British Airways - CC Industrial Relations Mk V
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Midman - I would also question your credentials if you did not know what BACrewboy has just pointed out - which has been repeated time and time again on here since the RIO incident first came to light. TOPIC CLOSED!
I requested that the topic be allowed a little longer, since UNITE/BA had chosen to take it, add a fictitious quote and send it to the press. I agree that, with the sad demise of the passenger in question, all of the information on this subject is available to be read on the thread, and there is no point discussing it further.
I hope BASSA admit to their false statement and withdraw it from the public domain. I doubt that they will.
My deepest condolences to the friends and family of the deceased, and my sympathy goes to the CC that, after all, were only doing what they were taught. They should not blame themselves for the outcome.
Best Wishes,
D
Last edited by Desertia; 25th Jan 2010 at 10:21.
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Can someone please explain to me what "capping first class" means in the context of this dispute?
T'Bug
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Reading through the utter rubbish that is the Unite 'confidential' document (posted on a public access server without restriction!) it brings me back to the ultimate question of who the hell runs BA?
Why do Unite think that they, the Union, have the right to dictate the structure, business plan and future of the company?
This one is brilliant!
Straight out of the opening paragraph of any corporate business plan. NOT FROM A UNION!
Hmm, I wonder why the company refused to entertain this little bag of tricks? Lets have a look.
The increase in productivity allowed up to 1000 Cabin Crew the ability to take voluntary redundancy thus reducing the compulsory redundancy requirement. The VR was allowed on preferential terms. Part time was granted to many that requested it. Again reducing the available manpower pool. Restoring the previous (over manned) crewing levels would cost BA dear! Plus your Union wants to remove/cancel YOUR requests for part time work, a lifestyle choice BY YOU.
CAP First Class! Brilliant strategy Unite. Cull the customers with the greatest yield/profit margin for the company. Why, again, do BA want to break your strangle hold on the company?
Temps to LGW? Don't want them taking up space on those high paying LH trips out of LHR now do we?
Specific Flight Cancellations? Ok, so just how does BA earn its revenue then? Park up airplanes to give the Unite kiddies their toys back? Utter lunacy.
Current one down payment? Get real. The company is in a financial crisis in the middle of a recession in an economy that has faired worse than any other western economy! Forget it.
The list goes on and on and on!
Hopefully all of this rubbish will be presented before the Courts and Unite/BASSA will get hammered.
Let the managers manage and the Unions negotiate. Never, ever should the Unions be allowed to 'dictate'.
Why do Unite think that they, the Union, have the right to dictate the structure, business plan and future of the company?
This one is brilliant!
British Airways will continue to be a great place to work but also be
recognised as a model of excellence, being perfectly placed to
deliver consistent world-class customer service into the 21st century.
recognised as a model of excellence, being perfectly placed to
deliver consistent world-class customer service into the 21st century.
WorldWide:
April 1st (Quite ironic one feels)return to agreed crewing levels and working position responsibilities.
Monday 18th January –April 1st
This can be achieved by a range of options:
Increase to contract type
Cancel unpaid leave
Defer part time offers until 01/04/10
Zone close
Cap First Class
Shorthaul surplus to WW
Temps to LGW - LGW transfers
Specific Flight Cancellations
LGW main crew member returns to purser
01st March to March 31st
World Wide: Current one down payment
April 1st (Quite ironic one feels)return to agreed crewing levels and working position responsibilities.
Monday 18th January –April 1st
This can be achieved by a range of options:
Increase to contract type
Cancel unpaid leave
Defer part time offers until 01/04/10
Zone close
Cap First Class
Shorthaul surplus to WW
Temps to LGW - LGW transfers
Specific Flight Cancellations
LGW main crew member returns to purser
01st March to March 31st
World Wide: Current one down payment
The increase in productivity allowed up to 1000 Cabin Crew the ability to take voluntary redundancy thus reducing the compulsory redundancy requirement. The VR was allowed on preferential terms. Part time was granted to many that requested it. Again reducing the available manpower pool. Restoring the previous (over manned) crewing levels would cost BA dear! Plus your Union wants to remove/cancel YOUR requests for part time work, a lifestyle choice BY YOU.
CAP First Class! Brilliant strategy Unite. Cull the customers with the greatest yield/profit margin for the company. Why, again, do BA want to break your strangle hold on the company?
Temps to LGW? Don't want them taking up space on those high paying LH trips out of LHR now do we?
Specific Flight Cancellations? Ok, so just how does BA earn its revenue then? Park up airplanes to give the Unite kiddies their toys back? Utter lunacy.
Current one down payment? Get real. The company is in a financial crisis in the middle of a recession in an economy that has faired worse than any other western economy! Forget it.
The list goes on and on and on!
Hopefully all of this rubbish will be presented before the Courts and Unite/BASSA will get hammered.
Let the managers manage and the Unions negotiate. Never, ever should the Unions be allowed to 'dictate'.
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Thanks, Wobble ... I was just going to comment on the "Cap First Class" in the same vein. Lose those high-revenue passengers completely, or over-crowd J so that some of us get then get downgraded to WT+? And the Unions really expect the pax to carrying flying? And this is supposed to be a helpful proposal?
ABBA on those terms.
ABBA on those terms.
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The point about sick pay and holiday pay - I admit that my post was perhaps a little misleading
There is no need to hand ammunition to your "opponents".
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So is it, Undeniably No Intelligence, Total Effluant?.....
and Brainless And Stupid, Strike Anyway?
Judging by the proposal to cap First Class etc, these are the true definitions.
These peolpe (the union)are just unreal and care NOTHING about the airline and the people that work there, it makes one wonder what the true agenda is.
