Having made that statement, now provide the evidence and the link to substantiate that remark.

The communication from the trade unions states that a joint meeting was held with BA on thursday.All unions representing the combined workforces and management proposed several "temporary" measures to help BA through ,what is a "temporary" financial downturn,covering the next 2 years.This was approved by all unions,with the exception of BALPA.I find this hard to understand,as at times like this,a united position carries a lot more weight than a fragmented one.The proposals suggested an equal sharing of temporary cost savings across all departments,a fair position in my opinion.The unions are awaiting BA's response to their proposal,let's hope a sensible compromise can be agreed upon.

I understand from someone whom was there that WW chose to leave with the words

BALPA were not made privy to the UNITEs ideas prior to the meeting so a bit difficult to give them a blank cheque in terms of support.

Any more untruths from the BASSA forum you wish to be quashed bermudatriangle?

Can anybody give an accurate account of the process of benchmarking and list the factors taken into account in arriving at the figure the company then takes forward to the union meeting please?

You need to know the result of Benchmarking before you propose it as a negotiating tool.

Gaz

So what is BALPAs position regarding BAs proposals? I find it incredible that UNITE and the GMB did not brief BALPA in advance. How difficult can it be to ensure all parties attending a workng group are prepared?

QRS, You assume cooperation exists then?

No, I'm not assuming anything. Cooperation probably only exists when it suits. The only assumption I am making is that Da Dog's post is accurate.
That being the case, cooperation or not, GMB and UNITE would have nothing to lose by keeping BALPA in the picture. Whether BALPA then choose to offer their support....that's another matter.

British Airways has been voted the UK's most trusted airline.

In an annual survey by Reader's Digest, BA comfortably beat Virgin


From the Mail on Sunday (April12). If it is in the RD it must be right!

The Unite proposals to BA didn't include proposals for the pilots, so it would be difficult for Balpa to make public support for proposals specific to other work groups only.

Balpa don't negotiate through the BATUC anyway.

A different spin
 

Lets forget, for a moment that we're talking about BA.

Lets pretend we all work for 'Waterstones' for example.

You've worked there for 10 years or so. Very diligently.

Your bosses (whom are paid to manage the business) make several c***-ups (all the time actually) that end up costing the business nearly £500m. - between opening up a new store that goes t**s up and then gets a fine for not operating ethically. This is also PR disaster and the company is disgraced.

He calls you in, as says 'we've gotta save money' so I'm gonna cut you wages by £500 A MONTH forever. Other departments will suffer a pay freeze for a couple of years, but your changes will be permanent.

Would you say 'hey great idea' or would you defend your position?

A simple yes or no answer will do.

:sad:

If that were what is happening I would say no - but it isn't and I think you know that really.

WORLD'S BEST CABIN STAFF 2009
Rank
Airline
1
Malaysia Airlines
2
Asiana Airlines
3
Thai Airways
4
Singapore Airlines
5
Cathay Pacific

© Skytrax


That aside really as has been mentioned these are kinda irrelevant awards - however for a fact all the crew on that list do their jobs for a lot less than either of the two old fleets at LHR.

But as has been said this isn't a debate over how much you get paid it is a debate about how efficient you are as employees.

EF don't work hard enough ona a day to day basis though are efficient during disruption. WW are the opposite - this is what the company have said and what to be honest nobody can argue with - solution change this and then maybe the other departments' staff may be more behind your cause.

Da Dog, what are we supposed to do? Accept it? If they were gunning for the pilots in the same fashion, I doubt you would all lay over and why should you?

Even without BASSA preaching, the writting is on the wall mate. 'New Fleet'. New contract. We've all seen the offer. 'Take it or leave it'. It doesn't take a genius to work it out.

EYXW,has it occured to you that the cost of living in malaysia or thailand is a world apart from the southeast of England ??Comparing who is best at what and where from has many factors to consider.Service industries in asia generally offer exceptional standards,as they pride themselves on the service model.However,to then suggest that they perform their duties at a lower rate of pay than employees in the UK might require, has no bearing on the arguement.If employee costs were a top priority,no company would employ anyone in the UK,France,Germany,USA,Italy,Ireland,the list just goes on and on.The only employees would be from third world or developing countries,clearly ludicrous.We have to accept that living and working in the western, major economies is expensive,for both employees and employers.The system works so long as the cash circulates,be it at the top end of the market.Currently that cash flow is dwindling,with the serious effects we are all witnessing.That cash flow will eventually return and my hope is that BA employees have not been reduced to rates of pay that make living in the UK,virtually impossible.

Crunchy.. your posting is spot on!

EYXW.. :hmm:

If that were what is happening I would say no - but it isn't and I think you know that really.

What isn`t happening then? Tell me what you think is happening then?
as for skytrax :bored:

Productivity and Crew efficiency, is based on many factors i.e. -trip planning, flight timings, scheduling and trip software used, and not forgetting the skill base used to produce the rosters.

CC should not be blamed for productivity, which is currently out of their control, and could vastly be improved by those in charge.

As for outdated contracts. There are many CC contracts within the BA folder. The longer you have been in service, the more restrictive and better paid the contract tends to be. These contracts will all disappear with time. Nevertheless CC recruited in the last 7 years do not enjoy such spoils, and these new contracts do allow for alot of flexiability to the employer. The basic is very low. CC are very dependent on allowances to support their income.

WW and Management, have not offered the CC Community a reasonable alternative payment system. Instead found ways to destroy the goodwill of the CC, and it is quite obvious, they are going to try change T&C's at any cost. SO... YES.. I DO SUPPORT BASSA :ok:, who else is going to look after us. Crunchy is right. I say NO to unreasonable offers.

Industrial Action may follow, but it is not the CC spoiling for a fight. Most CC do not wish any form of Industrial Action, but they do wish to be able to afford a roof over their head and food on the table, a wage above the breadline.


BEST CABIN STAFF RESULTS - BY WORLD REGIONS - Western Europe

1. British Airways - Skytrax 2009 :)

The current industrial agreement on EF, is not the ' big bug bear'. It is a set of mostly reasonable rules set to protect the CC from being over worked, to ensure the well being and safety of everyone onboard. Many trips which have one sector out and one back the following day, with no links, is not a result of the IA preventing the crew from being able to continue, but rather 'poor trip planning'. Yes, Carmen will roster you 900 hours, if that is the parameter , it will also roster 700 if programmed to do so. Hours are rostered according to work available and crew at hand. Industrial Agreement allows an individual crew to be rostered upto 60 hours in a week.. it is hardly restrictive.

That is in BA's hands, it could give them serverance, it managed to give
it's managers a golden handshake.

That is where my friend you are sadly mistaken, and I need to take your blindfold off... Our salary is very much minimum wage.

As for meaningful change. Reducing crew heads, will not fix missing bags, solve open skies, or improve customer service. As long as the bean counters run the airlines, the customer will suffer. But enough said.
I am not in control, As you rightly said BASSA, will determine my future.

Flying or duty hours?

From both sides of the table that is an interesting thought.....