 2-3 day international flying.

Most of the MAM casuals I have spoken too (including myself) have reluctantly accepted the offer for several reasons;

Firstly, the lack of hours this month has proven to be very financially challenging. Most of us have less than 10 hours for the month, and it is now the 21st of the month with multiple bills to pay without another source of income!!!!

Secondly, most of us are trying to secure a full time permanent position with QF & feel that if we do not support the company now, then we may be jeopordising a future full time postion.

Thirdly, Some of the MAM casuals are currently on a short list to secure fulltime employment in Perth for the new Short Haul base, and are due to hear the outcome early next week. Again not a good situation to be faced with as saying "no" to Qantas may adversely effect the outcome of their application.

I am sure that you can appreciate the terrible situation facing MAM casuals. We do not want to go against our fellow Flight Attendants, but at the same time do NOT want to jeopordise our own futures. MAM Casuals are "damed if we take it & damned if we don't"

We are not scabbs!!!!! We are merely honest hard working people who simply have been placed in a terrible situation and wanting to do the right thing for all, especially ourselves.

And we should not forget the most important stakeholder who will be effected by the stop work meeting........our PASSENGERS!!!!!

I hope this will make people see the other side of the situation!

Strikebreakers
 

Wonderwold - crew do not think they are any better than other QF employess in accepting a 3% wage increase.

The gripe is that the company are expecting us to do more hours per bid period plus redcucing crew. This effectively means a pay cut not a pay increase!

MAMPOWER - I understand the situation you are in BUT think about the day you are made permanent (and you will be). The company is trying to erode condtions for everyone and if the casuals step in to help out the company you will only have yourself to blame when you are made permanent but have crap conditions.

We have to stand up to the company. The FAAA has been trying to negotiate for weeks and the company don't want to listen. Stop work is the last resort.

It's an age old battle tactic to divide and conquer.
As an ex member of the industry I am sitting back watching Q.F staff make the same mistakes as so many other now defunct airlines did. Striking is a useless tactic when you can be so easily and quickly replaced by a ready trained staff . There are heaps of Mam,ex ansett , compass etc etc staff who would gladly go in and accept your current award conditions and to hell with the consequences . Sad ,but true fact I'm afraid .

With d.j threatening expansion and S.Q still making noises about the aussie domestic and trans tasman markets Q.F could find itself in the situation of having to compete against seriously cashed up competitors , who have a fraction of q.F's operating cost base ,and within the next 18 months. Don't be surprised to see that the trade off for allowing Q.F to buy 25% of air sheep shagger is to allow S.Q to get their wish of an"open skies" policy in Australia. It will be really on then ! With shareholders to answer to Q.F will have to seriously address their operating costs.
And they only way to do that is to achieve serious wage reform. The easiest way to do that is to provoke a dispute , divide the workers and conquer them !
Don't fall for the trick . Make all the noises about being seriously pissed off about only getting three percent instead of seven , but for christ's sake don't put yourself in the position of giving Dixon the opportunity to screw you right over. It might cost you a 4% pay rise , but it may mean you still will have a job in the long term!

And I'm here to tell you that I wish I still had mine!

Subsequent to my original post I feel it is timely to remind some of you that I too am a casual F/A with many of the immediate financial concerns that some of you are facing and also with an eye to the future and that ever elusive permanent position.

For the record, I don't know whether I agree with the long haul F/A's for taking industrial action, particularly in light of the current global industry and the prospect of war in the Middle East. What I do strongly believe in, however, is their right to take such action should they feel it is appropriate and without the company attempting to undermine such lawful action by calling in strikebreakers. Be under no illusion, that is what you are, that is what you have agreed to do!

I too was called to participate and politely declined without being asked to provide a reason, which I didn't. Given the short notice, they were very cool about it, actually.

The $300+ for the training day alone would have paid my next car payment, money I don't currently have and can't hope to cover out of next weeks pay cheque, given the slim hours of late.

I'll tell you what I do have, however, my principles and the ability to look myself in the mirror each morning and like what is looking back at me. Compared to that $300, that feeling will be with me for the rest of my life. You can't put a price on that.

