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G650 ER real range

Old 14th Feb 2017, 04:30
  #21 (permalink)  
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The flight attendants at my Global 5000/6000 operator do use the forward lav for a rest area when the crew rest area is full of pilots on the 6000 and any time they need to sit down in flight with pax on the 5000. The jump seat is very inconvenient to operate and not particularly comfortable. Augmented flights on the Global aren't all that nice for any of the crew on a Global, but especially brutal on the FAs. I did 11.5 hours on one flight where the poor FA never had a chance to sit outside of takeoff and landing- the pax didn't sleep and had very elaborate meals.
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Old 14th Feb 2017, 06:09
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Hang on, the FA's use the lavatory as a 'rest area' ?!
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Old 14th Feb 2017, 09:59
  #23 (permalink)  
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Thanks all for the feedback, please don't get into duty time limits, it's not the place to, this is a technical question.

So, the 7500nm limit can be reached with proper conditions? I mean, not with 100kts headwind and so but with an average route wind and temperature.
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Old 14th Feb 2017, 10:18
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Absolutely the G650ER will make its 7500nm range and then some. If you throw in winds then we can talk about one particular Vegas company that did over 8000

J
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Old 14th Feb 2017, 22:10
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Lear60fellow,

Not to be argumentative, but crew rest facility is every bit as important as the aircrat's range. What good is the plane with an exhausted crew?

GF
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Old 15th Feb 2017, 00:51
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Originally Posted by galaxy flyer
Good for you, Lucky8888, but that's not common.

GF
I didn't say it was.
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Old 15th Feb 2017, 09:46
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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Absolutely the G650ER will make its 7500nm range and then some
This is correct.

With apologies to Lear60fellow, who doesn't like the thread drift - does anyone do/contemplate 24 hour duty day with 3 pilots (eg augmented) in a Global or G650 utilising the crew rest?
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Old 15th Feb 2017, 15:42
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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I recently was speaking with a buyer who wanted to do NYC-SYD straight thru with a three pilot crew, return 2 days later as a monthly trip. My operator stopped st 17 hours, planned crew changes often.

GF
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Old 15th Feb 2017, 16:10
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I've seen a G650 do NFFN-KTEB in 14 or so hours. Most impressive!
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Old 8th Nov 2018, 02:58
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Originally Posted by Booglebox
I've seen a G650 do NFFN-KTEB in 14 or so hours. Most impressive!
I’ve seen g650 doing one stop in 6k nautical miles trips
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Old 8th Nov 2018, 13:08
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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It amazes me how no real crew rest is built into a 7500nm machine.

With that kind of flight time an augmented crew is the safest or am I wrong?

An owner will spend 70 mil on an aircraft but not consider the ultimate safety of the flight? Part 91 ops you could have a crew flying silly times!

Charter ops well what’s the point of a long range aircraft if you have to stop to change crew?

Even the ACJ320NEO doesn’t seem to have real crew rest standard.

Or am I just thinking to much? Or drinking to much good Whisky while posting?
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Old 8th Nov 2018, 23:29
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Global Aviator
Even the ACJ320NEO doesn’t seem to have real crew rest standard.


I don't think there IS such a thing as a "standard" ACJ. There is so many possible configs that there could be all sorts of facilities.
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Old 9th Nov 2018, 01:20
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by flyboyike
I don't think there IS such a thing as a "standard" ACJ. There is so many possible configs that there could be all sorts of facilities.
Very fair point indeed. What I should have said is the fit outs and proposed fit outs I’ve seen does not include crew rest.

I really do feel it is a real issue that will only grow as range increases.

Yes it costs money, however as I’ve said as a pax isn’t the well being of the people responsible to keep things safe paramount? The current answer is.......

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Old 9th Nov 2018, 04:52
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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I could show you some 747 or 787 BBJs that dont have realistic crew rest facilities.... no one ever appears to waste space on them, even with 3 levels used for passenger accommodation
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Old 20th Nov 2018, 03:39
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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Our crew rest is pretty good [G650ER]. It is fwd of the galley across from the fwd lav and has a wood panel door, a lie flat seat/bunk, a window and a TV/monitor. Easy to get a few zzzz's. As a part 91 operator we are limited by company policy and common sense rather than FARs. Usually use 2 pilots up to about 12 hours and then add a 3rd depending on all the relevant factors. I personally prefer not to use a 3rd because you get there with 3 tired pilots but it makes sense for the long ones. As for the range- I came from a G550 and the longest leg we've put on our new 650 is 13.4. She will go a lot farther than that.
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Old 13th Dec 2018, 21:04
  #36 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Global Aviator
It amazes me how no real crew rest is built into a 7500nm machine.

With that kind of flight time an augmented crew is the safest or am I wrong?

An owner will spend 70 mil on an aircraft but not consider the ultimate safety of the flight? Part 91 ops you could have a crew flying silly times!

Charter ops well what’s the point of a long range aircraft if you have to stop to change crew?

Even the ACJ320NEO doesn’t seem to have real crew rest standard.

Or am I just thinking to much? Or drinking to much good Whisky while posting?
Was just looking at data on the G7500 and thought the same. There’s no chance you’ll be able to operate these jets on European AOCs getting max duties out of a 3 pilot crew as the rest facilities availabe don’t actually qualify as such.

CP
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Old 13th Dec 2018, 22:03
  #37 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by CaptainProp


Was just looking at data on the G7500 and thought the same. There’s no chance you’ll be able to operate these jets on European AOCs getting max duties out of a 3 pilot crew as the rest facilities availabe don’t actually qualify as such.

CP
Errr, why not? I work for a European AOC and the crew rest on our Global allows us to use it as crew rest. The rest area on the 7500 is an improvement on this!
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Old 13th Dec 2018, 23:51
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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With Class 1 rest facilities max duty with 3 pilots can be extended to 16 hours. None of the crew rest seats / facilities that I have personally seen in Global / Gulfstream aircraft have even complied with Class 3 rest facilities. That doesn’t mean they don’t exist of course, but I think a lot of EU operators are just dodging these regulations and using whatever seats / rest facilities (or even jumpseats!) they have without actually complying.

CP
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Old 14th Dec 2018, 06:10
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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The standard Global crew rest is a lie flat seat in a cubicle where light is controlled. The only area for debate is whether it is sufficiently isolated to qualify as Class 1.

As it has a certified ‘acoustic screen’ between it and the galley, isolating it from the crew and passengers, it qualifies as Class 1.

Even a conservative operator can qualify it as class 2. Yes it’s not in the same league as the Boeing 777 crew rest area for example but it provides a perfectly adequate sleeping space.
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Old 14th Dec 2018, 09:20
  #40 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by CaptainProp
[...], but I think a lot of EU operators are just dodging these regulations and using whatever seats / rest facilities (or even jumpseats!) they have without actually complying.

CP
Cannot confirm - but maybe depends on your national CAA.
Before you can use those extensions you need to get an approval for them from your CAA - at least in my EASA state.
I was involved in a few of these and they were quite strict about what qualifies as class 1, 2 or 3 crew rest. Even with on site inspections - pictures not always did the job!
Compliance of FDT were checked in audits, especially on those a/c without class 1 crew rest.
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