NZ Flight 901
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NZ Flight 901
Until a recent relocation I had among my collection a superbly made 2 part video of a drama-documentary based on the 1979 Flight 901 tragedy in Antarctica... it's now lost and I'd love to be able to replace it...
Does anyone out there know where I could get a copy ?
Does anyone out there know where I could get a copy ?
Yes - I agree, superby done.
I videoed it when it was first shown - I still have it somewhere.
I'll PM you if I can find my copy - but being Brit it's likely to be PAL rather than NTSC so not sure that'll be any good to you?
I videoed it when it was first shown - I still have it somewhere.
I'll PM you if I can find my copy - but being Brit it's likely to be PAL rather than NTSC so not sure that'll be any good to you?
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DH106
PAL is not a problem.. I am a Brit.. but now 'over here'.. have a couple of hundred PAL videos that I'm currently unable to watch as although I have my video player, I don't have a TV that can deal with the PAL signal.. trying to locate one. If you do come across it I'd be happy to pay for the copying either onto a video or on to a DVD... Many thanks..
PAL is not a problem.. I am a Brit.. but now 'over here'.. have a couple of hundred PAL videos that I'm currently unable to watch as although I have my video player, I don't have a TV that can deal with the PAL signal.. trying to locate one. If you do come across it I'd be happy to pay for the copying either onto a video or on to a DVD... Many thanks..
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Don't believe I've seen it, so have programmed my tivo/dvr for both Erebus and Antartica to capture it. Will try to advise when it pops up.
I was peripherally involved early in the investigation. But for the data we found in the Nav Computer core memory stacks, McDonnell Douglas, Collins (RNAV) and Litton (INU) may have been blamed for that crash. Someday I'll write about it.
GB
I was peripherally involved early in the investigation. But for the data we found in the Nav Computer core memory stacks, McDonnell Douglas, Collins (RNAV) and Litton (INU) may have been blamed for that crash. Someday I'll write about it.
GB
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Greybeard,
I have a very vague recollection of, some years ago, reading a sentence about Erebus with the names "Collins" and "Litton" in it. Without giving anything away, could you give me an indication as to where I might look?
I have a very vague recollection of, some years ago, reading a sentence about Erebus with the names "Collins" and "Litton" in it. Without giving anything away, could you give me an indication as to where I might look?
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Erebus: The Aftermath
All,
The made-for-television mini-series that you are referring to is called "Erebus: The Aftermath". It was made by TVNZ in 1987 (although is incorrectly stated as 1988 in Wikipedia, imdb and many other websites). It screened on television in both Australia and NZ in either 87 or 88. It is a 2 part series and runs for a total of just over 3 hours.
The mini-series won 6 awards in NZ, including best (supporting) actor Ian Mune, for his superb portrayal of Morrie Davis (then Air NZ Chief Executive). It is also noteworthy for its well researched and detailed plot, taking us time-wise from one week prior to the crash, right through the Royal Commission, Court of Appeal and Privy Council appeal. The series is, in part, told from the point of view of Justice Mahon, as his voice is used in a semi-narration role (particularly near the conclusion). Many of the actors cast also bore a striking resemblance to the characters that they were portraying, in particluar Justice Mahon, Morrie Davis, Sir Rob Muldoon and Ian Gemmell.
Don't bother searching through the internet for a copy of this. I doubt you will find one. I tried in vain for 5 years without success. I also contacted ABC (who screened it in 87/88) here in Australia and also TVNZ. Both of them said that they did not have the rights to sell me a copy, nor were there any plans to re-screen it.
If my recollections are correct, the programme has never been re-screened in Australia, and I would think that's the case as well in NZ. I am not sure why that, for such an excellent production, the biggest disaster in NZ history, with wide ranging ramifications for both the aviation and legal communities, particularly in NZ, it has never been re-screened.
I have my theory though - it was made by TNNZ, a goverment owned TV station. Air NZ was (I'm not sure if it still is) a government owned airline (at least in 1979 they held the majority of shares). The mini-series, although as objective as possible, seems to lean more towards Mahon's findings and opinions as being correct. It also portrays several of Air NZ's executive staff and board members at the time in a bad light. So, perhaps it was decided to never show it again
- ie let it rest finally (and the Erebus disaster will never rest it seems).
I am not sure if it was ever shown outside of Aust/NZ. Perhaps it was in the UK. Certainly, it has never been available for commercial sale.
Having said all that, I obtained a DVD of this series about a month ago, from a fellow PPR member via a different forum. Needless to say, I've watched it several times in that period.
