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-   -   LUTON History and Nostalgia (https://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia/527527-luton-history-nostalgia.html)

Discorde 1st Sep 2018 09:22

The BY Munich flights (140A/104B) on 29/07/79 were possibly two halves of W-patterns. My log book shows I was the F/O on the inbound. The duty for us was NCL-MUC-LTN. The a/c was 'RL, BAL's first 737 and the Capt was Bob Stockholm.

thegypsy 1st Sep 2018 10:28

rog 747

Well remember Mykonos starting as was by then LGW based and got checked out to operate there. It was just 4200 ft long and 30m wide and no fuel in those days so one had to arrive with enough to get to Athens to refuel. It was always windy whenever I went there which made it interesting.

Level bust 1st Sep 2018 10:35

I flew to Munich with Britannia on the 9th Aug 1979, Flt No; By123A out and back on the 16th as BY123B, GAXNA both times. The flight was a Thomson Holidays package holiday to the Austrian Tyrol. Innsbruck was closer but that was the time that no-one flew there, so a 4 hour coach ride!

rog747 1st Sep 2018 15:08


Originally Posted by thegypsy (Post 10238790)
rog 747

Well remember Mykonos starting as was by then LGW based and got checked out to operate there. It was just 4200 ft long and 30m wide and no fuel in those days so one had to arrive with enough to get to Athens to refuel. It was always windy whenever I went there which made it interesting.

Oh yes!
25-30 knots straight down the runway - land to the North over the beach.
I was with Monarch after BMA in the mid 80's, and JMK JTR and JSI were all IIRC 2 Capt's, plus sometimes an FO, or another skipper being checked out -
All those flights had to plan to pick up fuel at ATH inbound and maybe some catering too, (SKG was the tech stop for the JSI flights inbound)

I recall 737-200's were one of the only jets used from the UK
OM KT BY AE GB KG DA all sent their pocket rockets down there in those days.
I think BIA did use 1-11's to JSI

The Germans, and Scandinavians were sending in Caravelles and DC-9's to JMK at first, possibly the 727-100 but never saw one.
All OA used from ATH was the SH-330...never saw an OA jet there ever.

Best laugh ever - We sent a 737 down to JMK from LGW with the APU U/S one early morning, once there shuts down, but someone forgets to tell Kostas and Spiros we need an airstart...(wasn't me)
Guess what no airstart at JMK - Ooops -
One 737 AOG 24 hours with 130 pax until the following day the LTN-HER drops into JMK on its way south to jump start our stranded LGW 737.
Happy days.

(sorry for going off-piste here but did get LTN mentioned at the end....)

rog747 1st Sep 2018 15:18


Originally Posted by Level bust (Post 10238794)
I flew to Munich with Britannia on the 9th Aug 1979, Flt No; By123A out and back on the 16th as BY123B, GAXNA both times. The flight was a Thomson Holidays package holiday to the Austrian Tyrol. Innsbruck was closer but that was the time that no-one flew there, so a 4 hour coach ride!

Very true!
All used Munich for the Tyrol.

Was it British Eagle that was maybe the last of the Innsbruck users, summer 1968?
Who started INN back up again?
Was it Invicta from LTN with Vanguards?

No one then was using Salzburg ether.
When I was at Northeast in the mid 1970's our LHR Trident Swans Tours charters for Austria went to Munich for the Tyrol, and Zurich for the Vorarlberg region.

Also Thomson had just started to number their BY flights with the same number for both out and home, but just adding A for out, and B for home.

Georgeablelovehowindia 1st Sep 2018 15:49


Originally Posted by rog747 (Post 10238952)
Oh yes!
25-30 knots straight down the runway - land to the North over the beach.
I was with Monarch after BMA in the mid 80's, and JMK JTR and JSI were all IIRC 2 Capt's, plus sometimes an FO, or another skipper being checked out -
All those flights had to plan to pick up fuel at ATH inbound and maybe some catering too, (SKG was the tech stop for the JSI flights inbound)

I recall 737-200's were one of the only jets used from the UK
OM KT BY AE GB KG DA all sent their pocket rockets down there in those days.
I think BIA did use 1-11's to JSI

The Germans, and Scandinavians were sending in Caravelles and DC-9's to JMK at first, possibly the 727-100 but never saw one.
All OA used from ATH was the SH-330...never saw an OA jet there ever.

