Airline Call Signs

[cj241101]

According to "Air Britain's Airlines of the British Isles since 1919" Alidair was formed as a subsidiary of the Alida Packaging Group on 1st January 1972. If this were the case then ownership must have moved on by the time of the Flight article in 1973. The Alida Packaging Group did have a Beagle Pup based at Hucknall which would make appearances at East Midlands, so there was possibly a link somewhere.

I don't believe Alidair had anything to do with Kestrel, who ceased trading on 1st November 1972 and whose sole Viscount (G-AVJB) was returned to BMA.
Thanks for the replies, helps me with a large project which I have been working on for a couple of years.

[The AvgasDinosaur]

I think Dan-Air at one time used a variety of fixed call signs for non revenue flights -:
Danair 99 Papa Lime for positioning.
Danair 89 Papa Lima for engineering test flights
Danair 79 Papa Lima for training flights
I think there were others. (This example for G-ASPL)
Curiously I have just recently been listening to a recording (naughty I know) of London Radar for Sunday 4th June 1967 Transglobe Brittanias en route to Gatwick we’re using both reg and flight number on different flights.
Does anyone remember Berna Radio on Short Wave or H.F.? Listening to the Africa net?
Or Shanwick Oceanic on Short wave?
London Volmet on HF for early clues on possible diversions from LAP?
I believe ACE Freighters used ACE and last two of reg as call sign but what was their two letter code or SITA code ??
Be lucky
David

[Mooncrest]

I remember Dan Air using 'DA89LL' for a regular Friday HS748 positioning from LBA to NCL in the early 1980s. By this time, Dan Air was already using alpha-numeric callsigns for its scheduled flights; 'DAB6ER' was the weekday evenings LBA to GLA flight.

[Level bust]

I did a jumpseat ride on a Monarch 1-11 to Milan Malpensa, we diverted to Linarte due to snow. Eventually Linarte shut and we were communicating with Monarch Ops via Berna Radio phone patch on HF. I remember it was clear as if we were on the ground at Luton!

No need for it now in Europe as they just use mobile phones.

[yellowtriumph]

Originally Posted by chevvron

'Clipper One' was Pan Am's flagship flight; it was a 'round the world' service westbound from the USA; 'Clipper Two' was the opposite direction equivalent.

I was lucky enough to go on both flights for the London>NY>London legs. Would have have been in about 1972? On board the cabin staff referred to the flights as World flight 1 and World flight 2. Sounded very impressive and obviously left a mark on me as I remember that little detail.

[cj241101]

Been a while since my last question so here's another:- "Scandinavian" being a 5 syllable mouthful, am I correct in thinking it was common practice to trim it to the 2-syllable "Scandi"? Especially on busy frequencies like Heathrow Director/Tower etc. Thanks in advance to any confirmation or otherwise.

[Musket90]

Don't know for certain but I believe 'Scandinavian' may still be used. Has been for many years. It seems to roll off the tongue quite easily compared to some other callsigns.with equal or less number of syllables.

[meleagertoo]

Back in the '80s when BA helicopters was taken over by that sleazeball Maxwell the treasured Speedbird callsign went and was replaced by the risible and un-phonetic "Lion".

On arrival at the rig on the first day a Puma crew made contact with inbound load etc using the embarassing new callsign only to be asked if the pussy wanted some milk on arrival!

Another cumbersome un-phonetic callsign was Green Isle for Virgin Express (Ireland).

[Heatseeker]

Heard a story once of a fast U.S. military aircraft transiting Scottish airspace with the callsign FAST EAGLE.
The crew got very vocal when ATC called them TESTICLE.
No sensayuma.

H

[cj241101]

Anyone help with this one. British Island Airways callsign 1971-1979. I remember "Brit Island" being used in the 80's - am I right in thinking they used "UK" (i.e. "you kay") prior to that? Also any info when they switched from registrations to flight numbers. Thanks in advance for any replies.

[pax britanica]

Bit of a thread drift Having had a reread of this thread due to a canceled conference call I can remember both call signs and registration call signs in use at LHR , Kcockayne kindly corrected my assumption about why they were sued with the advice that as traffic grew flights began to operate daily and ATC introduced flight strips as the same flight operated same time every day and hanging on to registrations wasnt practical or sensible any more but no doubt it wasnt accomplished overnight as in the early to mid 60s there were still lots of routes especial;;y long haul that only operated once or twice a week , Iraqi Viscounts Aerolineas Argentinas Comets or Panair Brasil DC8s stick in my mind .

