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sad looking VC10

Old 3rd Oct 2017, 20:34
  #21 (permalink)  

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Herod,
I have come to realise the error of my post, and duly stand corrected. I realised that when I saw the trailer again last night.
Thank you.
N.Z.
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Old 3rd Oct 2017, 21:54
  #22 (permalink)  

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No problem, Noah. These fleeting images of similar scenes are easily confused.
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Old 3rd Oct 2017, 23:17
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KelvinD
we had to endure 20 hours from Aden to Lyneham!
When I was on 99 Sqn Britannias we did Khormaksar - El Adem in around 6hrs 30mins and El Adem - Lyneham in around 5hrs 30mins, so not sure which route you flew if it took 20hrs.


Britannia in CASEVAC role
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 05:51
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I guess when they filmed 'The Crown' How did the BOAC Argonaut and the Viscount fly? It's all computer generated.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 05:52
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Originally Posted by Warmtoast
KelvinD


When I was on 99 Sqn Britannias we did Khormaksar - El Adem in around 6hrs 30mins and El Adem - Lyneham in around 5hrs 30mins, so not sure which route you flew if it took 20hrs.


Britannia in CASEVAC role
Looks more comfortable than some of today's aircraft.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 07:00
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Warmtoast: Now that would have been a nice route! When I travelled (October 1967), we had upset the Arab states, with allegations the RAF had bombed Cairo during the 6 day war a couple of months earlier. This resulted in the RAF being banned from overflying Arab states so our track went:
Aden sort of easterly toward Oman, left turn up the Gulf to Bahrain
When we arrived in Bahrain, I remember thinking "how are they going to deal with this now we have Arab countries all around us?" We left Bahrain and crossed the Gulf, headed toward Iran in a generally northerly direction.
From Iran, we avoided Turkey and flew over Armenia and Georgia. Bearing in mind this was the height of the Cold War, that surprised me. The Captain very helpfully sent a chart for us to see. The chart was covered in a heavy polythene and the route was marked with a good old chinagraph and he had highlighted the 2 Soviet territories.
We skirted Turkey until we hit the Black Sea and swung around in a big curve, flying over (I think) Bulgaria and Greece and headed for Cyprus.
From Cyprus, we flew to Malta and finally to Lyneham.
The in flight catering consisted of thin cheese sandwiches and lemon squash on every sector. Departing Aden, the crew apologised for the catering and said we would get a hot meal in Bahrain. We got coffee" Departing Bahrain, more cheese sandwiches and another apology with a promise of a hot meal at Akrotiri. At Akrotiri, we got coffee and Keo brandy which we bought ourselves.
Departing Akrotiri, guess what; more apologies and a promise of a hot meal at Luqa. We picked up a few forces families in Malta (a couple of wives and kids) and set off for Lyneham.
As we were about to cross the Channel, the crew came round with a hot English breakfast along with customs and immigration forms. Lovely breakfast but a bugger to eat while filling in the forms and watching the UK coast getting ever closer!
The flight made it into the news the day after we arrived. When the aircraft parked, the ground people placed a big wooden ramp alongside the aircraft and an ambulance began backing up toward the ramp. Along came HM Customs and shooed the ambulance away. According to some of the casualties the Customs people boarded and went through the CASEVAC section like a dose of salts. One told me later that they used thin dowels to poke into bandages and casts to check if anything was hidden there! We walking passengers were given a real 3rd degree in the terminal and everybody paid customs duty on every bloody item. My return was 4 days short of a year since departure and I had bought a new watch while away and despite it being very close to a year (that was the threshold for duty payable), I was hit with the full import duty. Someone (whether passenger or crew, I don't know) told the newspapers. I heard later that HM Customs didn't attend inbound CASEVAC flights over the following days.
So, quite a trip! One abiding memory I have was during the flight over Iran, I noticed a large ring bolt in the bulkhead/deckhead and during this part of the journey I watched the amount of frost and ice that grew on this bolt. I presumed this bolt must have been through the fuselage and it was extremely cold outside!
Thanks for the photo. In all those 20 hours, I never did get to see that part of the aircraft.
Aah! Looking closely at your photo, I can see the ring bolts, holding the vertical supports for the stretchers. We were curtained off in the front. The first time I ever sat in seat 1A!
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 08:41
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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There was a particularly nasty customs man at Lyneham at that time, can't remember his name, who was even worse after his beloved Swindon Town had lost - so most of the time!
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 10:47
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Yep, remember him well, but not his name. There was one case where a crewmember has a demijohn of wine from Cyprus, and was going to be charged some ridiculous amount. He proceeded to pour it onto the floor, at which point said personage stated that since the floor was UK territory, duty was still payable.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 10:59
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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Lots of chat about this on the RAF Khormaksar thread on Military Aircrew. The first VC10 I ever saw was a BUA one at Khormaksar in 1966, when they had the trooping contract and I was so impressed. Like KelvinD I flew out and back on Britannias, but RAF, not British Eagle. I did fly out to Singapore on a British Eagle Brit the following year. Heathrow - Kuwait- Colombo - Paya Lebar - 24 hours which was long enough for me, so I sympathise with Ian16th who had to endure the Hastings!
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 11:34
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Originally Posted by Tankertrashnav
Lots of chat about this on the RAF Khormaksar thread on Military Aircrew. The first VC10 I ever saw was a BUA one at Khormaksar in 1966, when they had the trooping contract and I was so impressed. Like KelvinD I flew out and back on Britannias, but RAF, not British Eagle. I did fly out to Singapore on a British Eagle Brit the following year. Heathrow - Kuwait- Colombo - Paya Lebar - 24 hours which was long enough for me, so I sympathise with Ian16th who had to endure the Hastings!
Apparantly BOAC did use the VC10 on the Aden run in 1967 as this photograph shows. Perhaps this where the Last Post Director's Military adviser got the idea to use a BOAC VC10 in the programme.