There is an excellent thread "Erebus 25 Years on" which is currently very active with dozens of daily replies. Check it out if you haven't seen it.
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...152934&page=18
For anyone who's interested, there are also 2 documentaries that have been made about the Erebus crash. The first was "Flight 901: The Erebus Disaster", which was made in 1981, produced by Sonor Productions. Apparently, it was shown on TV in NZ in 1981 but was unsuitably titled "Death Flight 901" at that time. I obtained a copy about 7 years ago from the NZ Film Commission in Wellington, but I see that it does not appear on their website anymore. It is 52 mins in duration, and contains, amongst other things, actual video footage at the Royal Commission (about 10 witnesses' testimonies are shown in part).
The second is a DVD titled "Impact Erebus Two". It is available from NZALPA and indeed shoule be currently available. It contains interviews and footage of both Gordon Vette and Justice Mahon (GV footage is from both the early 80's and also from about 7 years ago), and the interviews with PM are around 1984. The rest of this DVD contains footage that was originally shown in the "Flight 901: The Erebus Disaster" video.
Hope that's some help to interested people out there.
The made-for-television mini-series that you are referring to is called "Erebus: The Aftermath". It was made by TVNZ in 1987 (although is incorrectly stated as 1988 in Wikipedia, imdb and many other websites). It screened on television in both Australia and NZ in either 87 or 88. It is a 2 part series and runs for a total of just over 3 hours.
The mini-series won 6 awards in NZ, including best (supporting) actor Ian Mune, for his superb portrayal of Morrie Davis (then Air NZ Chief Executive). It is also noteworthy for its well researched and detailed plot, taking us time-wise from one week prior to the crash, right through the Royal Commission, Court of Appeal and Privy Council appeal. The series is, in part, told from the point of view of Justice Mahon, as his voice is used in a semi-narration role (particularly near the conclusion). Many of the actors cast also bore a striking resemblance to the characters that they were portraying, in particluar Justice Mahon, Morrie Davis, Sir Rob Muldoon and Ian Gemmell.
Don't bother searching through the internet for a copy of this. I doubt you will find one. I tried in vain for 5 years without success. I also contacted ABC (who screened it in 87/88) here in Australia and also TVNZ. Both of them said that they did not have the rights to sell me a copy, nor were there any plans to re-screen it.
If my recollections are correct, the programme has never been re-screened in Australia, and I would think that's the case as well in NZ. I am not sure why that, for such an excellent production, the biggest disaster in NZ history, with wide ranging ramifications for both the aviation and legal communities, particularly in NZ, it has never been re-screened.
I have my theory though - it was made by TNNZ, a goverment owned TV station. Air NZ was (I'm not sure if it still is) a government owned airline (at least in 1979 they held the majority of shares). The mini-series, although as objective as possible, seems to lean more towards Mahon's findings and opinions as being correct. It also portrays several of Air NZ's executive staff and board members at the time in a bad light. So, perhaps it was decided to never show it again
- ie let it rest finally (and the Erebus disaster will never rest it seems). I am not sure if it was ever shown outside of Aust/NZ. Perhaps it was in the UK. Certainly, it has never been available for commercial sale.
Having said all that, I obtained a DVD of this series about a month ago, from a fellow PPR member via a different forum. Needless to say, I've watched it several times in that period.
There is an excellent thread "Erebus 25 Years on" which is currently very active with dozens of daily replies. Check it out if you haven't seen it.
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...152934&page=18
For anyone who's interested, there are also 2 documentaries that have been made about the Erebus crash. The first was "Flight 901: The Erebus Disaster", which was made in 1981, produced by Sonor Productions. Apparently, it was shown on TV in NZ in 1981 but was unsuitably titled "Death Flight 901" at that time. I obtained a copy about 7 years ago from the NZ Film Commission in Wellington, but I see that it does not appear on their website anymore. It is 52 mins in duration, and contains, amongst other things, actual video footage at the Royal Commission (about 10 witnesses' testimonies are shown in part).
The second is a DVD titled "Impact Erebus Two". It is available from NZALPA and indeed shoule be currently available. It contains interviews and footage of both Gordon Vette and Justice Mahon (GV footage is from both the early 80's and also from about 7 years ago), and the interviews with PM are around 1984. The rest of this DVD contains footage that was originally shown in the "Flight 901: The Erebus Disaster" video.
Hope that's some help to interested people out there.