Far be it from me to pass judgment on any of my colleagues who choose to take the work. Some of your other colleagues may not be so charitable. If you feel you've done the right thing by taking the work, good luck to you, that's your right and your privilege.

However, one day God willing, you too will gain a permanent position with QF. One day, you too may be in the unenviable position of having to take industrial action.

Ask yourself this question. How will YOU feel about the company calling in other MAM casual F/A's to undermine your lawful industrial action and break your strike?

Leemo I understand what you say re reduced crew. There are many areas within the company that have had to cope with the greatly increased flying since the collapse of Ansett without any increase in manpower. I'm talking operational areas here. Do you really understand the problems this will cause pax with many missed connections resulting in Qantas having to accomodate pax in hotels etc, not to mention many missed business meetings or whatever.

I can appreciate the situation from the perspective of the MAM casuals, but there are a few things you need to think about.

Qantas Long Haul Flight Attendants are fighting to be recognised for the fact that since 25th Feb 2002, they are working harder than ever before. One Flight Attendant was taken off 747-400’s (was 16, now 15 crew) and 767’s (was 8 crew, now 7). Meanwhile on a 747-400 the competition has far higher staffing levels - Malaysian Airlines has 22 crew, Cathay 18 & Singapore Airlines 17 crew. In the last EBA negotiations Qantas Management agreed in writing to recognise cabin crew’s contribution in directly making an annual saving of $40 million (this saving will only increase over time). Cabin crew are asking for a 7% pay rise – which is a portion of this saving and is hardly unreasonable. If you were asked to work harder, wouldn’t you want to be paid more to do it? It’s not about wanting more than the other Qantas unions, it’s about being compensated for a specific increase in our workload. Management are simply walking away from something they committed to less than a year ago, a time when all Unions were prepared to help Management by accepting a pay freeze.

Secondly, I am sure you’ll understand that if crew don’t take a stand now, the next time conditions are negotiated, Qantas Management won’t take crew seriously and undoubtedbly, working conditions will deteriorate dramatically.

Think about the fact that by accepting these 3 days of work YOU will adversely affect the impact of the Stop Work meeting. If this truly is your dream job, surely you will want to play your part in keeping it a job worth wanting now and in the future!

Simply, all cabin crew need to stand together, whether full time, casual or part time. Poaching each other’s jobs is un-Australian and it will weaken your working conditions when finally you are offered a full time role as a Flight Attendant (which I really hope will happen). Do you really think that your role in strike breaking will guarantee you a job? I seriously doubt it.

Talking about “our” passengers – think about how important it is to keep these passengers safe. Qantas Cabin Crew have 12 days of Emergency Procedures training to become certified on their aircraft – how can 1 day of training possibly be to the same standard? Qantas prides itself on being the safest airline in the world – can you truly say that 1 day of training maintains this standard? What happens if there’s an emergency? Will people trained for one day be prepared? I know if I was a passenger or a pilot on board an aircraft during the hours of the stop work, I would be very concerned if I knew that the cabin crew were not trained to Qantas’ usual standard!

For the ex-Ansett crew – I can only say you’ve experienced being burnt once, the Union stood by you then and fought for your entitlements (who do you think got your long service leave, annual leave and redundancy entitlements), now it’s your turn to repay the favour. We’re not only talking about what will happen next week – be aware that this could change your destiny and that of Qantas Cabin Crew forever.

If you really want to learn the FACTS about this issue, I urge you to visit the FAAA Long Haul website – www.faaa.net - and PLEASE don’t accept 3 day’s work for a short term pay packet – it’s your future too!

ACB -
Good for you! It must be a horrible position for you to be in to have to worry about money and declining hours of work each week. Then to have this fast cash dangled in front of you.... Well done on refusing! You are not only securing the conditions of all FAs in Australia but ultimatelty your own, should you choose to stay flying.

I really do not envy the position that MAM casuals face but please consider what it is you are doing should you accept this offer. Consciencecalling has hit the nail on the head!

Ask yourself this question - Is QF doing this for you? Do they feel bad about the lack of casual hours and are they trying to help you out? NOPE - It's all about them......

