Loc-Out

Grow up idiot.

Keep throwing those sticks though, if you like. They're bouncing off me. Your immensely mature dialogue having the same effect.

P.s Your understanding of my post was incorrect...I mentioned that NJE aircraft operations not governed by USA. OBVIOUSLY the President has a say in various company matters. That is what Presidents do. He does not, however, draw up rosters and Ops Manuals.

control ???
 

INCA,

I see you have started the name calling, open your eyes and see your employers for what they are.


"Although affiliated with NetJets USA, they have no direct control over our operations. "

They have direct control, you are wrong in making that statement.

inca!

Pick those toys up now, do you hear!! Now, or you will receive a good smack!!

That's better. Now no more tantrums please. :}

Mike well done – I personally find it increasingly hard to raise the energy to refute any of the rubbish that appears on these NJE threads.

Pprune Towers – I think that as a moderator it would be better to let others throw the rocks. Would it not be more appropriate for you to post anonymously if you wish to censure a particular company? Mike’s analogy seems fair.

Mike Jenvey,
Are your contract based to Portugal? How much is tax and national security charges there for average NJE pilot?
Nikolai

Mike J

Bravo for another concise post.

Long live Pprune and it's threads. Fantastic fun this cranial jousting.

I'm sure that you like me have noticed that the mudslinging children NEVER answer any questions raised by us or the other pro NJE "contract loser-pilots". Quite a valuable pointer to their collective intelligence, wouldn't you say??

Have to say that I don't include 4HP in that group as at least he voices his opinion without resorting to name calling and immaturity.

Anyway, ignorance is bliss etc......

Immoderate Moderators
 

"Pprune Towers – I think that as a moderator it would be better to let others throw the rocks. Would it not be more appropriate for you to post anonymously if you wish to censure a particular company? Mike’s analogy seems fair."
I echo that comment. Pprune Towers should be neutral. I have met a number of NJE crews in my work and have never heard anything bad about NJE from them. And no I do not work for them (well not directly!)
I suggest that Pprune Towers "moderates". After all some of his comments could cause our beloved board more problems than non-Pprune "staff" in the closed Ryanair thread. Isn't it Danny's argument that comments posted are not forum policy but individuals views, what about a disclaimer for immoderate moderators?

Mike,

Thank you for your replies. Yes, Japan in a GV would be fantastic but I am sure I would have to wait a long time for that to happen. NJE sounds like a great place to be to me. Perhaps it is not such a great place for some people, but flying great bizjets to a wide variety of destinations and having a somewhat reliable schedule sounds like a good situation.

I'm sold!

Kopeloi.
Despite asking twice I see, no-one, least of all our dear friend Mike wants to answer. Therefore I will.
No. You do not have a contract with Netjets, you have a contract with a bank in the Cayman Islands, or Bermuda, or Isle of Man, or anywhere else they can put you offshore and away from Portugal!
Why do you suppose this is?
So who exactly are you employed by? A Bank in the Cayman islands? Oh, it's payday. And your money comes from Switzerland. Which is where another company that owns the aircraft live, not Netjets, not Portugal. But you work for a Portuguese company right? Paying Portuguese taxes or your own local taxes?:confused: Arn't we all?
The term "time bomb" springs to mind.
Hope that answers your question.

That's exactly what I was afraid of. You are right, it is a time bomb! Unreal, 2004 and living and working in EU without any formal setup.
Kopeloi

Happy jack..

timebomb??? This is the only AAA rated aviation company in the world. Just look for the word Warren Buffet on the internet and you will find out that he also owns Flight Safety...

I used to be working for RYR and they bought a good British company under british rule (KLm Uk) and were able to screw crews out of their last penny... What I am trying to say is that it it is not what it seems that is important but why it is constructed that way. So do your research on that!

Most of KLM it's widebody aircraft are owned by Japanese companies.. why: tax breaks! The exact reason for Netjets to put their aircraft in Swiss or the guys with the CL604 to open a Delaware company in the US while the aircraft is Germany based!

