British Airways vs. BASSA (current Airline Staff Only)

[Colonel White]

Miss M

A possible threat of another strike over Christmas should be enough for WW to want to reach a settlement with us.

Nobody wants a strike but there are thousands of us will walk out at Christmas if necessary. I am one of those and I will not hestitate a second to do it.

A strike ? On what grounds ?? If BASSA really had a cause that the knew could not be linked back to any previous strike action, how come they didn't put it to the membership immediately after they had that resounding rejection of the management offer. What was it now ? 75% voted to tell BA to put their offer where the sun don't shine, Wait a sec, that was 75% of those cats who expressed a preference. But less than 50% expressed a view, so actually the offer was trashed by around a third (I'm being generous) of the membership. The rest ? well they missed the deadline. Funny that ... You see I think that Duncan and the boys and girls on the committee got cold feet. I think they are sitting at this poker table with a jack high and praying that nobody calls their bluff. If only a third of the members can be counted on to go on strike, that means it won't have any real impact. And that is assuming that there is this super new reason for walking out.

How many will actually support a strike if they know
a) it won't stop the airline from running a 100% schedule and
b) it will cost them their jobs
??

What do you think ? Of that 3000 odd, how many think that BA won't sack them ? Even if they don't, how many will be able to take a hit on the pay packet over the Xmas period ? Don't forget we are talking about the same boys and girls who have already lost their staff travel because Duncan and co said BA wouldn't dare take it away.

Put it another way, are you prepared to lose your job to support this cause ? Because that is what it comes down to. Do you want to throw away however many years service you have put in and be faced with the dole queue ? There aren't a huge number of jobs out there for ex-cabin crew despite what you may think. Particularly ex-BA cabin crew who have been sacked. As Clint Eastwood put ' So do you feel lucky ??'

[Juan Tugoh]

there are thousands of us will walk out at Christmas if necessary

On what grounds? You will have to come up with something brand new to strike over or the strike will not be protected. This not only means that any strikers can be sacked, it also means BA can go after the costs that the strike incurs from the union. At £7Million a day, how long will UNITE be financially able to take the risk that they lose the subsequent court case? How many BASSA supporters are willing to give their families the gift of unemployment for Christmas?

[Caribbean Boy]

MissM,

You said in a post - quickly deleted - that you don't care if BA goes bust. I believe you.

And you say that thousands would go on strike over Xmas. I believe you.

But I also believe that you are onto a loser, yet you won't admit defeat. You are increasingly irrelevant to Willie Walsh and to BA. If you don't believe me, then go on strike again.

[swalesboy]

It seems to me that most people who work for BA want this ballot and the susequent strike. This has gone on far too long and has to be wrapped up for good.

Unfortunately for BASSA, 90% of the work force and UK population can see who the winner is going to be.

Personally, I cant wait. Bring it on.

[sidtheesexist]

The BASSAmentalists are a bunch of deluded, bigotted losers - they HATE BA, the customers, the pilots and the job.....why don't they do EVERYONE a favour and **** *** out of the job they loathe. They keep telling everyone how super-skilled and multi-disciplined they are so it will be no problem to find an equally renumerated job that they actually enjoy...........

Why posters on here bother trying to reason with these folks is quite beyond me. awaiting a further ban by the MODs

[MIDLGW]

Isn't it funny how DH has now said he's given back half his unite income? I remember from not that long ago that he claimed to not have taken his unite salary. Another lie for the collection.

[Meal Chucker]

Bassa are either being increasingly sidelined and kept in the dark by Unite about any ongoing negotiations or somebody at Bassa is lying.

From a recent posting on the Bassa forum from one of reps -

'People keep asking why they are not receiving updates on any ongoing “talks” - quite simply, this is because there are none!
At this moment in time, there are NO talks taking place to update you on'.

