Air France
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Air France
I know that cabin crew with Air France LH (long haul) belong to a certain division, for instance Divison Amerique (only flying to America), Division Afrique (flying only to Africa) and Division Asie Pacifique (flying to Asia).
How come they have this sort of system?
How come they have this sort of system?
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That is certainly a very different way of dividing up a long haul division. It must make admin or crewing a nightmare....then again, obviously it works for Air France. I can only assume that it may have something to do with language or cultural specialisation, where each division is more attuned to the market needs of their own flying region. Also, dividing the flying up into measurable zones like this could be beneficial in terms of jet lag???? ie. the crew know where they are flying to and know exactly what time their body clocks should adjust to, it is a finite element....therefore eliminating adverse effects associated with zig zagging north south, east west across the globe. These are my theories anyway...would be interested to hear from an actual Air France F/A though.
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Maybe it's for specific types of a/c? Maybe the A340, 747 and A300's for one group, 777, A310 and 767 for another group etc. They do have a broad range of a/c types so it may be to do with that (guessing they too are limited to 3 a/c configuartions like UK airline's crew)
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Wow CornishFlyer...I wish I was working out of the UK....3 A/C types!!!!!!! In Australia...its 7!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ie. Airbus A330 -200 and -300 would be considered 2 aircraft types.
By the way...you've got a very good point in your post.....it could well may be an aircraft config thing. Quite frankly, I personally would rather specialise on one aircraft type and know it like the back of my hand than try to know little bits and bobs about every aircraft type in our fleet.
By the way...you've got a very good point in your post.....it could well may be an aircraft config thing. Quite frankly, I personally would rather specialise on one aircraft type and know it like the back of my hand than try to know little bits and bobs about every aircraft type in our fleet.
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Haha. I'm not sure of the limit on a/c variations such as 200 & 300 series but you're allowed to work on 3 different aircraft types such as 777 and 747 etc. Sounds mad down there tho-thank god I fly in the UK like ya said-as if there isn't enough to learn as it is 
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That doesn't make any sense! If they are licensed to work on A340, B747 and B777 (and these aircraft fly all over the world and not to a certain region), still they would only fly to their own division?
A340 goes to JFK and BKO (Bamako). Still, the crew belonging to Division Afrique would only go to BKO whilst the crew belonging to Division Amerique to JFK, wouldn't they?
A340 goes to JFK and BKO (Bamako). Still, the crew belonging to Division Afrique would only go to BKO whilst the crew belonging to Division Amerique to JFK, wouldn't they?
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It's something that's been confirmed to me by friends at AF. Medium-haul crews fly to all medium-haul destinations (Europe, Near East, North Africa, etc.) on the A318/319/320/321, which AFAIK is considered 1 a/c type. Long-haul crews belong to a given division so are geographically segregated.
AF has a "niche" policy to use precisely the right a/c (in terms of range, capacity, ETOPS, season, etc.) for each long-haul route - the A340-300, A330-200, 747-400, 777-200 or 777-300ER. Not too sure if the A330/340 is considered one aircraft type for Cabin Crew (Personnel Navigant Commercial, as they are known in France, although they prefer to be called Hotesses de l'Air or Stewards) - as it is for Flight Crew (with differences training). AF no longer have A300s or 767s; 747-400s are being replaced by 777s (and soon, A380s).
As for the rationale behind it, it would make sense if it was for language specialisation. Yet a friend of mine, who speaks fluent Japanese, was assigned to... the North America division (OK, she was also fluent in English)!
Cheers
AF has a "niche" policy to use precisely the right a/c (in terms of range, capacity, ETOPS, season, etc.) for each long-haul route - the A340-300, A330-200, 747-400, 777-200 or 777-300ER. Not too sure if the A330/340 is considered one aircraft type for Cabin Crew (Personnel Navigant Commercial, as they are known in France, although they prefer to be called Hotesses de l'Air or Stewards) - as it is for Flight Crew (with differences training). AF no longer have A300s or 767s; 747-400s are being replaced by 777s (and soon, A380s).
As for the rationale behind it, it would make sense if it was for language specialisation. Yet a friend of mine, who speaks fluent Japanese, was assigned to... the North America division (OK, she was also fluent in English)!
Cheers
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A bit of a gratuitous comment there PlasticPilot! Positioning regularly on AF, I can say that their Cabin Crews' level of English is very decent indeed. Having attended their selection process myself in a previous life, I can vouch about that. Btw, last I heard, on top of French and English, they have to speak a third langage as well. Can you? 
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Here is it how it works.
We have 4 Flight Divisions (Divisions de Vol):
-America (AME), that covers the US, Canada, Tahiti and all of South America. It's the biggest Division.
-Asia (ASI).