On the tax base I know of many pilots who want to move their taxbase away from shore. The pilots at KLM tried (well some of them) to get paid abroad but the tax man stopped them because they had no overseas base and the T&G's in Shannon did not count (they seriously tried this to become Ireland "based"). The main attraction for me to apply was that as they have no fixed base I did not have to pay the 52% income tax for the Netherlands while living there and do more than 50% of my work abroad!

So again, do your home work please...:8

AAA ?
 

We can all sleep safely in our beds knowing that the American Automobile Assosiation has given this unique accolade to this company. It has also given that rating to several washing machines.........

and as for owning Flight Safety, well, that keeps it all nicely in house doesn't it ?

Contracts based in unusual parts of the world, making it very difficult to take action against the other party, now why do you think it is felt necessary to do that ?

The phrase not worth the the paper........ springs to mind.

justwheny................ you have a major chip on your shoulder sir. Four posts, all bitter & twisted. I'm not taking sides but I'll humor your ignorance on AAA ratings - plug AAA & rate or ratings into Google or another search engine & get an education.

And anymore whinging and whining without substantiation will result in your loss of privileges.

4HP

thank you sir
 

My opinions, as well as yours are, sir, are equally valid, I would suggest. The threat of losing my privileges, leaves me in awe of your power.

This forum is for rumour, even some humour, not a forum for heavy handed threatening bullying statements from piqued moderators.

Nothing I have contributed to this thread is untrue. Whinging, no, stating what I know to be true, yes.

As your questioning my education, you certainly have absloutely no right to do that.

Do your job, and stop the bullying tactics.

Seven weeks and approaching 5 pages from LVL CHG's original posting......

He asked a few straight forward enough questions.

IMHO he got his answers and certainly a few he didn't ask for!
Any chance this topic might fade away as it is rapidly becoming as tiresome as the last one on NJE?

:zzz: :zzz:


:)

All :O for me at NJE.

enough said :ok:

Well said Hostie,

I agree completely. That's why I've stopped getting involved.

Thank god for small miracles.

Type On Licence ?
 

Can some well informed person tell me if having one of Netjets " Light Types" on your licence makes any difference these days with regard to gaining employment with them....or not ?

( Loads of hours with Corporate & Airline background, but none of their types on my licence. I have made a few enquiries & am getting slightly conflicting feedback).

Thanks In Anticipation.

Mercuray

Not 100% well informed because I resigned a while ago but I believe they still recruit the person/background and not the rating.

There's been some crap on this thread and there's been some painful truths. I was in the comapny and I'm not bitter and twisted but here are some home truths:

Then - Contract originated from Caymen Islands based on Isle of Man contract law (ie little, or no, worker protection)
Now - Solid UK contract

Then - No BALPA/Union support
Now - BALPA roster agreement and support

Then - 14 days off per year (for first 2 years)
Now - 35 days off PLUS 8 days bank holiday plus day off either side of leave taken.

Then - Scheduling messing around with FTL's
Now - No messing around as BALPA would be in like a rat up a drainpipe

Then - Flying brand new well equipped aircraft BUT Fleet Manager had to be consulted before defects put in the tech log.
Now - Flying brand new aircraft and the Captain decides what to put in the tech log and when.

Then - Flying to loads of different airfields IFR/VFR but with v.little or no time off
Now - Fly to only 13 destinations on three continents but get up to 3 days off

Then - Tick in the box training/recurrent
Now - Professionally conducted trainig - full stop

Then - worked with capable but stressed out pilots
Now - work with capable and relaxed pilots

Any regrets? You must be joking!

One of my "Then"'s above was Scheduling messing around with FTL's. Whilst I know that NJE is not a UK AOC holder CAP371, the UK CAA document for Avoidance of Fatigue in Aircrews, is generally accepted in the industry as best practice.

Imagine my surprise when Mike Jenvey posted a reply on a different forum quoting and linking CAP371.

So Mike and the rest of NJE just to remind you what CAP371 has to say on positioning:

"'Positioning'
The practice of transferring crew from place to place as passengers in surface or air transport at the behest of an operator.

11.1 All time spent on positioning at the behest of an operator shall count as duty, but positioning does not count as a sector when calculating the FDP."