See the following link.
Vickers VC10 Srs1101 - BOAC | Aviation Photo #1244563 | Airliners.net

Last edited by MReyn24050; 4th Oct 2017 at 12:30.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 12:50
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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Another BOAC VC10 at Aden with Hunters in the background.

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Old 4th Oct 2017, 13:17
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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But that second image was taken before the VC-10 actually entered service with BOAC. As the caption says it was on certification testing at the time.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 13:39
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Originally Posted by Groundloop
But that second image was taken before the VC-10 actually entered service with BOAC. As the caption says it was on certification testing at the time.
I am aware of that, the image was posted for interest and to highlight that Hunters were stationed at Khormaksar.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 14:08
  #34 (permalink)  
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KelvinD: That route over Iran and Turkey to/from Cyprus was known to those of us in the trade as the CENTO route. And it was in regular use from at least February 1967, before the 6-Day War - with a falling out with Egypt over issues in South Yemen the more probable cause for its adoption.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 15:13
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Originally Posted by teeteringhead
But there was a clip of a Wessex flying away in ther distance (archive?) and some (definitely contemporary) footage of a Belvedere.
Re the archive clip of a Wessex - look at 10.52 in on the BBC iPlayer. The Wessex has a yellow top to the fuselage. This indicates a Fleet Air Arm anti-submarine role Wessex HAS Mk1 and could well be my old Squadron - 815 - which was detached from HMS Centaur to Aden in January and again in May 1964. Just before my time with the Squadron as I joined them the following year.

All the sonar anti-submarine gear was stripped out from the Wessex and they operated in the troop transport role flying from Thurmier Airstrip in the Radfan Mountains. The Wessex shown in the accompanying photo whilst operating in the Radfan - XM873 - crashed at Wadi Misrah in June 1964 during a landing at 5000ft elevation in the mountains, rolled over 5 times and fell 150ft into a gully, sadly with the death of one of the troops.