I truly hope that the CC comunity vote with a resounding NO!!! this time, for their sakes as well as the rest of the airline.
and Brainless And Stupid, Strike Anyway?
Judging by the proposal to cap First Class etc, these are the true definitions.
These peolpe (the union)are just unreal and care NOTHING about the airline and the people that work there, it makes one wonder what the true agenda is.
I truly hope that the CC comunity vote with a resounding NO!!! this time, for their sakes as well as the rest of the airline.
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@ BAcrewboy ...
I can see some economic sense in that.
Expect howls of protest from the evicted "celebrities" and "resting CSDs"
Truth be known, BA would love to get rid of FIRST altogether and get more J seats in!
Expect howls of protest from the evicted "celebrities" and "resting CSDs"
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BAcrewboy wrote:
From January Flight Ops News:
"New First seating is already at BAMC – installation begins this month on B777 IIU and in March on B747 IVF"
.......hmmmmmm, doesn't seem like it!
Truth be known, BA would love to get rid of FIRST altogether and get more J seats in!
"New First seating is already at BAMC – installation begins this month on B777 IIU and in March on B747 IVF"
.......hmmmmmm, doesn't seem like it!
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Truth be known, BA would love to get rid of FIRST altogether and get more J seats in!
It is a very fine balancing act to ensure that those services that have a consistently good First/Business yield have assets available should an aircraft go down.
Ensuring that both First and Business customers consistently have the facilities they require and pay for are essential for BA. Converting all the aircraft to cattle carriers will never ever be in BA's interest. BA has been served very well in the past by its corporate customers, to endanger that would be folly indeed.
Beware of 'Crewmour'!
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Whilst in the air, it is the crew who are in charge of the medical situation - not the professional
But you do appear to be belittling the accumulated years of experience acquired by "the professional" - in this case a cardiac surgeon, if the original report has any credence.
If we are to believe the later reports on the case of the unfortunate cardiac arrest case, the patient arrived at the hospital brain dead - which confirms the cardiac surgeon passenger's original opinion when he recommended the cessation of resuscitation procedures.
All this self-aggrandisement does very little to better the cabin crew's cause.
I, for one, have a First Class Honours from Bristol University in Philosophy and Economis. I have flown with doctors, lawyers, and many other highly skilled people.
Finally, in one of your earlier comments, you asked for a link to a BASSA press hand-out. You had very loudly proclaimed your resignation from the union before that, so you cannot now demand that it include you in the services it provides.
Or - more simply put: you can't have your cake and eat it!
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Lots of airlines are fading out FIRST in favour of J.. we won't be far behind.
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Lots of airlines are fading out FIRST in favour of J.. we won't be far behind.
Putting my business head on, if I have reduced capacity across my fleets to weather the storm. Then I have capacity in both First and Business class that is available, fitted and ready, at that point my competitors start removing First (not that I have heard but hey ho.)? Would I remove a product that is declining in availability?
Not a hope. I would be enticing those who can afford and enjoy flying First to my airline if other airlines don't offer that service.
Think from an opportunities viewpoint not from a workers viewpoint. There are many passengers who either travel in First because they can or aspire to it. To remove it would be sheer folly again!
A classic sign of our 'dreadful' CEO ruining the company are the London City flights. Many shouted that to start up this service in the middle of a recession was lunacy. It is now proving to be one of the most popular services to NYC with load factors close to 100%. Innovate to stay alive.
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Regardless of the experience of the professional pax., the crew had no option but to continue for the full 30 mins. Whether or not this is the correct course of action is not for me to discuss. Hopefully the people within BA will look into it and reassess the guidelines. Can you imagine, however, the furore if the crew had stopped before 30 mins - there would be legal action left, right, and centre. The crew followed the guideline to the letter.
With regard to my resignation from the Union and my request to see the documents - I believe that there are many on here who are not in the Union yet would like to read the documents. Thanks to the many people who mailed me the link.
With regard to my resignation from the Union and my request to see the documents - I believe that there are many on here who are not in the Union yet would like to read the documents. Thanks to the many people who mailed me the link.
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Apologies for the digression ... although it's an interesting aspect.
Back to that question from last evening ... WHY do some of you want a strike?
Back to that question from last evening ... WHY do some of you want a strike?
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Wobble - I refer you to several issues of Business Traveller from May-November 2009. There you will find plenty of evidence of the declining loads in F and the favourable change to J.
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With regard to phasing out First for 'J' to fit extra seats in - doesn't really work on a jumbo. If you speak to our engineers you can't legally fit any more club seats at the front of a jumbo than you can first. Why would BA refit first class if it wants to get rid of it?
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La Pouquelaye
What´s your agenda? "BAcrewboy, please believe me when say that I am not trying to discredit crew members ... which confirms the cardiac surgeon passenger's original opinion when he recommended the cessation of resuscitation procedures".
For the enth time - the correct procedure would appear to have been followed - I will not repeat it again and the topic should be CLOSED. Moderators?
Unhelpful: "Finally, in one of your earlier comments, you asked for a link to a BASSA press hand-out. You had very loudly proclaimed your resignation from the union before that, so you cannot now demand that it include you in the services it provides.
Please be more constructive!
What´s your agenda? "BAcrewboy, please believe me when say that I am not trying to discredit crew members ... which confirms the cardiac surgeon passenger's original opinion when he recommended the cessation of resuscitation procedures".
For the enth time - the correct procedure would appear to have been followed - I will not repeat it again and the topic should be CLOSED. Moderators?
Unhelpful: "Finally, in one of your earlier comments, you asked for a link to a BASSA press hand-out. You had very loudly proclaimed your resignation from the union before that, so you cannot now demand that it include you in the services it provides.
Please be more constructive!