British Airways vs. BASSA (Airline Staff Only)
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From the Unite website:
Talks resume between Unite and British Airways
7th April 2010
Talks between Unite the union and British Airways aimed at resolving the cabin crew dispute resumed over the Easter weekend and are continuing, the union said today (Wednesday).
Joint general secretary Tony Woodley said: “It is welcome that talks have resumed and I am pleased that some serious progress has been made over the issues which have divided us.
“However, there is more work to be done, and further discussions will take place with the company over the next few days. I reported to representatives of our cabin crew today and explained that it would be unnecessary to set further strike dates while these talks are continuing and making progress.”
7th April 2010
Talks between Unite the union and British Airways aimed at resolving the cabin crew dispute resumed over the Easter weekend and are continuing, the union said today (Wednesday).
Joint general secretary Tony Woodley said: “It is welcome that talks have resumed and I am pleased that some serious progress has been made over the issues which have divided us.
“However, there is more work to be done, and further discussions will take place with the company over the next few days. I reported to representatives of our cabin crew today and explained that it would be unnecessary to set further strike dates while these talks are continuing and making progress.”
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I notice there have been some rumblings on the forum about you all being left in the dark and there is no new news being posted. There is a reason for this - namely there is no news to give. The last 6 days have been spent tidying up Bedfont, returning all the hire equipment etc and representing the many suspended crew who are now going through their disciplinaries as well as picking up new suspensions from incidents that have taken place since we went back to work. The reps that are not flying are flat out on these cases, some of which can take the best part of a day. Silence does not mean nothing is happening.
However most of the reps are going to UNITE HOUSE in Holborn tomorrow for a pensions brief (the only thing BA would deroster us for) and afterwards there is a meeting planned with Tony Woodley and Len McLuskey to decide our next moves.
Hopefully we will also get an update from UNITE legal re the staff travel and pay deductions (please note BA have, since the payslips were published, in some cases paid more money directly into some strikers bank account after being challenged). Please be patient on this. It is being looked at but you can’t hurry a lawyer.
We are very aware that Walsh is still blundering full steam ahead with recruitment, and volunteers are still flying and being trained. We will obviously take all this into consideration when briefing Tony and Len and will influence what steps will now be needed to force a halt to BA plans. In other words we realise the gloves are off.
It is now also obvious this issue is not going to be over in the first round and could end up "going the distance" so although it may seem frustrating at present that over the last 6 days things have gone quiet - it was always going to be thus as our pledge not to strike over the Easter break dictated - there is much water to flow under the bridge and with it a lot of serious planning. It seems we must dig the ditches a little deeper and plan for the long haul.
It must be even more apparent to you all now that this dispute was never really about saving money or crew off aircraft - if it was it would have been settled by now. No, this dispute is about completely doing away with your union and with it your terms and conditions. The stakes are massive now - Walsh always wanted it that way. He went looking for war and with the stakes being so massive we had no choice but to vigorously resist. Even losing staff travel - as draconian as we know that is to a lot of you - will pale into insignificance when you realise his wider plans.
So, keep the faith and have heart. BASSA have not been idle since the last red and white flag was lowered last Tuesday amid the chaos of the rain and the open top buses (not to mention the muddy field). Plans for an even better more comfortable Bedfont are being made and maybe next time we will have a baked potato stall with salad to give you alternative dining options. You see we do listen!
The spirit of Bedfont has not gone...... it is still burning brightly - it has merely gone through a short tunnel on its long journey.
The reps who have flown have been greatly encouraged by the response of all the crew who are saying "if that is what Walsh wants - then bring it on because I will not be browbeaten, bullied or blackmailed into giving up something I care for and which I am entitled to fight for".
Please do not be disappointed if there is no immediate announcement tomorrow evening as the meeting could go on late into the night, but rest assured your views and feelings will be relayed to the powers to be with due passion and forthrightness by your BASSA reps.
Regards to all - Duncan
PS Have typed this directly into the news page and not spell-checked or had it proof read so please excuse, just this once, any errors.
Ends
However most of the reps are going to UNITE HOUSE in Holborn tomorrow for a pensions brief (the only thing BA would deroster us for) and afterwards there is a meeting planned with Tony Woodley and Len McLuskey to decide our next moves.
Hopefully we will also get an update from UNITE legal re the staff travel and pay deductions (please note BA have, since the payslips were published, in some cases paid more money directly into some strikers bank account after being challenged). Please be patient on this. It is being looked at but you can’t hurry a lawyer.
We are very aware that Walsh is still blundering full steam ahead with recruitment, and volunteers are still flying and being trained. We will obviously take all this into consideration when briefing Tony and Len and will influence what steps will now be needed to force a halt to BA plans. In other words we realise the gloves are off.
It is now also obvious this issue is not going to be over in the first round and could end up "going the distance" so although it may seem frustrating at present that over the last 6 days things have gone quiet - it was always going to be thus as our pledge not to strike over the Easter break dictated - there is much water to flow under the bridge and with it a lot of serious planning. It seems we must dig the ditches a little deeper and plan for the long haul.