Best laugh ever - We sent a 737 down to JMK from LGW with the APU U/S one early morning, once there shuts down, but someone forgets to tell Kostas and Spiros we need an airstart...(wasn't me)
Guess what no airstart at JMK - Ooops -
One 737 AOG 24 hours with 130 pax until the following day the LTN-HER drops into JMK on its way south to jump start our stranded LGW 737.
Happy days.

(sorry for going off-piste here but did get LTN mentioned at the end....)

Wrong - there was an ASU at Mikonos - Monarch Ops were at great pains to have Olympic confirm that, before they sent long tall Phil B on his way. On arrival, Phil, being a wise old bird kept no.2 running, descended the airstairs and demanded to see it. However, on viewing it, he failed to ask them to start the thing and hear it trumpeting the sweet music of LP air. Of course, come departure it failed to start, and the debacle commenced. The 'jump start' kit was loaned from Britannia - as was the serviceable APU which was fitted to the aircraft the instant it got back. It's amazing how the MD - Alan Snudden - going ballistic and calling for heads on platters put a stop to something which had been going on for over two weeks.
Happy days, as you say indeed.

Mooncrest 1st Sep 2018 16:27

I've been in aviation for over twenty years and I had no idea it was possible to jump start one aircraft from another. I learn something every day. How's it done ?

DaveReidUK 1st Sep 2018 16:39


Originally Posted by Mooncrest (Post 10238996)
I've been in aviation for over twenty years and I had no idea it was possible to jump start one aircraft from another. I learn something every day. How's it done ?

I've never hear of that either.

Nearest I've come across is where a starter/generator (on a Spey) fails downline and in order to start the engine and get home you remove the S/G from a running engine to temporarily substitute for the dead one.

Georgeablelovehowindia 1st Sep 2018 16:46


Originally Posted by Mooncrest (Post 10238996)
I've been in aviation for over twenty years and I had no idea it was possible to jump start one aircraft from another. I learn something every day. How's it done ?

The 'jump start' kit was fashioned from air start trunking, long enough to pass between the underbellies of two 737s parked side by side. Plug the trunking into the external air supply receptacles of each aircraft, open and close a few valves and hey presto - the 'live' aircraft is giving air to the 'dead' one. It used to be said that what Britannia didn't know about operating 737s wasn't worth knowing anyway.

compton3bravo 1st Sep 2018 19:57

Those movement lists bring back many memories. Started collecting them late 1960s - just send some self addressed envelopes sir and we will do the rest (duty managers office) and they did religiously. Still have some but had to ditch a few after relocating my UK base from Bedfordshire to the south coast. Just one aside and I can laugh now. Had a major row with my wife at the time and she threatened to screw up my latest movements list and I said anything but that! We did laugh about it later. As you can imagine those in that's late 1960s did not have many movements especially during some of the winter months.

Georgeablelovehowindia 1st Sep 2018 20:23


Originally Posted by Georgeablelovehowindia (Post 10239006)
The 'jump start' kit was fashioned from air start trunking, long enough to pass between the underbellies of two 737s parked side by side. Plug the trunking into the external air supply receptacles of each aircraft, open and close few valves and hey presto - the 'live' aircraft is giving air to the 'dead' one. It used to be said that what Britannia didn't know about operating 737s wasn't worth knowing anyway.

Turning back to those daily Luton flight sheets for 11 July 1979, my logbook tells me that I was the first officer on OM2113 LTN-ALC-LTN aircraft type actually 707-123B G-BGCT with the late Captain Martin Lundberg.

rog747 2nd Sep 2018 09:59


Originally Posted by Georgeablelovehowindia (Post 10239103)
Turning back to those daily Luton flight sheets for 11 July 1979, my logbook tells me that I was the first officer on OM2113 LTN-ALC-LTN aircraft type actually 707-123B G-BGCT with the late Captain Martin Lundberg.