Wonderworld - of course I understand this will inconvienience many people, but at the end of the day we have to protect our conditions.

'consciencecalling' sums up my feelings exactly.

Well said!
 

Well said consciencecalling and many others....

I felt it necessary to express my thoughts etc on this very important topic.
I too was called to be part of this and at the time of the call(informing me of two days training and a 3-4 day flight overseas and no other details) I had no idea that strike action was pending,after talking with a few people I was disappointed to hear that we were called to certainly sabbotage our future colleague's hard work & important stance that not only effects their wage & conditions but the safety of passengers.I did call them back and politely declined the offer of "short-term'contract".It's not to say that I was not excited & tempted by this offer,as I even arranged several swaps with many calleagues for time off and cancelled various arrangements-I eventually got a call back to inform me(eventhough I had called them back earlier),only hours ago,that I would not be needed.What I did not mention is that I am NOT a trained casual MAM f/a,I am only on the short-list.Yes I have flown before,but on a small aircraft for a regional airline and for this I trained 5 weeks,my emergency procedures,drills etc took me days to master(for only one SMALL a/c) so my question is this-how safe is it to provide only one-two days training for an a/c carrying hundreds of pax?Phew!Boy am I glad I don't have to work on that a/c hoping that there is not an emergency.Yes,I certainly empathise with the MAM casuals as some no doubt have only this work to pay their bills,not an easy decision to make.
I am too familiar with industrial action and the importance of unity & support as I have been a nurse for many years.I am hoping for a positive outcome next week and will certainly be listening out for news that my future(hopefully) colleagues have been rewarded for their hard work.
Good-luck

ABC news online
Fri, Feb 21 2003 9:08 PM AEDT

Union condemns Qantas's contract labour plan

The Flight Attendants Association has condemned a plan by Qantas to circumvent a strike by its members next Tuesday by using contract labour.

It is expected up to 30 flights scheduled to leave Australia will be affected when around 2,000 Qantas international cabin crew stop work for 14 hours over a pay dispute.

Flight Attendants Association spokeswoman Johanna Brem says she is concerned management is attempting to replace the crew with inexperienced labour that has not undergone proper emergency procedures training and security checks.

"Cabin crew are safety professionals - they have very extensive training and experience and we are concerned that if Qantas fast tracks the whole training, that people are actually not, possibly not adequately prepared and adequately trained," Ms Brem said.

"If you are a passenger flying on Tuesday, well, you have to ask yourself one question: do you feel lucky?"

Meanwhile, Qantas would not respond in detail to the allegations except to say the airline will be using professional Qantas-trained cabin crew to cover striking workers.

An airline spokeswoman says all the regulatory requirements would be met and contingency plans were still being finalised.

I heartily agree with consciencecalling. I have flown for 20 years but ****** me if I would feel comfortable being responsible for hundreds of people on a 747 after 1 day of schooling. As "cc" said, just who is going to be the cabin manager on these flights. I know for a fact that there are no casuals trained in the Qf CSM way so how do they propose to do it. :confused: :uhoh:

It is sad see the lack of morality amongst some people. Attitudes like some of those expressed here are those of fleas and leaches. To knowingly and willingly be prepared to destroy the future of others is just amoral. In time, if they are successful, these parasites will be complaining that their employment conditions, inevitably, have been continuously degraded and be heard bleating “We all have to stick together to improve our conditions”, pathetic. :mad:

I think that unity in this instance is the only way. Unity to stand up to the maurices and inform them you were not contracted as union breakers and stand united to not let them do you out of your futures. If you stand united you stand a chance.

I'm on the preverbial shortlist and luckily for me they called back to say the contract wouldnt go ahead. I'm not sure if this still stands true though for the current casuals working for mam?

I think in all honesty though it is fair to refuse an offer of strike breaking - I know when they contacted me no mention of strike breaking was made. If they want to hold that against you later then screw them. No job sorry is worth that. Even an airline job. Its unfair and dishonest

I know how maurice works and I also know that when ansett went down and they did interviews for the current shortlisters..all of the ex ansett permanent f/a were called up for interviews...only a handful of ex casuals were considered...and all of this after maurices promise to get them all up and working again. They really didnt even get a look in. They gave loyalty...they got shafted

Best of luck to all concerned. Hold a meeting for the casuals...agree to stand united...you will stand stronger for it in the long run. Sell old junk at the markets to gain some extra cash.

