Thanks megan.
I understand that the original BHP/AIS series 1 gave years of satisfactory service in the remote and rugged areas of NW Australia.
After it came to grief, the only viable replacement was seen to be another Twin Pin, the series 3, VH-AIS, mentioned earlier.

It is the OP's aircraft I remember at Staverton. Where is it located now?

https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5157/1...cfcba42a_b.jpg

Reportedly in storage (in a dismantled state?) along with other members of the Air Atlantique Classic Flight at Compton Verney (Warwickshire).

'ZHJ is/was stored by Air Atlantique for spares, presumably at Coventry. The nose in the pic looks like LN-BFK which was likely scrapped for spares at Staverton.


Also recollect pics of a Twin Pin, probably at Farnborough circa 1960, that had "Elephant's Ears" on its wingtips, presumably some sort of aerial survey kit. Can't see anything immediately on line

Yes, it was previously in store just off the airport (fittingly, at the former Alvis works).

I do remember a couple of Twin Pioneers parked up at Shobdon. Some interest here - Air Pulford - Twin Pioneer XM285 / G-AYFA

(Is Neville Martin still operating, always had some interesting stuff?).

I never experienced any problems with the "small" wheels, having landed on soft sand many times. One of our Tin Pins nosed over on Sir Abu Nu'ayr Island after an embedded rock caused a swing and it nosed over when the pilot braked too hard while correcting it. The Twin Pin in photos 3 & 4 show the distance covered in a flapless landing.

The flaps and slats were inoperative (locked up with blocks of wood jubilee clipped into the runners). The reason - sand clogged up the Hydro/mechanical Heath Robinson bicycle chain and cog mechanism until a chain snapped. It happened twice to me when the flaps and slats were retracted after take of, one side came up and the other didn't move! Quickly reselecting T/Off F/S saved the day. It was the only near serviceable Twin Pin at the time and the aircraft was urgently needed to support and re-supply the SAS operating in South Oman, so we flew it for two weeks in this condition. What nobody realised was that the only auto hydraulic bleed was in the flap/slat system. The brakes became more and more spongy and before landing the pedals had to be pumped to build up pressure. After several days this began to lose it's ineffectiveness, so I took the aircraft to Bait al Falaj for the Airwork to look into the fading brake problem and they discovered the auto bleed was idle. After landing the brakes failed completely and we ran off the end of the runway, rumbled slowly down a shallow incline and ended up in the Colonel Smiley's back garden. No damage done, fortunately. After that we had to visit Bait every three days for Airwork to bleed the brakes.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c3...psd0aa4077.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c3...psb392230b.jpg

Soft sands no problem.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c3...inpinSOman.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c3.../TPSASOman.jpg

134brat. This 8mm film I took during 1959-61 shows the Twin Pioneer at work in Muscat and Oman. During the two years I flew it the old girl never let me down.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3cnU-6YcPs

August 1958, I watched a Ceylon AF Pioneer, on acceptance test at PWK, stalling speed being less than prevailing headwind, so hovering for a minute or so, seriously steep descent, landing roll about one length.

The main problem with the Skyvan was that every one of the 150 or so was essentially hand-built, and consequently very difficult for Shorts to sell profitably.

#58 Jenkins: World Renown. At >900 sold and now back in production, Twotter is estimable. I am voluble in criticism of UK Aero's lethargy in seeking out oddbod buyers in the boondocks...but Short's sheds were an exception. 149 Skyvan, 141 SD330, 165 SD360 not shabby. None sold to UK Govt., some sold with UK Aid, most sold by going out there and scavenging.

To 1989 UK Govt. owned Shorts and accepted accountant's assessments of "loss" as being acceptable in the interests of a United Kingdom with distinct issues in N.Ireland. DHC was a Canadian Crown Corporation off-and-on, 1943-1992: so neither Twotter not sheds stood on own feet as products dependent on nimble customers. From 1992, Bombardier (a Quebec specialist vehicles business) owned both Shorts and DHC, and chose to Improve the Regional Aircraft line at DHC, and to do other things at Shorts.