It must be even more apparent to you all now that this dispute was never really about saving money or crew off aircraft - if it was it would have been settled by now. No, this dispute is about completely doing away with your union and with it your terms and conditions. The stakes are massive now - Walsh always wanted it that way. He went looking for war and with the stakes being so massive we had no choice but to vigorously resist. Even losing staff travel - as draconian as we know that is to a lot of you - will pale into insignificance when you realise his wider plans.
So, keep the faith and have heart. BASSA have not been idle since the last red and white flag was lowered last Tuesday amid the chaos of the rain and the open top buses (not to mention the muddy field). Plans for an even better more comfortable Bedfont are being made and maybe next time we will have a baked potato stall with salad to give you alternative dining options. You see we do listen!
The spirit of Bedfont has not gone...... it is still burning brightly - it has merely gone through a short tunnel on its long journey.
The reps who have flown have been greatly encouraged by the response of all the crew who are saying "if that is what Walsh wants - then bring it on because I will not be browbeaten, bullied or blackmailed into giving up something I care for and which I am entitled to fight for".
Please do not be disappointed if there is no immediate announcement tomorrow evening as the meeting could go on late into the night, but rest assured your views and feelings will be relayed to the powers to be with due passion and forthrightness by your BASSA reps.
Regards to all - Duncan
PS Have typed this directly into the news page and not spell-checked or had it proof read so please excuse, just this once, any errors.
Ends
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"Results for the month were affected by two cabin-crew strikes, which the airline estimated cost it between 40 million ($61 million) and 45 million pounds".
...and all this loss (+ loads more I'm sure) due to a debatable £10m between UNITES' and BA's calculations.
...and all this loss (+ loads more I'm sure) due to a debatable £10m between UNITES' and BA's calculations.
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Is the stress getting to Duncan? After his refusal to turn up for rostered trips and his ill-advised foray into broadcasting BA are refusing to drop the disciplinary charges against him. He knows unless he can deliver a decisive victory for BASSA he'll be out of a job, and the big guns at Unite are unlikely to be inclined to parachute him into a cushy job at union HQ like they did with others. It can be no surprise that he's pushing for all out war with BA, but the motivation is saving his own skin rather than benefitting his followers.
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crash and burn wrote:
Ok TW has told BASSA that they do not need to announce any further strike dates while talks are ongoing... but are they going to listen to him??
They didn't last time....
When was that then?
They didn't last time....
When was that then?
WW has said in public many times that each and every disiplinary will be dealt with in the proper process. The same statement was also attached to the promise that ST would not be returned to strikers.
Try and put yourself on 'the other side' to realise that he OWES it to every 'working' BA employee to keep his word and ensure that ST does not get given back to strikers and that all persons suspended for B&H, or other serious charges, should be brought to account.
Good to see that lalaland still feel everything is about them!
It is in nobody's interest to 'break' bassa, but bassa desperately need a reality check. They have behaved like a spoilt little kid who is not given their own way!
Grow up and join the 21st century!
Try and put yourself on 'the other side' to realise that he OWES it to every 'working' BA employee to keep his word and ensure that ST does not get given back to strikers and that all persons suspended for B&H, or other serious charges, should be brought to account.
Good to see that lalaland still feel everything is about them!
It is in nobody's interest to 'break' bassa, but bassa desperately need a reality check. They have behaved like a spoilt little kid who is not given their own way!
Grow up and join the 21st century!
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PS Have typed this directly into the news page and not spell-checked or had it proof read so please excuse, just this once, any errors.
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"Results for the month were affected by two cabin-crew strikes, which the airline estimated cost it between 40 million ($61 million) and 45 million pounds".
...and all this loss (+ loads more I'm sure) due to a debatable £10m between UNITES' and BA's calculations.
At the risk of repeating myself...
...and all this loss (+ loads more I'm sure) due to a debatable £10m between UNITES' and BA's calculations.
At the risk of repeating myself...
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Duncan likes to write long missives, often on the theme of "We are not militants". I suspect he was behind the recent letter from '42 year old mother of two' as the two writing styles were identical.
You could be onto something here.
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You do not seriously believe that this was about £10million of BASSA calculated savings do you? The cost savings of a full £62.5 million are already in place to have accepted the BASSA offer would have meant increasing the spend and reducing the savings already achieved. At no stage had BASSA had any meaningful negotiations with the company and cannot get it into their collective heads that if they had wanted to get BA to accept their offer it would have had to at least equal the already achieved savings level. To have accepted the BASSA offer would have given BA nothing, for a deal to be made there would have to be something in it for BA.
At the moment BA are sitting pretty, the strike was pretty much a failure with increasing numbers of CC returning to work. The payslips are in and despite any legal challenge the company will do the same this time around - a legal challenge will be fought tooth and nail by BA and will take months, maybe years to be resolved. Crew will get no joy from the courts in the short term and bills have to be paid today. If the crew are so poorly paid as BASSA would have us believe they will simply not be able to strike for a prolonged period.