For any pilot who was involved in the 1989 debacle, (or for 77% of them, at least), there would be a dreadful feeling of déjà vu as he (or she) read the earnest cries of “don’t do it!” from those appealing for unity or to the better natures and morality of those who are being asked to fill in for those three days next week.

Sadly, I feel that there will be enough who, just like some now QF did pilots all those years ago, will be able to rationalise within their own minds that taking the one day of training(!) and the three days work is the “right” thing to do.

In my humble opinion, appealing to people’s better natures will get you nowhere in a situation like this, (a lesson I learnt to my cost some 13.5 years ago). What may have more effect is a gentle reminder of just how “right” that decision might seem some months later as one of a very busy 16 member crew, the other 15 of whom have all had considerably more than one day’s training. Unlike the pilots, it’s very unlikely that the stand-in crew will be left holding the fort when this is resolved, (however it is resolved).

On to what should be a very serious note, how in the world can CASA (or whatever their name is this week) allow Qantas to even consider manning (“person-ing”) their flights with cabin crews with only one day’s training? Along the same argument, if there’s a Qantas captain out there who is willing to fly with a cc with the level of training these fill in crew will allegedly have, it ain’t the Qantas it once was…

But it would seem from other indicators that that’s the case already.

Furthermore, if one day of training is sufficient, what has been going on in the past? An inexcusable waste (6 weeks training)? Shouldn't the managers responsible for this gross waste of shareholders money be called to account and sacked immediately?

Oh no, that's right, they are all sitting around thinking up reasons to justify their obscene bonuses. Right Margaret? Count the pennies (in the workers pay packets), and the (millions of) pounds (in the bosses bonuses) will look after themselves, eh?

It is a concern to see references in previous posts to “black banning” fellow FA’s deemed to be strike breakers. While I understand the need to stand together, you are appealing to people who may not agree with your dispute and are not part of your union to see things from your perspective and stand by you in your action. Yet conversely you will not empathize with their situation and accept that many simply can not join you in a unanimous stand. Threats of, “your name will be tagged with with no chance of flying with QF”, for not conforming seem contradictory with the request for understanding and assistance.

It would be very disappointing to see a long running rift in the FA ranks over this issue as occurred with the pilots in 1989 and continues to this present day, which is of no benefit to either side.

Stand united but spare a thought for those you may be too quick to condemn. Safety (or maybe lack there of) is the bigger issue here.

............................................................ ..................................

I'll add a little to this if I may, a sort of $0.15AUD from the moderators.

The language this post refers to has been edited out of the original and the poster warned (not Beer Baron.) This thread is being very closely watched and so far is generally OK, and people are debating both sides with a high level of respect. Obviously some lessons have been learned from previous threads on here and elsewhere on the site.

The moderators are not here to take sides but to make sure that an environment for debate is maintained where people are not threatened. Therefore debate the issues without descending into the rhetoric Beer Baron is countering here and your argument will be heard full force. Use any of the standard emotive language from now on, and your post will be deleted; we will not have threats made on our watch from EITHER side. Thanks for the attention.

CC Forum Moderators

I am amazed at what I am reading especially all this talk that a one day (10 hours) 747 course is not safe.

You are forgetting that all MAM casuals have already gone through the initial 5 week cabin crew EP course & are have attendned their annual /bi annual days & passed.

Like all QF crew, MAM casuals are operating crew and are certified in QF emergency procedures and like all Short Haul crew are certified to fly on 737, 767, A330 aircraft.

Therefore this one day course is sufficient, as all you are learning about is communication systems, Door operation, oxygen, equipment location for the 747.

All other procedures are already known as we are operationg crew already.

Just like all Short Haul crew were endorsed on the A330 aircraft recently. We all went to a 1 day EP course to be trained on the A330 and we don't feel that is unsafe!!!! That is because we are proficient with all the common procdures etc already!

