llanfairpg

In the 50s there was a Prentice based at BHX for banner towing the Lamtex Rug advert. Does anyone have any info on it. The pilot was Clive and his surname was Hartley, I think. It was his first job after the RAF national service.
He was later a training captain on the Viscount (involved in the famous Guernsey landing incident which ended up with an industrial tribunal)

He latterly worked for Mc Alpine on the HS125 and i believe he has since passed away

Amos Keeto

I remember seeing this aircraft towing a banner over Swindon when I was a small boy and knew I had a photo of it somewhere. Found it in Air Pictorial August 1960 issue including Clive Hartley. The accompanying text reads," J.L.Tankard & Co.Ltd, carpet and rug manufacturers, have been operating a Prentice on aerial advertising since October 1959. Two months evaluation with a hired aircraft proved the operation to be commercial sound and flying was resumed on 15th March 1960 with G-AOKH, purchased from Aviation Traders Ltd., and based at Yeadon. From that date to 26th June, 285 hours' banner-towing have been logged. The aircraft is a single seater (?) and pulls a 180 ft. nylon banner at 62 knots with an effective endurance of 3 to 3 1/2 hours. Servicability has proved to be good and the pilot, Mr, Clive Hartley, believes the Prentice to be the best aircraft available in this country for the job, but G-AOKH will be one of the last aircraft even seen towing a banner, as the new Aviation Act will make all forms of aerial advertising illegal". That latter statement obviously was rescinded! I recall that the colour of the aircraft was dark blue and white, but stand to be corrected as that was a long time ago!
Hope this has helped!

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n...eto/G-AOKH.jpg

llanfairpg

Thats amazing

I would add that Clive Hartley was the Alidar training captain involved in a Viscount landing accident at Gurnsey ,the complete undercarriage was removed. Clive was not the handling pilot but took the blame.

The incident ended in an industrial tribunal were the judge famously ruled.

AN AIRLINE PILOT IS THE ONE PROFESSION WHERE A MISTAKE CANNOT BE MADE, and upheld the unfair dismissal

|I thank you

David Eyre

Hi There,

There is some more info and two black and white photos of the aircraft G-AOKH at this webpage - (you have to scroll down about three-quarters of the way down):

http://wonwinglo.scale-models.net/id48.htm

My Dad also worked for Alidair as Operations Controller at East Midlands. I used to love going to EMA and seeing Viscounts, Vanguards and Argosy's.

Do you have any details of which Viscount it was that had the undercarriage accident in Guernsey?

The only two Alidair Viscount incidents I know of are the 1980 fuel starvation / belly landing in Exeter by G-ARBY (which was the oldest flying Viscount in the world at that time), and the hard landing / undercarriage collapse by G-BFYZ (in Guernsey Airlines colours) at Kirkwall, Orkneys in 1979.

Regards,
David

Helen49

Clive Hartley was later a BAC111 skipper with BMA
h49

Malcolm G O Payne

I flew this aircraft in 1961 under the instruction of Stuart Hoare. He had taken over the job rom Clive and flew until legislation stopped aerial advertising in about 1962. Stuart is still very active with corporate flying at Biggin and his wife, Janet is Airport Manager at Fairoaks.

llanfairpg

Malcolm didnt you fly a black Navajo at BHX

llanfairpg

David, perhaps the Kirkwall incident was the one I was referring to, like to find out more on this accident, Flight had details of Industrial Tribunal

Helen wasnt Clive on the 1-11 with BM before Alidair

Who is the webmaster on that amazing Coventry airport site, I recognised many people on there, even worked for one of them!

Malcol Payne make sure you look at that Coventry Airport site.

Keep it coming!

llanfairpg

The Exeter incident I think was Capt Bill Whittaker(known as Wild Bill) I think and he had taken the a/c over from Jeep Holmes another famous Birmingham name!
Jeep is about 82 now by the way

Malcolm G O Payne

Lanfairpg.Yes, I was actualy based at CVT but many of my flights were from BHX. The Navajo was G-AZME, which was sold back to the US when our company folded. I moved on to work for Birmingham Aerocentre as Chief Pilot/CFI on a number of aircraft, but primarily Chieftains G-BBXR and G-DIXI.

bean

Exeter accident was actually Captain Geoff Whittaker not Bill.

He was ex Jersey Airlines/BUA(CI) & Aurigny.

He was commended in the accident report for getting the aircraft down without any serious injuries to anyone.

Malcolm G O Payne

Llanfairpg. Sorry, could you point me in the direction of the Coventry site you refer to. Thanks a lot-sounds very nostalgic.

llanfairpg

His name might have been Geoff but his nickname was Wild Bill! Yes he did well but wasnt it a fuel starvation problem, they hadnt uplifted enough fuel in Spain didnt the fuellers get most of the blame. Would like to know where you can read the accident report on that if anyone knows.

llanfairpg

Malcolm

I remember you well and the obnoxious little twot you worked for, Aviations most unpopular figure, I bet you could write a book on that!

Muriel Dean died a few weeks ago and I was at the funeral with Jack Muldoon Steve George, Roger Mansell and Keith Barrington. (Steve Francis couldnt make it)

Lofty is still alive by the way and is the oldest survivor who worked at the airport from the day it opened in 1939.

The address is

http://wonwinglo.scale-models.net/id48.htm (Coventry airport pics, amazing site!)

Quite a site and if you look carefully you will see a pic of Lofty!

Regards

henry crun

There is a lot of comment about the people but little about the aircraft, so, having flown the beast I offer my assessment of the Prentice.

A bigger apology for a flying machine it would be harder to find, ponderous, under powered, and barely suitable for flying from A to B in a straight line.
How it managed to get airborne towing a rope, let alone a banner on the end of it, is beyond my comprehension.
To sum up, it is a heap !

There, I feel better now I have got that off my chest

windriver

I`m afraid I don`t have a lot to add to the thread but a few points of interest and a nag from pprune reminds me I haven`t posted for a while so at the risk of thread creep here goes...
Jeep checked me out on the Birmex G1 yonks ago... these are flights you never quite forget.... hope he's OK. Top Bloke as they say.

Er.. one candidate perhaps... Try a Beagle Terrier with a banner.... a most unpleasant experience..

treadigraph

Henry. I won't argue with you but I would swear that I read somewhere recently (and I'll bet it was Tiger Club related) that one was entered into an aeros competition in the 1960s... with two pilots no less; one to work rudder and throttle, the other to wrestle with the stick.. I rest your case...

shack

Quote:
A bigger apology for a flying machine it would be harder to find.

Oh how I agree!!! I did my FTS at Ternhill on the beast and thinking back makes me think of what a heap of rubbish it was.

llanfairpg

The one thing you left out was the noise. At Aberdeen the Prentice actually made more noise than the 1-11s on take off!

llanfairpg

Anybody kow what happened to Clive Hartley