Wrong Sisters

Nice really good post.
Incidentally what does CAP371 have to say about paid vacation days. Ie. definition thereof ?
Mike Jenvey any of yout rose tinted cheerleading on this ?

MJ Sorry if I have reading difficulties I'm obviously not as well educated as you. So let me rephrase "Then" ([n] that time; that moment;) ie when I worked for NJE. "Now" ([n] the momentary present; ) ie. my current company.

Haffa

You've got me going now ....

Vacation/CAP371 - does not cover as not relevant

Vacation v NJE Contract

Contract based on Isle of Man Law?

"5. Holidays and holiday pay
You are entitled to 25 days paid holiday in a full holiday year. The holiday year runs from 1 April to 31 March.......You are entitled to 10 paid public/ bank holidays per year."
Click here for full document So how come NJE only offer 14 days?

If its based on Cayman Isand Law, where I can find no reference to holiday entitlement, take a peek at the new Employment Law 2004 which states:
Standard Work
9 hours – day
37.5 hours – 40 hours in any 168 hours
How does NJE marry this up with the 55 hour max duty week?
Click here for full document

Picking & cherry springs to mind!

Lets face it big multi nationals are good at avoiding tax and good at avoiding employees rights. Now where was I before I scribbled this? Oh forgot I'm on leave - 21 days taken this year and 22 days left!

CAP371
 

Guys,

What on earth has CAP371 to do with INAC regulations?

Its comparing apples and peanuts.


Wrong Sisters,
What are you trying to achieve with this stuff about vacationdays regarding NJE?

Cheers,
B

NJE complies fully with FDR as stated in JAR OPS 1 and INAC.

Anybody who claims different does not know.

Positionings to and from home are paid by the company.
When working for any other comany and living abroad you position in your own time and on own expense !

If you do not agree with the contract; well...do not sign and leave.

If you do not know where you talk about do not smash any mud against NJE.

Thank you moderators to show your real personallity by commenting the way you did in this topic.

It's a shame....but shows your real level !

Who me? What I do wrong this time - I didn't even open my mouth.

4HP

I agree with mike, nje is a good company to work for. The roster I have is pretty much the same, in summer the roster is more like 6/4 but from sept till may its more like 6/5 or better.

On the average a copilot will get an opportunity for an upgrade within the year. I did an upgrade after 6 months.
Tha passing grade is a bit bettter for guys/girls with previous command experience, but that is something which you can expect I think.

Don't be all negative guys about NJE!!

D.B.

How are aircraft positions allocated to newhires?

Let's say you have the minimum number of hours (most PIC) for any of the aircraft on the line. Is it a matter of need on the fleet or can you be given a choice? What about previous experience in type? In other words, could you (experience permitting) be placed in a Bravo or a GIV depending upon the need at the time? Is there a seat-lock for a number of years after you are placed on that aircraft?

Once you are hired and spent a few years there, do you just bid any aircraft seat you can on larger aircraft or are you expected to move to the LHS of the aircraft you are currently flying?

Cheers

The 'entry level' fleets sell more aircraft so logically that is where most people go.

Most people transfer to one of these fleets for their first command although those with significant time on a given type may move to the LHS.

This is all variable though and depends on nothing more complicated than where pilots are needed.

Pretty happy with the type I got. :)

So, you must have gotten the GIV fleet - nice. From a quality of life perspective (schedules, time on the road, workload), does it make much difference what fleet you get on? Obviously the Falcon and Gulfstreams have flight attendants, but what about schedule and time on the road? Would a newhire on the Bravo have a much different experience than a newhire on a Falcon or Gulfstream?

For the Gulfstream, how much time do you spend away from home per month and what percentage of travel is outside of Europe/Med. (i.e., flights to North America, Asia, etc.)?

GIV? Nooooooooooooo......... :E

The Hawker 800XP is the type!
Almost as fast as a Ducati!:)

Is Bill Bradley still there? What a nice guy. Excel or CVII

Or Paulo Varelo?

Bill retired last week. He's going to grow veggies and show them at the village fete, sit on a park bench and grumble all day:)

Paolo's still around.