I feel that this issue is being made bigger than what it should be.

MAM casuals are not QF employees and are contracted to cover uncovered work. No labels should be put on MAM Casuals just because they are covering flying that is available due to the fact that some flight attendants want to attend a meeting.

There will be CSMs operating as CSMs on the flights....Not all Long Haul Flight Attendants want to or will attend the stop work meeting...a situation could see only a few MAM casuals & maybe no MAM casuals onboard a flight during the stop work meeting as the rostered flight attendants may turn up for work....are they labelled scabs too??????

This is about choice.....I do not judge...if one wants to attend the meeting that is their right to do so...if a permanent Long Haul F/A wants to work during the meeting that is their choice....If MAM casuals want to be trained on a 747 & potentially get work and cover those F/As who want to attend the meeting that is their choice......who is anyone to judge what others do!!!

I dont think people were referring to MAM when they were talking about the 1 days training. They were referring to non flyers who were recently advised by QF that they were on a short list from recent recruitment drives. 1 days training for these people is totally unacceptable by anyone standards and even you MAMPOWER must agree with this surely. Although these people may not be in training due to the number of MAM crew willing to take on the challenge of international flying on Tuesday.

Another point to take into consideration is MAM are casuals working for a labour hire company. You made a choice to join MAM as a casual so if you are not getting many hours and cant pay the bills that is your choice please dont use this as an excuse when you jet off on Tuesday.

Another point to consider is how strong the union movement is in Australia and not just in the airline industry. You are working for a labour hire company not Qantas and the union is well within its right to make a request to Qantas that any member of MAM working on Tuesday never be instated as a permanent cabin crew member with Qantas for undertaking flying on Tuesday. You are not protected like Qantas employees willing to work on Tuesday. Also do you think you will ever be able to join the FAAA international division should you somehow ever score a long haul position? The FAAA have made there position very clear on their website what they think of MAM working on Tuesday.

The work that you undertake next week may very well help pay the bills but if you think Qantas or the FAAA or a large percentage of cabin crew will welcome you with open arms you are wrong. Qantas does not and cannont lose its 4000 international cabin crew and that is their priority at present MAM is filling the void on Tuesday and I am sure they will promise you this and that but if the FAAA and its 4000 members put pressure on the big Q to refuse permanent employment to the MAM crew working on Tuesday who do you think Qantas will go with.

There is a history of this sort of action by unions namely the building and waterfront so my advice to you is think carefully and than make a decision based on all the facts. Im not saying dont do it Im just giving you the other side of the coin based on what other unions have achieved even though you may not see it this way you are taking on the FAAA international division which is very powerfull please dont underestimate their power over Qantas when it comes to MAM and any other labour hire company.

From what I have read from the previous posts I sense a little threat. I hope this doesn't come to that.

I am not involved in this matter and thank god I am not. You are talking about a lot of people who have been out of permanent work for so long they would do anything to fly again. These guys are not in a position to say no. Think about when you first started flying. You would have jumped at the chance to do any flying and these guys who have flown with other airlines and lost their positions just want to get back there. They want to get their careers back and if there is an offer to do so, so be it! It may only be 3 days work but have you ever lost your dream job? It hurts and I'm sure you would do the same. If the only job you could secure was casual flying, and that is what they are, casuals, and you were offered any flying, because I know some are existing on 20hrs per month or less, of course you would take it. It's not about what they believe is right or wrong, it's about working to live. Hey, they need the money and they shouldn't be criticised for wanting to do so. How do you know if they said no to this offer their application for permanent work would be tossed aside. They dont know that. They want to do what they think is right for themselves. They are not permanent Qantas employees and probably have no idea what the hell you are fighting for. They just want their jobs back.

You have all been through a recruitment process, any denial of employment you have been given will be discussed and where does that put them, in the too hard basket and they may risk their opportunity of gaining permanent employment. "Oh you really want to fly but you turned down such and such an offer"?.

Yes it's a catch 22 situation, QF know they have people to call on, and if I was with you I would be with you all the way, but please dont bag these guys for trying to get ahead with their career.