I think ATC was less proceduralist and LHR although very very busy was nothing like today back and SK was usually Skandi and LH often Lufty along with a bit of banter with crews who were well used to LHR and spoke good English which was not the norm back then with even AF IB TP and the like having crews whose English was very limited along with the Eastern Europeans and occasionally even the then unusual 'Southern 'US voices from Braniff and National. My wife worked for Speedbird London some years later and even then Braniff were one of the hardest to understand. And as for the comments about FAA aircraft in Europe I remember seeing an FAA Convair but no ATC and one time, the holy grail for spotters at LHR , N1 the FAAs Lockheed Jetstar. Maybe better in nostalgia I know but was an interesting thread

[Jn14:6]

IIRC, 'UK' was used after the merger with Air Anglia to form Air UK.

[ve3id]

Originally Posted by l.garey

Yes, Beverleys used a similar system. I noted the following in the 1960s: XB168 MOBXD; XB284 MOBXH; XL148 MOBCY. The last letter was carried on the tail also.

Laurence

In Canada, I was once on board a RCAF reserve single Otter - above the Capt's head was a plaque with a five-letter callsign in the VCxxx series. I suppose they haven't been used since the morse code era.

[ve3id]

Red Arrows Callsign

I always thought that the Red Arrows used 'Red' followed by their team number, or 'leader'. But at the Toronto Airshow last September, they were called 'ASCOT' according to flightaware.com.

Can anybody enlighten me?

cheers,
id

[22/04]

In the UK the red arrows use the callsign "red arrows" when contacting atc units.

Ascot is used by some but not all RAF transport aircraft usually with a numeric or alpha numeric airline style callsigns.

[WE992]

Ascot is used by All RAF transport aircraft when route flying. RR1000 series, Bae146. RR2000 series KC-30, RR4000 series being the A400M, RR5000 series C-130 and RR6000 series C-17. KC30s use Madras and Tartan call signs when tanking in the UK. 400 sometimes use Comet call signs when undertaking tactical flying with C-130s using Jigsaw.

RAF fast jets often use the Ascot call sign when in transit overseas when accompanied by KC-30. The ASCOT call sign dates back to the days of RAF Air Support Command, standing for Air Support Command Operation Task.

[India Four Two]

Since we have drifted to tactical call signs, can someone tell me if trigraph call signs have gone away and if so when?

I remember calling up Syerston as “Echo Victor November 11 - a single piston” on a cross-country. I bet that fooled the Russian ELINT “trawlers”.

[kcockayne]

I do not know exactly when BIA started using flight numbers as the a/c callsign, but; I was doing my APP Radar training in 1974 at Bournemouth, & I am sure that they used flight numbers then.

[DaveReidUK]

Originally Posted by WE992

Ascot is used by All RAF transport aircraft when route flying. RR1000 series, Bae146. RR2000 series KC-30, RR4000 series being the A400M, RR5000 series C-130 and RR6000 series C-17. KC30s use Madras and Tartan call signs when tanking in the UK. 400 sometimes use Comet call signs when undertaking tactical flying with C-130s using Jigsaw.

RAF fast jets often use the Ascot call sign when in transit overseas when accompanied by KC-30. The ASCOT call sign dates back to the days of RAF Air Support Command, standing for Air Support Command Operation Task.

RRR1xxx callsigns are also used by 32 Sqn's Agusta. RRR7xxx is used by the Sentinels, Shadows and RC-135s.

I assume that by "KC-30" you mean the Voyagers, which also use RRR9xxx (possibly dependent on the mission).

[cj241101]

Originally Posted by pax britanica

crews who were well used to LHR and spoke good English which was not the norm back then with even AF IB TP and the like having crews whose English was very limited along with the Eastern Europeans

As a flight despatcher at Luton in the 1980's, most of the overseas operators had crews that spoke good English. That was until Balkan Bulgarian operated a weekly TU-154 flight in 1984. I was slightly puzzled dealing with their first flight that the crew complement on the flight deck was FIVE. Two pilots and a flight engineer, yes, but who were the other two? Sky marshals? KGB agents? It became apparent during the turnround that one must have been a navigator of some sort, studying Jeppesen (or the Russian equivalent of) aerodrome/departure charts etc. It gradually dawned on me, after any attempt at communication with the pilots was rebuffed with a grunt and a thumb jabbed in the direction of the 5th guy, that he was the translator. All dialogue was done through him. Whether he handled all communication with ATC as well I will never know. If he did, the short delay translating instructions to the pilots probably wasn't normally a big issue. Until they needed a surveillance radar approach (SRA) to half a mile, that is. Which is what happened one day (Luton had no ILS on RW 08 at that time). Waiting for the aircraft to land, I watched it break cloud at least 200 yards left of track in the course of executing a go-around. Good job the new tower was still 10 years away from being built....