Yet in the last press release from Unite they state -

Talks between the union and BA managers are expected to be held next week, but Unite officials warned that a fresh ballot for strikes could be held if there is no progress soon. Unite claimed that BA last week rejected a compromise offer aimed at resolving the row over the removal of travel concessions for cabin crew who have been on strike.

Which backs up an email Bill Francis sent out a few days back stating that BA and Unite have been in talks for 2 weeks.

So what's going on - who's fooling who?

[Wirbelsturm]

The 'hate mail' newsrag was reporting that unemployment is, once again, on the rise and due to hit 10% by 2012. This was backed up with articles in the Times, Guardian and the Independant.

That makes one in ten adults of employable age and condition without any sort of job.

It would seem the UK job market and indeed the world job markets are all in for a rough ride. This is, however, symptomatic of recession recovery where the markets and the job markets drag the recession by upto 18-24 months. As this is forecast to be a long, drawn out recovery (look at 10-15 years possibly), something that is supoorted by the worsening GDP figures from around the globe, that puts all businesses on a wary footing. The irony of the previous recessions is that large corporations start going out of business in this period as they don't have the cash reserves to survive the necessary restructuring.

If the BASSA hard liners want to go and swim in these dangerous waters then, by all means, go and do it. I, along with the vast majority of my colleagues, will do my utmost to prevent you from forcing me to do the same.

War is the ultimate consequence of failed diplomacy

MissM, why do you think that BASSA striking over Christmas (again) would force negotiation? In the eyes of the public it is a direct attack, not on the company, but on them. The company will fly its full service again (with my help if necessary) and achieve the moral high ground.

Unite has so many battles to fight at the moment as they try and cling on to working practices that existed in a world of excess spending and easy credit. Time to change and, sadly, BASSA fighting over 'perks' is not going to be at the top of their priority list. Perhaps the Civil Servants actually losing their jobs might need a bit more support than a bunch of well paid workers losing their annual concessionary ticket.

Just a thought for all the 'brothers and sisters' from BFC.

[stormin norman]

If Chucker is correct then it's surely time for the BASSA membership to dispense with Holley as he appears completely out of touch with what is going on between UNITE and BA.

[ranger07]

MissM

Although mindful of the militancy of BASSA, I really did'nt realise that in our midst, we had the likes of MissM with such extreme views and hatred towards the Airline and its' staff simply for not folllowing their irrational, vile, unjustified thinking!

THIS AIRLINE CAN NOT AND SHOULD NOT TOLERATE SUCH STAFF MEMBERS!

These are a minority, hell bent on screwing the airline for their own selfish means.

MissM...why are you working for this Airline?

I hope you go on strike...because it will be your last.. thankfully for the rest of us, we can move on without you!

[ChicoG]

If Chucker is correct then it's surely time for the BASSA membership to dispense with Holley as he appears completely out of touch with what is going on between UNITE and BA.

It's equally likely that the toupee'd twins prefer to keep BASSA out of the loop in view of their previous history of hissy fits and dummy spitting.

[MrBernoulli]

It's equally likely that the toupee'd twins prefer to keep BASSA out of the loop in view of their previous history of hissy fits and dummy spitting.

That is highly likely! DH may be subconsciously acknowledging that BASSA have no part in any of the talks, but that it is Unite participating.

Nevertheless, TW and DS are a pair of simple buffoons so sod all will be achieved dealing with them.

[Human Factor]

As has already been mentioned, BASSA/Unite are effectively irrelevant and have been since the end of the last round of strikes.

New Fleet will start in the Autumn, so removing the previous crew from a tranche of routes (the list is out there) leaving a surplus of crew to cover the remainder. We know that no more than a couple of thousand will walk out, even if any new ballot (which may or may not actually happen) so the surplus will, to a certain degree, offset the number of strikers and the VCC will make up for the rest. There is no point in striking if it will have no effect.

Stupidity is the act of continually repeating an action with the hope of a different outcome (or something like that). A further strike ballot will not bring BA any closer to the negotiating table than it has been already simply because they know that a further strike will be even less effective than the last.