BA seem very determined to not give in to the blackmail that a strike ultimately is, so what good will a prolonged one do? BA have not given in so far and have run a reasonable and increasing level of service, there is nothing to suggest that any more striking will reverse this trend. The more service that BA runs the worse BASSA's position becomes. Strike's are most damaging when they are a threat, once they occur unless they paralyze a company the threat goes away.
The general election will also play largely in this and cannot be ignored. The Labour party simply cannot afford to have an unlimited all out BA strike organised by their biggest donor in the middle of a General Election. Tony Woodley et al have bigger fish to fry than looking aftyer some realtively well paid cabin crew. It does not play well on the TV to see CC at Bedfont behaving dreadfully, wearing devil masks and T shirts portraying WW as Hitler.
Duncan Holley may want an all out strike but he has nothing to lose - he is out of a job unless BA are broken by this strike, the rest of the CC have not burnt their bridges yet.
At the moment BA are sitting pretty, the strike was pretty much a failure with increasing numbers of CC returning to work. The payslips are in and despite any legal challenge the company will do the same this time around - a legal challenge will be fought tooth and nail by BA and will take months, maybe years to be resolved. Crew will get no joy from the courts in the short term and bills have to be paid today. If the crew are so poorly paid as BASSA would have us believe they will simply not be able to strike for a prolonged period.
BA seem very determined to not give in to the blackmail that a strike ultimately is, so what good will a prolonged one do? BA have not given in so far and have run a reasonable and increasing level of service, there is nothing to suggest that any more striking will reverse this trend. The more service that BA runs the worse BASSA's position becomes. Strike's are most damaging when they are a threat, once they occur unless they paralyze a company the threat goes away.
The general election will also play largely in this and cannot be ignored. The Labour party simply cannot afford to have an unlimited all out BA strike organised by their biggest donor in the middle of a General Election. Tony Woodley et al have bigger fish to fry than looking aftyer some realtively well paid cabin crew. It does not play well on the TV to see CC at Bedfont behaving dreadfully, wearing devil masks and T shirts portraying WW as Hitler.
Duncan Holley may want an all out strike but he has nothing to lose - he is out of a job unless BA are broken by this strike, the rest of the CC have not burnt their bridges yet.
Last edited by Juan Tugoh; 7th Apr 2010 at 18:12.
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It must be even more apparent to you all now that this dispute was never really about saving money or crew off aircraft - if it was it would have been settled by now. No, this dispute is about completely doing away with your union and with it your terms and conditions.
Interesting statement. Is the last line talking about BA or BASSA?
Still, at least we have someone actually coming out with a reason why they are striking....even though it's absolute tosh.
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So, Woodley has held the baying crowd back for now at least. It will be interesting to see how long this lasts when he keeps coming back from the negotiations with the same message on staff travel and disciplinaries, along with no improvement in the offer. WW has absolutely no incentive to give anything away, and reward the disgraceful behavour we have seen, not only over the last two weeks, but over many years.
It's only a matter of time before the next strike dates are announced (and we fly approaching 90% of passengers because 80%+ crew turn up for work)
I suspect this will all play out between Fri and Mon when BASSA lose patience.
It's only a matter of time before the next strike dates are announced (and we fly approaching 90% of passengers because 80%+ crew turn up for work)
I suspect this will all play out between Fri and Mon when BASSA lose patience.
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I don't want to copy anything onto here from the BASSA forum but let me tell you the "posting" (i.e. pro strike) membership are NOT IMPRESSED by these recent events. It turns out BASSA was not informed by Unite about these talks, which started on friday, until today!
Remember, once a strike is called only BASSA (not Unite) can call it off. As the BASSA reps have made it clear that they prefer an "all-out" indefinite strike, this can't be an easy decision for him to make.
In my opinion, Unite has realised that this is a lost battle and the only thing to recover anything from the previous offers is to sit down and not let BASSA implode after a few more days of industrial action.. I think he's doing them all a big favour.
Remember, once a strike is called only BASSA (not Unite) can call it off. As the BASSA reps have made it clear that they prefer an "all-out" indefinite strike, this can't be an easy decision for him to make.
In my opinion, Unite has realised that this is a lost battle and the only thing to recover anything from the previous offers is to sit down and not let BASSA implode after a few more days of industrial action.. I think he's doing them all a big favour.
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"Bedfont Lemmings" eh - the one thing I will take away from this period when all settles down is my sheer respect from the thousands I saw and met at BFC. The highlight for me so far has been the only non Spanish crew member at a M25 picket, all of whom were on strike, all of whom commute from Spain and the Canaries. These people will always be able to hold their heads up high and be proud, unlike some of my CC and FC colleagues.
dontdoit, you may want to pop along to BFC yourself on the next wave and see for yourself just how committed and strong these lemmings are.
dontdoit, you may want to pop along to BFC yourself on the next wave and see for yourself just how committed and strong these lemmings are.
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"Bedfont Lemmings" eh - the one thing I will take away from this period when all settles down is my sheer respect from the thousands I saw and met at BFC.