Last edited by malcolmyoung90; 22nd Feb 2008 at 00:25. Reason: Added "Censored" smile - my theory is the censors got involved.
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Thanks for the link, Malcom. I started into that thread, or one like it, a couple of years ago then got sidetracked. I'm slogging through it now, as I remember my peripheral part of the investigation as if it were last month.
I have quite a lot of technical info to write that I don't believe has been covered in these forums, and it should be interesting to those involved. I just don't want to repeat seemingly common knowledge, or get facts wrong.
Yes, it regards Douglas, Collins and Litton, the players in the AINS-70, Area Inertial Navigation System, the forerunner of the ubiquitous FMS.
GB
I have quite a lot of technical info to write that I don't believe has been covered in these forums, and it should be interesting to those involved. I just don't want to repeat seemingly common knowledge, or get facts wrong.
Yes, it regards Douglas, Collins and Litton, the players in the AINS-70, Area Inertial Navigation System, the forerunner of the ubiquitous FMS.
GB
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Erebus - Technical Information
That sort of information would be very interesting, Greybeard. Wasn't the computer work vital in proving that the crew actually entered the coordinates on the flightplan (ie, they didn't make a data-entry error).
Also, there has been some discussion as to whether the AINS, as it was on a DC10 in 1979, gave the pilot a good enough positionial fix to descend below the height of high ground.
Also, there has been some discussion as to whether the AINS, as it was on a DC10 in 1979, gave the pilot a good enough positionial fix to descend below the height of high ground.
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Erebus the Aftermth
Two nights ago, I was watching my copy of Erebus while transcribing it from VHS tape to DVD. The quality of reproduction is excellent and the programme is compelling.
As I understand it, all DVDs are actually PAL standard but those for USA (Region 1) transcribe to NTSC. Since I recorded my own version, (not Region specific) PAL/NTSC should not be a problem. (It has not been for other DVDs I have sent to friends in the States.)
I would be pleased to send you a copy if I knew how to contact you.
In a secondhand bookshop in UK I found a copy of The Erebus Papers, dealing with the evidence et al associated with the enquiry. It is still packed away and I can give you no other details at the moment, but it might be worth searching ABEbooks for a copy.
In your quest for a TV, you will find in the States that you can buy multi-standard TVs which happily show you PAL. Even in France, a SECAM tv will often be PAL compatible.
In answer to another post, the Erebus programme was shown in UK just once on two subsequent afternoons. Hence my copy!
As I understand it, all DVDs are actually PAL standard but those for USA (Region 1) transcribe to NTSC. Since I recorded my own version, (not Region specific) PAL/NTSC should not be a problem. (It has not been for other DVDs I have sent to friends in the States.)
I would be pleased to send you a copy if I knew how to contact you.
In a secondhand bookshop in UK I found a copy of The Erebus Papers, dealing with the evidence et al associated with the enquiry. It is still packed away and I can give you no other details at the moment, but it might be worth searching ABEbooks for a copy.
In your quest for a TV, you will find in the States that you can buy multi-standard TVs which happily show you PAL. Even in France, a SECAM tv will often be PAL compatible.
In answer to another post, the Erebus programme was shown in UK just once on two subsequent afternoons. Hence my copy!
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Erebus: The Aftermath
For those interested, the writer of the Erebus: The Aftermath mini-series, Greg McGee, wrote a book that was published last year called "Tall Tales (Some True) - memoirs of an unlikely writer". In this book, their is a 32 page chapter titled "Dancing on the Coffins of the Dead" - which is entirely describing how the mini-series was all put together.
It is an interesting read, and I'd have to agree with a review I've read on the internet, that it would have been great if the Erebus chapter was not just limited to one chapter.
Amongst other things, it goes into a fair bit of depth about the legalities of writing such a script and how they managed to depict what they did. It also mentions that the show was screened and repeated in the UK (by BBC) and in Australia (ABC) - however, it was only ever screened once in New Zealand, as apparently the deal that Air NZ made with TVNZ was that they wouldn't sue if it wasn't repeated. So to those in NZ, don't expect it ever to be re-screened on television again.
It is an interesting read, and I'd have to agree with a review I've read on the internet, that it would have been great if the Erebus chapter was not just limited to one chapter.
Amongst other things, it goes into a fair bit of depth about the legalities of writing such a script and how they managed to depict what they did. It also mentions that the show was screened and repeated in the UK (by BBC) and in Australia (ABC) - however, it was only ever screened once in New Zealand, as apparently the deal that Air NZ made with TVNZ was that they wouldn't sue if it wasn't repeated. So to those in NZ, don't expect it ever to be re-screened on television again.
