Press reports of accident at Duxford 10/07/11

[Bus429]

Some press reports of an accident yesterday at Duxford involving an A-1 and P-51. No injuries but any details?

[stepwilk]

P-51 was Big Beautiful Doll, the Skyraider was French-registered. Midair, took four feet off the Doug's right wing but it landed safely. the P-51 went straight in, but the pilot bailed, at a surprisingly low altitude, and is also okay.

[Bus429]

Glad it ended without tragedy. If the Big Beautiful Doll was G-HAEC I have some history with it. When it was brought to the UK by the OFMC, I spent some time working on it to cure several electrical defects. Great shame about its loss but aircraft can be replaced.

[WHBM]

Fortunate conclusion, but what a shame. Saw them faultless on the Saturday.

[Max Shutterspeed]

Big Beautful Doll only just been sold by to Germany by Rob Davies after more that 1,000 hours seat time in P51's. Glad everyone safe, but a tragic loss after so many safe years operation.

[Heliport]

[Flying Lawyer]

Bus429

If the Big Beautiful Doll was G-HAEC I have some history with it.

It used to be. (So do I, in its OFMC days.)

Great shame but, as you say, aircraft can be replaced.

FL

[By George]

Looks like the A-1 lost its pitot tube with the lost wing area. Good job in landing it safely, especially if he had no ASI. The Mustang pilot must have been quick to get out looking at the height available. Well done to both pilots.

[corsair]

Ouch, that could have ended very badly. Remarkable that both pilots survived. Modern pilot bale out rigs open very fast indeed and very low. Also proof if anything that the Spad was indeed a rugged aircraft.

[JW411]

By George:

"Well done to both pilots"

?

[chris keeping]

What a shame that G-HAEC is no more. The airframe was sourced in the Philippines and rebuilt/restored in Hong Kong by the Hong Kong Aircraft Engineering Company (HAECO), hence 'G-HAEC', under the watchful eye of Mal Rose who was then a Cathay Pacific flight engineer plus some others including Ray Hanna who was also with Cathay. Ray did a fast taxi run at Kai Tak but was prohibited to take off. Soon after that she was crated up and shipped to the UK.

[Postfade]

I seem to have caught this incident in a closer way than most and my video which includes 'a half-speed replay', is on my website WWW.flyingfilm.co.uk


David Taylor

[Double Zero]

Looking at the shot of the Skyraider coming in to land sans wing portion, was it a terribly good idea to select flaps ?

[JW411]

What a totally fatuous statement made by someone who has obviously never been involved in such a situation.

[cyflyer]

Looks like the Skyraider pilot screwed up big time. Where was he looking ? He hit the Mustang from behind...

[Double Zero]

JW411, Get off your horse. I haven't been involved in a mid-air between warbirds, no, but I know what asymmetric flap does...

[Flying Lawyer]

JW411

What a totally fatuous statement made by someone who has obviously never been involved in such a situation.

You could have said 'What a totally fatuous statement made by someone who isn't and never has been a pilot'
and you would still have been right.


Walt

I know what asymmetric flap does

Are you sure the flaps are actually asymmetric?
FWIW I think it's an illusion created by the camera angle, but I bow to your expertise as an experienced photographer.


FL

[Double Zero]

Photographer yes, from a flight test background.

So you think selecting flap is a good idea with a wing in that state, when IF it went asymmetric you'd be rolling into a rather reduced wing & no aileron ?

I didn't say it was asymmetric, I am saying it would be worth considering in the circumstances, when it would be all too easy to select in a hurry to get down with unpleasant results.

Have a think about it, before rushing for your cheap insults.

[henry crun]

Double Zero; I feel quite sure the pilot of the Skyraider would know the effect of an asymmetric flap.
He would be able see that the upper surface of the flap was undamaged and some way away from the missing wingtip.

If the aircraft had started rolling as the flaps were lowering and he was unable check the roll, he would have undoubtably very quickly. moved the flap lever back to the UP position.

[Flying Lawyer]

So you think selecting flap is a good idea with a wing in that state

Yes, FWIW (not much), I think it was.
There was no reason for the pilot to believe that the operation of the flaps had been adversely affected. He could see that the damage was to the outboard section of the (famously strong) wing. ie To the 13 feet (approx) section beyond the folding mechanism.
See:


If his belief turned out to be wrong he could, as Henry says, have taken appropriate action.

a rather reduced wing & no aileron

Where do you get the idea that he had no aileron?
He would I suspect have been experiencing a great deal of buffeting, and have been acutely aware that he might lose it altogether, but the (shortened) aileron protrudes beyond where the mainplane has disappeared. The outboard hinge departed with the lost section of wing (about 4 ft), but there were still two of the three hinge points remaining.

"it would be all too easy to select in a hurry to get down"

I have no reason to suppose that he did anything in a hurry following the collision. From the reports I've read elsewhere, he appears to have assessed the situation and his options and then landed safely.
I would not have criticised him if he'd got out in a hurry; he opted to stay with the aircraft.

BTW, I'm sorry you regard my comment as cheap; I thought it was valid. I admit to being influenced by some of your previous comments in this forum, which IMHO have been quite extraordinary given that you are not a pilot.
Yes, I know you've sat in with some top pilots.
You could sit in a garage for hours but you still wouldn't be a car.


FL