-Caribbean-Indian Ocean (COI, whose CC are known as ''the Coyotes''
)
-Africa-Middle East (AMO)
-Europe (EUR)
-France (FRA), that is based in Orly, while all the others are based in CDG.
Each Division has 2 to 5 Sectors (Secteurs de Vol), that cover different areas (ex inside AME you have Sector D which covers SFO-LAX-PPT-SEA-BOS).
This doesn't mean that CC belonging to the America Division only fly to America, or that CC belonging to D Sector only fly to SFO-LAX-PPT-SEA-BOS.
It means that you are specialized in those destinations, and you should fly there at least once a month (but it is not always the case). You get extra training (on top of what all CC get) about the culture of the country (like US, Indian, Chinese, Japanese pax...) and the product you offer on the flights. A Japan flight has a totally different service and product than an India flight. There are CC (that are called Référents) with extra cultural training that have as a mission to pass on their knowledge to the other CC. They speak during the briefing and are a reference during the flight.
Very often you are assigned to a certain Division and Sector because of your competence, like languages you speak. But you are not forced to do it: you can request another Division if you want. You then will be put into a seniority list and twice a year there are the new assignments.
Regardless of your Division, you can fly other routes. I am on AME, but my next flight is NRT (Tokio).
About your friend Fouga, there is a possible explanation. When you join, even if you are, say, a Swedish national, your knowledge of the Swedish language must be checked before you get the official right to be a Swedish speaker. If she just joined, it is likely that she didn't have the time to pass the exam, so she would be assigned to another Division. But she can move to ASI after having her Japanese ''note'', as we call it. Normally, you are assigned to a division whose language you speak.
About the aircraft specialization, we are allowed only 3, a family of A/C counting as one. Ex. 777-200 and 777-300 are one specialization, or 340 and 330, or 318, 319, 320, 321. 747 counts as one (we only have the 400), but as Fouga says it is being replaced by more 777 and the A380.
Plastic Pilot,
I speak 4 languages fluently. Beat that!
We have 4 Flight Divisions (Divisions de Vol):
-America (AME), that covers the US, Canada, Tahiti and all of South America. It's the biggest Division.
-Asia (ASI).
-Caribbean-Indian Ocean (COI, whose CC are known as ''the Coyotes''
)-Africa-Middle East (AMO)
-Europe (EUR)
-France (FRA), that is based in Orly, while all the others are based in CDG.
Each Division has 2 to 5 Sectors (Secteurs de Vol), that cover different areas (ex inside AME you have Sector D which covers SFO-LAX-PPT-SEA-BOS).
This doesn't mean that CC belonging to the America Division only fly to America, or that CC belonging to D Sector only fly to SFO-LAX-PPT-SEA-BOS.
It means that you are specialized in those destinations, and you should fly there at least once a month (but it is not always the case). You get extra training (on top of what all CC get) about the culture of the country (like US, Indian, Chinese, Japanese pax...) and the product you offer on the flights. A Japan flight has a totally different service and product than an India flight. There are CC (that are called Référents) with extra cultural training that have as a mission to pass on their knowledge to the other CC. They speak during the briefing and are a reference during the flight.
Very often you are assigned to a certain Division and Sector because of your competence, like languages you speak. But you are not forced to do it: you can request another Division if you want. You then will be put into a seniority list and twice a year there are the new assignments.
Regardless of your Division, you can fly other routes. I am on AME, but my next flight is NRT (Tokio).
About your friend Fouga, there is a possible explanation. When you join, even if you are, say, a Swedish national, your knowledge of the Swedish language must be checked before you get the official right to be a Swedish speaker. If she just joined, it is likely that she didn't have the time to pass the exam, so she would be assigned to another Division. But she can move to ASI after having her Japanese ''note'', as we call it. Normally, you are assigned to a division whose language you speak.
About the aircraft specialization, we are allowed only 3, a family of A/C counting as one. Ex. 777-200 and 777-300 are one specialization, or 340 and 330, or 318, 319, 320, 321. 747 counts as one (we only have the 400), but as Fouga says it is being replaced by more 777 and the A380.
Plastic Pilot,
I speak 4 languages fluently. Beat that!
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My previous message about english was partly a joke. I don't want to start useless and agressive arguments here, so sorry if you did take it personally.
That being said, I personally speak French natively, have reasonably good command of English, I work in German, and my wife is Portuguese.
Once again, I'm sorry if you felt offended, that was a joke.
That being said, I personally speak French natively, have reasonably good command of English, I work in German, and my wife is Portuguese.
Once again, I'm sorry if you felt offended, that was a joke.
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Wow Gallimero, that's really cool. It actually makes a lot of sense to do things that way. I was going to ask if crew could change division but you answered that already