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In a rather weird, and almost certainly unrelated coincidence, NZ901 early in the flight made a position report to Auckland Oceanic HF that they were over Queenstown then just a minute or two later corrected that to Invercargill.
Although I clearly remember this being discussed in the Ministry of Transport, Civil Aviation Division, Head Office I have never seen reference to this in anything related to the investigation or elsewhere. As I say, almost certainly unrelated though it does cause one to wonder.
Although I clearly remember this being discussed in the Ministry of Transport, Civil Aviation Division, Head Office I have never seen reference to this in anything related to the investigation or elsewhere. As I say, almost certainly unrelated though it does cause one to wonder.
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Ampan, I used to work in the old Aurora House and I remember it being discussed the day after the accident and I can only assume it was discounted as not relevant as it happened hours before the aircraft reached Antarctica.
Were the air/ground tapes for the entire flight included in the enquiry? Did the enquiry just have the paper logs from the air/ground operators' position? As far as I know the HF operators typed the reports in real time and if the position was corrected as I heard discussed it should have been on those paper log rolls, plus on the audio tapes of course.
Certainly odd though as it was not something that happens very often, in my, modest, experience.
Were the air/ground tapes for the entire flight included in the enquiry? Did the enquiry just have the paper logs from the air/ground operators' position? As far as I know the HF operators typed the reports in real time and if the position was corrected as I heard discussed it should have been on those paper log rolls, plus on the audio tapes of course.
Certainly odd though as it was not something that happens very often, in my, modest, experience.
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John Hill: I don't think that either the ground tapes for the pre-Antarctic legs or the written logs were produced at the inquiry. Perhaps neither side attached any relevance to the information?
It has some relevance: The picture painted by Justice Mahon was of the captain carefully plotting his track on his atlas the night before, using a copy of an old flightplan. The track having been so carefully plotted, the crew would, allegedly, always know where they were, simply by looking at the 'miles to run' figure on the AINS.
Perhaps the careful plotting exercise didn't include the NZ sectors, given the planned altitude. But one would think that a mistaken opinion that one was over Queenstown might, a couple of hours later, have some effect on an opinion that one was in McMurdo Sound?
It has some relevance: The picture painted by Justice Mahon was of the captain carefully plotting his track on his atlas the night before, using a copy of an old flightplan. The track having been so carefully plotted, the crew would, allegedly, always know where they were, simply by looking at the 'miles to run' figure on the AINS.
Perhaps the careful plotting exercise didn't include the NZ sectors, given the planned altitude. But one would think that a mistaken opinion that one was over Queenstown might, a couple of hours later, have some effect on an opinion that one was in McMurdo Sound?
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Ampan, I have not seen the flight plan and I dont know if the planned route took them over one, the other, or both of those towns.
Presumably they would have made use of ground based aids as long as possible before they had to rely entirely on the aircraft's on board systems, in which case the Invercargill NDB was likely their last check with the ground, though I may be quite wrong I dont think there was a VOR south of Christchurch in those days.
So what could the amendment to the position report mean? That they were 'lost' before they even left NZ? This is way out of my league I am afraid.
Presumably they would have made use of ground based aids as long as possible before they had to rely entirely on the aircraft's on board systems, in which case the Invercargill NDB was likely their last check with the ground, though I may be quite wrong I dont think there was a VOR south of Christchurch in those days.
So what could the amendment to the position report mean? That they were 'lost' before they even left NZ? This is way out of my league I am afraid.
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John Hill: You are not allowed to suggest that they were lost. (This rule has not yet been enshrined in a statute, although Jim Anderton and NZALPA have a bill before Parliament.) At all times, "the crew were certain of their position" - and completely wrong. (I reckon the penny finally dropped about 10 seconds before impact: Why turn left?)
Rollingthunder: Wasn't the DC10 a superior aircraft in almost every respect? I think you're quite right. The only design defect in the 10 was the cargo door issue, which had been sorted out long before. AirNZ obviously chickened out for no logical aviation reason - but perhaps perception is everything? They certainly managed to dig themselves out of the hole with the 747.
Rollingthunder: Wasn't the DC10 a superior aircraft in almost every respect? I think you're quite right. The only design defect in the 10 was the cargo door issue, which had been sorted out long before. AirNZ obviously chickened out for no logical aviation reason - but perhaps perception is everything? They certainly managed to dig themselves out of the hole with the 747.