Re the training, as MAMPOWER mentioned, a lot of crew are already trained in QF EP's and it's really only a version type difference. Yes 2 days seems short but I have done it in the past and it's not that hard. As MAMPOWER said they wont be alone as many CSM's are flying along with other experienced crew. You had a first flight once, they let you do it. But personally, if they are brand new crew, they shouldn't be crewing as primary after 2 days training. I agree with you there. If there was an issue with their training I'm sure the techies wouldn't allow the flight to go.

I'm with you all the way but understand the plight of the casuals.

The good news is the industrial action didnt cause any major disruptions for the most important people of all - the passengers.
:)

Avion calling (and others); so when these people finally land their 'dream job' as permanents, then the rat turns around and finds a bunch of people who would do the job for, say, half the pay, sacks everyone and replaces them with the even lower paid workers (who just need a job, and it's their dream job)- that will be OK with everybody concerned?
Think about the principles of what you are suggesting.
And, most importantly, do unto others...........

MAM & The Union - just a thought
 

In the current debate of MAM contractors being called to cover work for stop work meetings for Qantas international - a thought occurred to me.

Most of the current MAM casuals would be union members. Why cant the union help them out also in this situation and offer advise towards their members on this stance. The real stance of what this position would hold for the casual members. Wouldnt it be in their best interests.

Additionally - cant the union step in to suggest that this form of work is unacceptable for casuals to undertake - or that if they decide not to undergo this form of contract work that their careers wont be hindered by rejecting this offer. Or if they decide to take on the offer what the repercussions will be???

Look might be way off base here...but was just a thought that came to mind. I am sure most casuals are current union members and the union should also be looking after their interests here also.

As for the shortlisters - well that would be a different scenario as most wouldnt be current union members.


I do feel for the current casuals being put in this position!



:rolleyes:

airborne1

Below is a notice put out by the FAAA Domestic/Regional division on 21 February, 2003.

There are two seperate unions of the FAAA one for Long Haul crew and one for Domestic/Regional crew.

The union is very clear on this matter MAM Casuals or any other flight attendants for that matter SHOULD not undertake any work on behalf of any other union taking industrial action.

The MAM casuals that operated on Tuesday should have their membership cancelled and NO support should be shown to them by the FAAA Domestic/Regional division.

That is my personal view, some may see this as harsh but what we are talking about here are labour hire companies eroding the conditions of permanent employment for cabin crew.

MAM Casuals took the decision to operate now they must face whatever consequences may be handed out to them by their union.


LONG HAUL INDUSTRIAL ACTION

As members are aware, Long Haul Flight Attendants are taking industrial action in support of their EBA claims.

Members should note, it is the policy of your Union not to do the work of any Union taking industrial action.

Therefore, while Short Haul Flight Attendants are not taking industrial action next Tuesday and will work as normal if you are assigned, awarded or drafted to a duty that you are not sure is your work, telephone the Association.

While it is understood that MAM Flight Attendants have had little or no work lately, it is our expectation that members should comply with our Union policy.

It was a Stop Work, not a "Strike" that was taken.
Please clarify this as there is a difference in industrial terms.
The contract workers or MAM Casuals should not then be considered "Strike-Breakers".

Thanks for clarifying that galleyhag.


The company I am working for is also looking towards implementing casuals into our workforce also....sorry to say but I hope for this exact reason it doesnt go ahead.

No offense to any current casuals - the offense is at the management for putting you into this position. It shouldnt be allowed.

hello everyone,

the latest news I have heard is that QF are contacting shortlisted staff and training them up for intl f/a duties..this is to cover anymore strike action that may happen.. shortlisters contacted on saturday night..training is for about 7 days 12 hour days

Just spoke to a friend of mine who told me this.QF hired a lear-jet to go from Mel-Syd to pick up 8 MAM FAs and fly to Drw.On arrival in Drw,MAM FAs not required so back to Syd they went.Then the Lear-Jet had to go back to Mel. I, After some research found out that the cheapest Lear-Jet is about $2.500 per hour.Give or take a few $ what did this cost QF.Not much change out of $30.000 plus.What a F^#king waste of money.Have a think about that.However these little stories always stay in-doors.This came from a true source.