Small GA for business use?

[fanda78]

Hi guys,
I run small consultancy business for airlines and time to time is better for me to use privately share owned PA28 rather than car or airline ie: flight from East Midlands to Newquay and back allows me to leave EMA early morning, work most of the day and be back in EMA for dinner - this would be rather difficult by car.
Is anyone using this type of travel for business and if so, how do you bring this in to the books?

[V1 VR V2]

I would also be interested in this as in a similar position. I would like to know how feasible it would be to operate Cirrus type SEP aircraft for a taxi operation in the UK and what the DOC would be for this type.

[bingofuel]

SEP aircraft for a taxi operation in the UK

Well you would be limited to daytime VFR with a single, need I say anymore with our weather!

[fanda78]

Why?

Thanks for your reply but I am not taking fare paying passengers and I am IR rated (so is the airplane IFR capable) also as a pilot, I am not rewarded for this flight...

...and question was how I bring it in to books...
cheers :-)F

[julian_storey]

There appear to be two threads in one here - hence the confusion.

The OP has an accountancy query regarding the operation of his own aircraft for his own business purposes.

Another poster wants to set up an air taxi operation with a Cirrus

[V1 VR V2]

Thank you for the reply i understand the SE night flying rule for commercial ops but i didn’t realise it was limited to daytime VFR only? Is this the case and you can’t fly IFR Day ops?

[fanda78]

whoops

Yes you are right Julian!
Sorry guys I have misread my own thread - anyway - back to question - does anyone uses privet plane for business travel and if so how do you bring it in to accounting books?

cheers Fanda78

[PLovett]

I would have thought your accountant would be better placed to answer your question given the variety of tax laws between countries.

[fanda78]

sure - you are right but

but I am asking how other people do it.

cheers Fanda78

[micsve]

How we do it in Sweden

I dont know about UK but in Sweden it works like this:

the company rent the plane from the owner.
The owner sends a invoice which includes the amount of fuel used (important), The company pays the invoice to the owner, you send a paper to the tax office reclaiming the fueltax on the fuel used for the businesstrip (it is only fuel used for leisure flights that you need to pay taxes for) If the owner has a VAT number the company can withdraw the VAT as well...

[flynowpaylater]

Hi Fanda,

Pretty much normal rules apply. Invoices and paper trail is a must. All landing fees, fuel upflifts (I presume you take the A/C dry?) can simply be claimed as an expense, and then get the group administrator to raise an invoice for the tacho time at the agreed rate to your company.

The one big disadvantage is the weather. More than once I've sat in a meeting that I've flown to, more worried about the front that's moving in, than the contents of the meeting. Be careful not to put pressure on yourself to fly. The meeting may be mega important, but the conditions to fly not favourable or perhaps marginal. You must very clearly take your business hat off, and you pilot hat on. Be careful.

[hingey]

Fanda, check your PMs

h

[fanda78]

Thnaks Micsve, Flynowpaylater and Hingey!
These are valuable inputs and good starting point for me.
I have used SEP for couple business trips in past months but have to make sure it is legitimate for taxman.

If anyone else is in same situation, please share your experience.

cheers Fanda78

[Genghis the Engineer]

I do something very similar - in my case a choice of two 4-seater shares at Booker and Cranfield, each of which works out a little over GBP100/hr. I claim back from my employer at standard HMRC rates as if driven. I take a small financial hit and also accept the risk of occasionally having to spend a night in a hotel at my own cost. The payback for me is the flying and the time I get back.

For example last month I had two meetings in a day at Prestwick, flew there and back in the day - ending up down about 150 quid, but gained by about 6 hours flying and an extra night in my own bed. To me, and my boss, that's an okay set of outcomes.

A couple of further thoughts. (1) CAA allow their own staff to use light aircraft for business travel. Is it possible to find out what their staff policy is, since that must surely be acceptable elsewhere. (2) I wonder if there's scope for a cost share /seat share network of people who use light aircraft for business trips. I've certainly done this informally with a friend who works elsewhere but occasionally has business trips to the same place that can be made to co-incide.

G

[hingey]

Genghis,

I can't speak for the CAA's own policy, but I recall that sharing business travel in a light aircraft is permissable so long as the staff are not obliged to travel by air and are offered an alternative means of transport. Took a quick look in the ANO but couldn't find the paragraph I was after...

h

[fanda78]

My accountants view on this is...

That best way to bring this expense in to accounting is to rent AC from club by hour and in that case you can even claim VAT
In my particular case where I privately own share in plane is to use club rate for same model and multiply it by tacho hours. in this situation I should NOT claim VAT.
It is answer I did not expect but as he signs off my accounts I will obey.

[Gulfstreamaviator]

beware taxable benefit

in UK, if a director, or senior staff member uses the company aircraft for travel, either private, business, or to keep current to facilitate company business flying, there is a POTENTAL for a charge as taxable benefit considered.

The revenus consider that you gained hours, at the companies expense....., also beware any recurrent training, if the company owns the asset, ie aircraft.....

been there got the T shirt...

glf

[fanda78]

Thanks

Thanks for valid point! - it does not apply to me as I own the share privately but it might apply to others...