What grounds would a new strike be called over anyway? BASSA don't have many options to choose from to provide a suitable disconnect from the last action. No protection? Even less support. You've been warned.

[malcolmf]

The latest call by Unite probably needs to be seen in the context of the Unite General Secretary election (due before Xmas I believe). Once that is over and the political posturing is no longer necessary, BASSA may well find themselves out on a limb.

[Abbey Road]

There is no point in striking if it will have no effect.

Well, some are hoping for a strike because it will allow BA to dismiss those that participate. There isn't a chance in Hell of BASSA claiming that a further strike is not connected to the earlier industrial action. The 90-day protection is well past, so strikers face instant dismissal. No bad thing! Out with the dross.

[Shah100]

Colonel White

You can spin the recent crew ballot figures all you want, but only 10% of crew decided to accept BA's offer.
Before anyone sprouts, the offer was only for crew not in the union, this didn't stop some Bassa members leaving the union to accept the offer.
B.A also sent the offer directly to crew as well, I know as some of my friends received it in the post.
So they were targeting crew directly who were still in the union, like I said only 10% accepted.
If I was B.A management, I would be dissapointed with that figure.
After all there obvious confronting, union busting techniques (which you can find on youtube). This is the best they could do, 10%!

Again there is mention of a 100% schedule.
100% of what schedule?
Its obviously a revised schedule and that could be anything.
So I wouldn't put to much trust in Walsh's claims.

You mention a future Christmas strike will hurt the crews pockets.
I don't disagree with you, but a large % of crew have been out of pocket since the first round of strikes.
People who need there staff travel to get to work, yet they havn't signed up
to our wonderful leader's new offer.
How many crew communte or do not live in the vicinity of Heathrow?
I'm sure its way higher than the percentage of people, who accepted the offer.
Which means there are many crew, who need there staff travel, are holding firm.

Again yourself / Juan Tugoh mention future sackings of crew, if they participate in any future IA linked to any previous strikes.
Your wrong on this, all crew will still be protected, even if B.A some how link the I.A to previous ones.
The Union is the one who is liable, they will have to pay up.


Before anyone makes a point, no I am not crew. I work as ground staff.

[essessdeedee]

to Shah

this didn't stop some Bassa members leaving the union to accept the offer.
B.A also sent the offer directly to crew as well, I know as some of my friends received it in the post.
So they were targeting crew directly who were still in the union, like I said only 10% accepted.

Shah,
ask your friends to see the offer again. You will note that the offer was sent out on the same day in which you needed not to be in the union. The offer also stated specifically that if you were still in the union on 25 June, you could not accept the offer.

The 10% is a reasonable %age not to be in the union.

[gcal]

Outside the spoiled and blinkered few there are some good people, a majority:

BA: Apprentices needed to help build third-party MRO

[TheKabaka]

You are wrong Shah, someone close to me e mailed BF to ask if they could accept the offer and leave the union. They were told this was not possible. Only people not in the union at a given date could accept it.

Also BA means 100% of normal schedule, any other measure is pointless (try and spin the fact only 1 flight operated, well it was 100% of what we planned!)

Your last point I agree somewhat, if you have already lost staff travel you have less to lose in another strike.

[Betty girl]

Shar'
I expect it is the fact that you work as ground staff and not as crew that you do not realise that ALL crew got sent the offer. BA does not know who is in the union and who is not.

The offer was for ALL crew, union members had the chance to accept it by voting in the ballot, non union members could sign the contract attached as they were unable to vote. No one was targeted in fact the offer clearly stated you could only sign it if you were not a member of the union on 25 June.

Many crew wanted to sign it and still do but were unable to because of their union membership, so I think you have many of your facts wrong.

I can tell you that very few crew would actually strike this time and you can be sure that thoes that do will lose their jobs for sure.