Great memories GeorgeAble,
yes OM had by then a mix of 720B and 707-120B's - Did they have the same seating (170Y pax iirc)

and thank you so much for reminding me of the actual Mykonos ASU saga story lol.

Do you know how far the OM 1-11's range went?
I see LTN-Corfu on a May-fly above, with Rimini as the stop inound back to LTN.

thanks

rog747 2nd Sep 2018 10:04


Originally Posted by Georgeablelovehowindia (Post 10239006)
The 'jump start' kit was fashioned from air start trunking, long enough to pass between the underbellies of two 737s parked side by side. Plug the trunking into the external air supply receptacles of each aircraft, open and close a few valves and hey presto - the 'live' aircraft is giving air to the 'dead' one. It used to be said that what Britannia didn't know about operating 737s wasn't worth knowing anyway.

Yes indeed - I cannot recall how they parked the two OM 737's at Mykonos to enable the hoses to hook up back then,
Not confident there were even push tugs nor tow bars then at JMK with OA - but perhaps you can enlighten?...I was asked to go down with the Heraklion 737 if any help was needed but I was not required in the end.

Georgeablelovehowindia 4th Sep 2018 08:39

I think it was a standard config of 179Y, which is one seat less than they cram into an A320 these days, although at the end I see Monarch had reduced it to 174Y.

All the outstations were self manoeve in those days, and there must've been room to park side by side at Mikonos. I was 'excused' Mikonos, being non-training. Funny thing, we stopped going there shortly after.

Naples was max range for the One-Eleven, and it was even more fun trying to get back, where every degree Celsius less and one knot of headwind more was vitally important. Monarch's first female first officer, substantially experienced on the One-Eleven, having flown them with Air Pacific, had the water injection quit shortly after V1, taking off from Naples. Quote: "The next couple of minutes of just about flying were jolly exciting!"

Level bust 4th Sep 2018 09:54

I did a jump seat ride to Faro on a Monarch 1-11, 2:45 going 2:30 coming back. Coming out of Faro with 119 pax down the back, and high temperature, we had to turn left after take off, when everybody else turned right, so we could stagger up to a height over the sea so we could then clear the hills to the North!

SpringHeeledJack 4th Sep 2018 14:00

The performance of the later 1-11's can't have improved much as I remember taking off from Milan-Malpensa on a Dan Air example in 1992/93-ish and we did two climbing circle patterns to be able to legally cross the Alps just to the north. Surprisingly quiet cabin when away from the rear of the aircraft ;-)

cj241101 4th Sep 2018 18:08


Originally Posted by rog747 (Post 10239429)
Great memories GeorgeAble,
yes OM had by then a mix of 720B and 707-120B's - Did they have the same seating (170Y pax iirc)

I joined Monarch in 1977 and can confirm the 170Y config. Although 9ft longer, the 707-123B's G-BFMI and G-BGCT were also fitted 170Y; this so that aircraft changes for whatever reason (usually technical) could be accommodated smoothly. At some stage an extra seat appeared from somewhere, not sure how or where, making them 171Y.

Offchocks 5th Sep 2018 02:50

Great to see those Mayflys. I operated as a FO on the 28thJuly down to Milan with John "Woodright", then the following day down to Alicante with John McLean-Hall, what a great Captain and wonderfully funny fellow John McLean-Hall was... RIP.
Both flights were operated by G-AWWZ which was the aircraft that had a baggage fire in Faro seven years later.
Photo here: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/F..._AN0368961.jpg

dc9-32 5th Sep 2018 07:14

Do you mean John Wheelright ?

rog747 5th Sep 2018 07:29

Did Monarch keep the seat back catering on the 3x 1-11's that they acquired from Court Line...?

Thanks


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