Note the harp on the side of the helicopter - at that time we were 'sponsored' by Guinness!
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815 Radfan.jpg (50.5 KB, 27 views)
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 15:15
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ICM: Thanks for that. It was the Captain who told us it was due to the 6 day war that we were persona non-grata. If it had been Egypt only, we could have made it over Saudi Arabia, Jordan etc. It was interesting to see that route was already in use. I am still amazed we had the USSR being so friendly, while we had to make a huge circle to avoid Turkey, supposedly our CENTO mates.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 15:29
  #37 (permalink)  
 
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BOAC Standard VC10 G-ARVL a shuttle from Khartoum - Aden - Khartoum on 28 April 1967.

The whole trip had been London - Tripoli - Khartoum on the night of 24/25 April. Then the shuttle to Aden and back on the 28th, followed by the return flight to London via Tripoli on 2 May.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 18:42
  #38 (permalink)  
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KelvinD: This is getting rather off the VC 10 topic but my apologies for not reading your original post thoroughly. If you were in a RAF Britannia, then I have difficulty in believing that you flew over Armenia and Georgia, and I suspect that a very thick chinagraph had been used on that Pax Map. Flying from Bahrain or Sharjah, the CENTO route that I mentioned passed over Iran, up into eastern Turkey, and due west over the mountains until it was time to turn southwards for Cyprus. Overflight of Bulgaria would have been out of the question and there was no need for overflight of Greece. The same routing was used in reverse.

The 6-Day War did not help things in the area as rumours started and spread that RAF aircraft had flown from Cyprus in support of Israel. I was with an Argosy crew positioned at Masirah as standby support for a Lightning Trail to the Far East (Op Hydraulic) over those days, and I've often wondered whether the mix of Victor tankers and Lightnings operating through Akrotiri at the time might have helped spark those rumours.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 19:48
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Originally Posted by crewmeal
I guess when they filmed 'The Crown' How did the BOAC ... the Viscount fly? It's all computer generated.
If they had a BOAC Viscount, that was correct. BOAC never ran Viscounts, but their overseas-ownership arm, BOAC Associated Services, did, and leased Viscount 700s to Aden Airways, among a number of others, in BOAC livery with small Aden titles.

before the VC-10 actually entered service with BOAC
First VC10 deliveries, April 1964 to BOAC, September 1964 to British United. The BOAC ones replaced Comet 4s on these routes. The BUA ones did initially do military charters (always a mainstream use for BUA Britannias) before replacing Britannias on East Africa schedules, and later supplanting BOAC on South America.

I am still amazed we had the USSR being so friendly
Alas the media image. Russians in private life are actually some of the most pleasant, honourable and hospitable people you may find . And they have always despised their leaders (Czars, Socialists, New Russians, in equal quantities).

There was a particularly nasty customs man at Lyneham at that time
So I will tell this one. The very first time I ever arrived in Russia, at St Petersburg, I anticipated a KGB-style reception. But in the customs hall it was the opposite. Elegant Russian 40-something woman has her suitcase opened on the inspection counter. Russian customs officer, young-20-something, young enough to be her son, full old-socialist style uniform with oversized hat, on the other side. Woman is giving the officer what for in full volume. Officer is slightly cowering backwards, not knowing what to do, under the torrent of invective (I presume). Not the image at all ! I think she won.

we avoided Turkey and flew over Armenia and Georgia
Just a short while ago, Singapore to LHR nonstop on a 777, we took this exact same route, direct overhead Baku.

Did you look down on The Caspian coast to see the Ekranoplan - alias Caspian Sea Monster ? The prototype must have been trialling about then.
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Old 4th Oct 2017, 20:10
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Originally Posted by WHBM
If they had a BOAC Viscount, that was correct. BOAC never ran Viscounts, but their overseas-ownership arm, BOAC Associated Services, did, and leased Viscount 700s to Aden Airways, among a number of others, in BOAC livery with small Aden titles.
Not forgetting the two rather handsome Cambrian Viscounts that flew in BOAC's livery between Edinburgh/Belfast and Prestwick in the early 70s to feed their transatlantic services:

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