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Can your bizjet be better?

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Can your bizjet be better?

Old 31st Mar 2006, 19:14
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Can your bizjet be better?

Good Afternoon...

I am with a major modficiation company (who shall remain nameless).

We are trying to identify "shortcomings" in various popular bizjets that might be an opportunity for us to develop modifications to address these issues. An example would be flat panel displays on various older jets (which we are already doing).

Of course...it would have to be an issue that is significant enough to be marketable.

Any of you biz jet drivers have any suggestions on what could make your plane better?

Note: I'm soliciting ideas...not your business.

Thanks
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Old 31st Mar 2006, 19:24
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How about a full glass cockpit and a FADEC upgrade for the Lockheed Jetstar?
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Old 31st Mar 2006, 19:39
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Jetstar Upgrade

Well...that might be an interesting upgrade.

Of course, the value of the airframe would have to support the value of the program. Depending on the "glass cockpit", it can easily run over $500K.

Do you fly a Jetstar?
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Old 31st Mar 2006, 20:15
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A marketable thing: make a mod to make a Citation break down roughly the same as an average 73... Citations are cr*p from a reliability point of view...
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Old 1st Apr 2006, 00:36
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Originally Posted by Biz Jet Engineer
Well...that might be an interesting upgrade.


Do you fly a Jetstar?
No, but I always wanted to.
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Old 1st Apr 2006, 04:31
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Then swap out the four motors on that Jetstar for four Trent 900s. Dunno where you'd put the fuel, but she'd be a looker.
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Old 1st Apr 2006, 05:39
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Originally Posted by trainer too 2
A marketable thing: make a mod to make a Citation break down roughly the same as an average 73... Citations are cr*p from a reliability point of view...
i suspect you refer to an operation where they are flown 1000hrs a year by a new crew every few days - they weren't designed for this. 300 hours a year more like -
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Old 1st Apr 2006, 12:12
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Nope 250 a year and lost 3 owner flights due to trivial stuff like nav lights breaking and getting no responses out of Paris during the weekend on tech stuff
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Old 1st Apr 2006, 19:05
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Citations do seem to have a good deal of trouble with avionics as well as interiors, even the low houred ones.
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Old 1st Apr 2006, 20:58
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Citations are made out of meringue and chocolate.

Any part that was built to move will come off in your hand and any part that wasn't built to move will first move....................and then come off in your hand.
 
Old 1st Apr 2006, 22:07
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slightly better than a mitsubishi diamond...........
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Old 2nd Apr 2006, 11:44
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Originally Posted by scambuster
slightly better than a mitsubishi diamond...........
Changing it's name a few times didn't help then?
 
Old 2nd Apr 2006, 12:45
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I flew quite a few hours on MU300 and it sure did work well on those years. Only reason to change was the need of larger jet.
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Old 2nd Apr 2006, 20:20
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Ah the world of BIZJETS.

A "tougher" citation...great idea...how hard would it be to have double nav lights, MEL'able to just one on each wing? On the old DC9, we had two nav lights (uncolored) beneath each colored wing lens.

A retrofit to a AIRLINER hardend ciation...hmmm.


I wish you could just build brand new NorthAmerican - Rockwell Sabreliners...maybe a more fuel efficent engine but no big changes!

with all the over-runs (thinking carlsbad, calif) a gadget to say (after touchdown) 2000 feet to stop with current braking! (of course the pilot would have to know that there was only 1000 feet left).

good luck with your ideas and remember digital isn't always better! Hey how about modifying pressure vessels to allow a 3000 foot cabin at 35,000ft?

j
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Old 3rd Apr 2006, 09:43
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trainer two too - so aircraft breaks an carnt get a mech to fix them easy - have a pilot who is also lic engineer on board - and yes i fit the bill if youve got any jobs ;-) !
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Old 3rd Apr 2006, 12:25
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Some good ideas...

Thank you all for you input...

I hear you on the Citation stuff. The Citation is obviously a very...ahem..shall we say "cost efficiently" constructed aircraft (like a 421 with turbo's). Unfortuantely, I don't have any immediate ideas on how you can make the whole airplane more reliable.

We have been involved in major Citation (C501/551) mods. We have STC'd a glass cockpit (2 or 3 tube). Also, we've changed the entire avionics packages out to the current generation Garmins (430/53).

I don't really know that this addresses the pieces coming off in you hand issue..

Is there any one particular area of the Citation that could be addressed?

On the Jetstar subject....

I agree that there are a lot of things that could be done to a Jetstar. However, the population is getting smaller and smaller (generally due to corrosion issues) and that makes it hard to do a major, cost efficient upgrade.

I've seen several Jetstars enter our hangar for an inspection and leave on the back of a flat bed truck.....
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Old 3rd Apr 2006, 14:26
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I think the UAV guys have been working on the MOD I'm after.

Phil
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Old 3rd Apr 2006, 18:40
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For the HS 125 hydraulic flight controls would be nice . But seriously: on the newer Hawkers (anything between 800 and 1000) bleed air wing anti ice instead of this annoying TKS stuff would be worth a thought, as well as automated cabin pressurization.

Concerning glass cockpit retrofits: I am not under the impression that owners are willing to pay this kind of money right now since the only ones who benefit from this are the flight crews - and which owner cares about flight crews. But maybe they will be in 3 or 4 years when virtually every new or like new aircraft is fitted with a glass cockpit.

Last edited by N68242-XP; 3rd Apr 2006 at 19:59.
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Old 3rd Apr 2006, 23:32
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No curent robot could cope with the quirks of a Seneca II, Phil!
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Old 11th Apr 2006, 13:09
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Thanks for your comments

I've been away a bit recently traveling...

Thank you all for your comments.

Regarding the glass cockpits. Yes, it does seem that MOST of the advantage is to the crew and not the check writer. However...there can be advantages to the owner as well.

In many cases, the increased value of the aircraft (from blue book values) can reflect a significant recoup of the expenditures. In some cases, it is over 100%.

Also, the increase in situational awareness afforded can be a major safety enhancement.

Also, the lowered costs of maintenance on the mechanical instruments along with increased reliability / dispatchability can be an attractive selling point to the owner.
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