PPRuNe Forums - Safety equipment "missing"?

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Safety equipment "missing"?

Would someone kindly confirm from a FA perspective if I have misunderstood something.

I was under the impression that EVERY passenger, whether infant or adult, had to have a safety belt of some description and a life vest of some description for flights (and where they go over water).

On two flights now with a 10 month old child using a Western European full service carrier between two major cities the same carrier has said that they do not have lap belts ("just hold the child") or life vests (no comment given over this, but other carriers normally come up with a little bag ready).

Different routes, same carrier, all in the space of a week.

I thought this was against the rules (it is certainly against common sense) and we have never experienced this with other carriers, both domestic and international in several countries.

I have deliberately not revealed the identity of the carrier here or routings but feel that if my opinion is correct I must report this as I felt very unhappy with the situation in question (but being stranded in other countries from home is also not viable).

Thanks in advance!

I am aware that not all airlines issue infant seatbelts, most notably those based in the USA, but it's quite unusual for a European carrier.

As for lifejackets, was just one missing or were there none on the entire aircraft?

Thanks. If a moderator wishes I can reveal the identity but don't want to come in guns blazing.

Lifevests, just no infant vests. I guess there were adult vests but naturally didn't start fumbling under the seat and pulling things out!

Not all airlines use the infant seat belt. There is an open debate over whether they are effective or not. Different studies show different data, so it depends on the airline which one they want to believe. I´ve recently read an article based on a study (based on research) claiming that infant seat belts can do more damage than anything. This because when a pax holding a baby fastened with an ISB is thrown forward with the impact, it will crush the little thing causing more damage than the impact would have.
There are EU carriers (I believe one is LH but correct me if I´m wrong) that don´t use ISB basing this decision on this kind of studies.

Thanks. The odd thing is that Finnair have been very proactive in giving the lifejacket. Maybe that was an abberation or to show they had them !

Thank you for the clarification that it is not mandatory. The carrier in question may be relegated on my list in this case until the infant is in its own seat and stool (AIUI "car seats" open a world of worms as well).

I don't know whether the belts are helpful. They always look flimsy but I guess anything is better if the pilot has to brake suddenly. After all, even at coming to gate people can come off balance with light braking and people are told they cannot have books etc by some FAs on TO/landing due to the risk of things flying around the cabin. I would have thought a 9kg infant would not be the best thing to have flying around for both infant and passengers.

Again ! My thanks.

Luoto

Quote:

Maybe that was an abberation or to show they had them

I don´t think so luoto :) As others have pointed out, it is just that there is not a standard for giving the infant life jackets. The majority of the airlines will rather do it in case of emergency, but some still prefer to give them systematically together with the ISB.

As for the ISB, in the end I think that it depends on what kind of emergency you are more likely to encounter, because if it is proven that it will save the infant`s life in most cases, in others cases it could be dangerous. So it comes down to what the airline will decide in the end to be the best solution.

The following is some information drawn from a report conducted for the German CAA that outlines what flyblue was speaking of...

Quote:

JAR-OPS 1.320 and 1.730 outline, among other things, the transportation of infants and children. The provisions allow multiple occupancy of aircraft passenger seats. Accordingly, infants (< 2 years) are properly transported on an adult's lap. JAR OPS 1.730 further regulates that an operator is only allowed to operate an aircraft if he or she provides an additional loop belt or other restraint device for each infant.
*
For the transportation of infants on an adult's lap, the adult is restrained with a pelvic belt, and the infant is fixed on the adult's lap with an additional loop belt.
*
In a suddenly occurring deceleration in the longitudinal aircraft axis, the adult and the infant show a pronounced jack-knife effect. The upper torso and the lower extremities of the infant as well as of the adult sitting behind the infant fold up in a forward direction, with the loop belt restraining the infant. Finally, the loop belt drives into the infant's abdomen and only stops at his or her vertebral spine. From the technical point of view, the infant acts like an energy absorption element for the adult; the crash loads acting on the adult are thus reduced, and the infant fixed with the loop belt thus suffers most serious up to fatal injuries.

Examination on the Enhancement of Cabin Safety for Infants

In the US there are definately no loop belts for infants. The child under two is held on the passenger lap with the seat belt around the adult passenger only. If a seat is purchased for the infant than a DOT approved cabin seat provided by the passenger is acceptable.

As far as life vests, in the US the major airlines have child vests. Some airlines use adult vests for the child. It all depends on the type of life vest. The dual cylinder two chamber vest with the back flap is easy to place on a child. There are also infand pods on certain airlines.

Thanks CD, it is exactly the paper I had in mind :ok:

Thanks. We would have preferred to use a child seat as you use in the car but the advice we got here was that different carriers have different rules for even different flights and we tend to need to use different carriers, different routes and different whatnots.

See here for the FAA's information, especially the last sentence of the 2nd to last paragraph.

FAA - Child Safety on Airplanes

Not so much for infants, but for older children, is this new "CARES" restraint belt system, approved by many regulatory authorities:

CARES | Kids Fly Safe

Thanks.. this looks very interesting !

Cheers,