I observed Shorts 1984 sale of 8 360 to China: some were placed in Wuhan, then a backwater. The deal was done by ex-Britten Norman Islander marketeer David Dixon, who understood Product Support to an extent then abnormal for Brit aeronauts. He caused his employer to be seen to care.

You are of course right....that if more UK folk had shown more care...this was the sole simple reason for Fokker selling 786 F-27 in terrain where others feared to tread.

Tornadoken:

I have to take issue - at the expense of a slight thread drift - with your assertion that UK Aero whoever they are or were was lethargic in seeking out buyers in the boondocks. As one who was employed to sell British aircraft around the world, I can assure you that this was not the case. 748s to Madagascar, The Marshall Islands, Guyana, The Azores. 146s to The Faroe Islands, Uzbekistan, Bhutan. 125s to Russia and Turkmenistan. These were just the successful ones - there were many which came to nought after months of trying. There are many on this forum who, with due respect, could not find half these places on a map. There was nowhere we feared to tread - I even went to Cuba a couple of times - but many places where we wished we hadn't. I have just written a book on this very subject!

Barry, I would like to hear more about your book; you may have invited me to fly to some of the 'unlikely' candidate airfields.

As for the Twin Pin, I only managed one flight, which was best described as requiring the skills of an organist with all the 'stops' and lever manipulation.
It's complete speed range appeared to be less than the landing speed of a previous type.

The Dart Herald was another commercial failure, nice to fly, but only 40 built. I attended a dining in night at RAF Northwood in 1961 when Sir Frederick Handley Page gave a rather bitter speech. HP had refused to join two new consolidated Aviation Groups, BAC and Hawker Sddely I think and the Herald had been side lined in favour of the HS 748/Andover for the RAF.
Back to the thread. The speed range of the TP in the Gulf area was 45kts to 85kts, 90 if you managed to close the cooling gills a bit.

Looking at all those pictures the Twin Pin would have been better with big wheels and tyres like the DC3?

Grateful thanks to everyone who has been kind enough to reply, particularly brakedwell, megan and barry lloyd. I have a whole lot more to work with now and will be following up many of the leads.

I am reliably informed that the Pioneer accident at Farnborough happened because the pilot had been demonstrating the ability of the aircraft to get airborne across the runway and caught the elevator on a light at the runway edge.

Re. the wire guided missiles: The Twin Pin did use them operationally but there were also trials with the Nord AS30 on the Pioneer, images of which can be seen in the Hikoki publication Flight testing at Boscombe Down, The Cold War Years. The book is still available to buy but only at silly prices!

I've one story to tell about the Twin Pioneer, but it's a rather sad one.

Apparently some CCF cadets went up for an Air Experience flight in one - I think the year was 1966, and the airfield may have been Odiham. At the end of the flight, they got out of the aircraft, but one of them turned the wrong way - into the propeller, which was still rotating.

I do have 1 picture of a Twin Pioneer at Hervey Bay Airport, Queensland some time during 1991-1995. Unfortunately I can't tell you anything about it or even the Registration but if you'd like a copy of the picture email me on tiplerpaul1 (at) gmail.com

If small wheels were seen as a disadvantage one imagines they'd have looked at alternatives. Designers do their thing and come up with their idea of an optimum before any customer has had a chance to try it - if it isn't changed perhaps it wasn't necessary.

Adding drag and weight to a Twin Pin probably wasn't going to be popular no matter what else it improved.

We used to land the Pembrokes with much smaller wheels on soft sand strips. Only once did I get into difficulties, caused by the nose wheels digging in and forming a bow wave of sand. We had to use half a dozen passenger seat cushions to form a "taxiway", rotating them forward until I reached a firmer surface. Happy (hot) days!