Spitfire/Hurricane etc and drop tanks
interestingly, no other aircraft copied the P51’s design
The proposed Rolls Royce FTB using components from the P-51 would also qualify.
but I'd be interested to know if the resemblance is superficial, or a sincere piece of flattery
Thanks to all for the P-51 headsup, yellow my favourite colour.
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Derby
Whilst its 'interesting' debating the (pro's and cons ) of equipment design, what is far more important is having it available in sufficient numbers to be of use when required. In WW2 the Germans produced two quite outstanding piston fighters that also had engines to match. This is to be expected from the beligerent side as they had planned their requirements beforehand, and we were to a degree always trying to catch up. Of course what they did not plan for was for the war to go on for so long, and then have to contend with the might of the American production effort. Sydney Camm knew his Hurricane could be improved with a thinner wing, however had they tried to do this rather than produce hundreds of 'adequate' machines for the purpose of shooting down bombers, we would not have had enough fighters to defend the country in 1940,and that would have been the end of it. As it was the Hurricane went on to pioneer many other uses in the ground attack role, whilst the Spitfire was better able to be improved to provide the interceptor role. An attacking force has many advantages, but they are also subject to the 'mistake factor' which in itself can dramatically alter events. We were not immune to making mistakes but made less of them when it mattered. The events of 1940 are all important because had we failed then, the machines that came later would not have happened. It took quite some time for the allies to accept that our bombers would be very vulnerable without fighter escort, yet the Germans had learned this lesson the hard way in 1940. We were also vulnerable in only having one fighter engine which also went on to power our later bomber force, and had the Germans realised the importance of that engine I suspect Derby would have been flattened very early on, indeed SH readily admits he was amazed it wasn't.
One bomb did land on Derby, but it missed the factory. It was most probably jettisoned by some aircraft being chased by fighters.
The Luftwaffe target selection could be fairly arbitrary to say the least,once the crews got some 'seniority' in their units (Experten) - whilst they did have to participate in unit attacks - they also were allowed to choose their own targets for a certain percentage of the unit sorties,quite often returning again and again to their chosen/favourite target.
The RAE had an idea to improve the Mustang's Meridith effect. Basically squirt some fuel in the airflow behind the radiator and light it. (not to be tried if the tailwheel can't retract)
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That would have had interesting psychological effects, though who it would have scared most is open to question.
Mistakes !!!!
It is no surprise to me that the Germans did not bomb Derby. They expected to win the war with the UK very quickly, and then take over the assets of the losers. The Rolls-Royce factories would have been very useful, if not essential, to their aim to rule the World. By the time it became obvious that this was not going to be the case, it was too late. I spent most of WWII living about three miles from the R-R factories in Glasgow. It was a wonder to us that night after night while Clydebank was being bombed, never a bomb dropped anywhere near us.
One bomb did land on Derby, but it missed the factory. It was most probably jettisoned by some aircraft being chased by fighters.
One bomb did land on Derby, but it missed the factory. It was most probably jettisoned by some aircraft being chased by fighters.
That's what led to the scenario mentioned by tdracer in post 40 (bottom of page 2) where there were lots of small "backstreet" workshops making Spitfire parts. When the Supermarine works were bombed, there obviously wasn't a convenient empty aeroplane factory standing idle just waiting to be needed and moved into.
To make parts wherever they could was the only real option.
To make parts wherever they could was the only real option.
Was at the Southampton museum where they showed us what they claimed was the only jig remaining of Spitfire production, a fairly crude piece of woodwork fixture, said to be used by a group of ladies sitting around the kitchen table at home making up a certain piece of fuel pipe.
Castle Bromwich scandal
That's what led to the scenario mentioned by tdracer in post 40 (bottom of page 2) where there were lots of small "backstreet" workshops making Spitfire parts. When the Supermarine works were bombed, there obviously wasn't a convenient empty aeroplane factory standing idle just waiting to be needed and moved into.
To make parts wherever they could was the only real option.
To make parts wherever they could was the only real option.
Supermarine production
Dowding had been under great pressure to send Spitfires to France but stood firm as he knew we needed everyone one of them for home defence. Even so their numbers were whittled down by the evacuation,and it is surprising that the Southampton production facilities lasted so long. But that is the way of conflict, long term plans become obsolete overnight, and although CB were late on parade their contribution was a 'tide turner' that the Germans could not stop.
Of course whilst all this was going on the dear old Hurricane was pouring out of Gloucester and Kingston thereby ensuring we al least had a capable defender to fall back on. Sydneys hump backed knuckleduster had its drawbacks,but in the right hands was a bit of a bruiser.
Last edited by POBJOY; 29th Jul 2020 at 19:23.
