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-   -   Harry Goodman -Air Europe/ILG (https://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia/606464-harry-goodman-air-europe-ilg.html)

chevvron 24th Mar 2018 17:48

The name of the tour company was Intasun not Intersun.

rog747 24th Mar 2018 18:14

WHBM

AE's first and perhaps not well known orders (perhaps even just MofU's) for wide bodies goes way back to the very early 80's when they had a deal with BA for leasing back and buying aircraft - hence the ref to an order for a RR 747-200B (a -236?)

re the MDD order for a DC-10 30 again in 1980 or thereabouts the DC-10 was still in production

the AE MD11 orders came much later in 1989 for a 93 delivery with RR power

canberra97 24th Mar 2018 19:10


Originally Posted by rog747 (Post 10095571)
WHBM

AE's first and perhaps not well known orders (perhaps even just MofU's) for wide bodies goes way back to the very early 80's when they had a deal with BA for leasing back and buying aircraft - hence the ref to an order for a RR 747-200B (a -236?)

re the MDD order for a DC-10 30 again in 1980 or thereabouts the DC-10 was still in production

the AE MD11 orders came much later in 1989 for a 93 delivery with RR power

The Air Europe Wikipedia page says exactly the same as your post regarding the RR powered B742 so there must be some truth to it.

rog747 24th Mar 2018 19:17

canberra97
LOL - yes i just read that too -
ta, I handled AE for a few years at LGW until their sad demise and heard all sorts of stories and we saw loads of subbing and leasing both in and out with all parts of the IAG group then - I think the BA747 RR order may have been def credible - not sure about the DC10 order although I knew the MDD rep at LHR and LGW quite well when i was with BMA and he knew about it
the licences were not forthcoming so that was that

back in the early 80's I chartered several series of AE for our tour op division - very nice accommodating bunch - brand new planes and superb on board service - pax loved it

WHBM 24th Mar 2018 20:33

I'm still surprised about any ex BA 747/RRs being leased out in the early 1980s. BA had a considerable need for these aircraft for longer haul routes where their original 747s did not have the capability (California/JNB/Far East nonstops), but they were severely restricted by government ownership on capital expenditure to about two new frames a year, when they wanted more.

The BA/AE 757 arrangement that came along in 1983-5 allowed AE to charter out their new 757 capacity in winter, while BA aircraft went the other way in summer. The upside for BA was the much more efficient 757 during the winter; in the summer and shoulders when the 757s went away they reinstated their much less fuel efficient Tridents, the last of which were withdrawn at the end of 1985 which coincided with the end of the arrangement. There must have been some sort of "by the hour" charging as the AE 757s seemed to dominate on BA's shortest 757 sector, the Shuttle from Heathrow to Manchester.

rog747 25th Mar 2018 09:48


Originally Posted by WHBM (Post 10095707)
I'm still surprised about any ex BA 747/RRs being leased out in the early 1980s. BA had a considerable need for these aircraft for longer haul routes where their original 747s did not have the capability (California/JNB/Far East nonstops), but they were severely restricted by government ownership on capital expenditure to about two new frames a year, when they wanted more.

The BA/AE 757 arrangement that came along in 1983-5 allowed AE to charter out their new 757 capacity in winter, while BA aircraft went the other way in summer. The upside for BA was the much more efficient 757 during the winter; in the summer and shoulders when the 757s went away they reinstated their much less fuel efficient Tridents, the last of which were withdrawn at the end of 1985 which coincided with the end of the arrangement. There must have been some sort of "by the hour" charging as the AE 757s seemed to dominate on BA's shortest 757 sector, the Shuttle from Heathrow to Manchester.

British Airtours had a 747-236 RR which they had delivered brand new from Boeing which went back to mainline - could have been that one marked for AE?

brakedwell 25th Mar 2018 11:32

Regarding rumours, I was with AE from start to finish. Peter Phillips, the engineering director, visited Rome to inspect a couple of Alitalia 747/200's when I was on the 737/200 in 1981 or 82, but that came to nothing.
I can't remember DC10's ever being talked about, unless they were a result of the BCAL take-over that never happened. ISTR remember some of us thought the MD11 was a bit of a gamble and going for B767-300's would have been a better bet.


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