TSR2 (Signed prints available.)
Cool Mod
Join Date: Apr 1998
Location: 18nm N of LGW
Posts: 6,185
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I will shortly, once again, be offering for sale prints of XR219 at a price of £36 each (incl of p&p). These prints are signed by Roland 'Bee' Beamont and the original was painted by a PPRuNe member a few years back. The proceeds go to the PPRuNe Fund.
When I can source the cardboard tubes I will take orders for them.
Watch this space as they say!
PPP
When I can source the cardboard tubes I will take orders for them.
Watch this space as they say!
PPP
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Warwick
Posts: 95
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi
I was one of the lucky people to see a TSR2 Fly.
As a kid we lived in Thruxton and watch it fly over from b Down. as the airfield had to stop flying when the TSR2 was airbounre
I was one of the lucky people to see a TSR2 Fly.
As a kid we lived in Thruxton and watch it fly over from b Down. as the airfield had to stop flying when the TSR2 was airbounre
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: london
Posts: 379
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Viola, #20: Did you know that Sir Stanley fought Reginald Maudling in 1957 to save the Olympus engine - the government CANCELLED it to use the Conway ONLY. Bristol developed the early Olympus at their own expense!
Frank Owner invented BE.10 in 1946 and attracted immediate MAP funding. There were no R&D incentive prices in UK turbines till 1962.
In 1956 Conway was design baseline for Victor B.2, Olympus 6 for Vulcan B.2. RR offered MoS a Conway for Vulcan 2 at a fixed unit production price, which was unprecedented before type test. MoS Maudling enjoyed an unexpected competition, where Bristol was obliged to do the same. MoS chose both engines, spreading risk, losing scale economy.
Frank Owner invented BE.10 in 1946 and attracted immediate MAP funding. There were no R&D incentive prices in UK turbines till 1962.
In 1956 Conway was design baseline for Victor B.2, Olympus 6 for Vulcan B.2. RR offered MoS a Conway for Vulcan 2 at a fixed unit production price, which was unprecedented before type test. MoS Maudling enjoyed an unexpected competition, where Bristol was obliged to do the same. MoS chose both engines, spreading risk, losing scale economy.
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 83
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
tornadoken - point taken!
Sir Stanley was obviously writing from his perspective.
I suppose the point I was indirectly making was that the movement from Britain having a world class aviation industry in the early 1950s to the minor league (apart from Concorde) by the late 1960s was the result of a lot more than a particular bunch of politicians cancelling the TSR2 (which was again more complicated as Heimdall says).
Sir Stanley was obviously writing from his perspective.
I suppose the point I was indirectly making was that the movement from Britain having a world class aviation industry in the early 1950s to the minor league (apart from Concorde) by the late 1960s was the result of a lot more than a particular bunch of politicians cancelling the TSR2 (which was again more complicated as Heimdall says).
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: 1 Dunghill Mansions, Putney
Posts: 1,797
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: On the Rump of Pendle Hill Lancashi
Posts: 614
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was lucky enough to actually see several of the Tsr2s flying along with chase planes around the Northern end of the Ribble Valley and using what I now know to be turning points of the huge limestone bulk of " Ingleborough" hill I was at school in nearby Settle and comming from a Raf family had a huge interest in all aircraft.
My later Pater in law actually worked on the originalls and helped to repair the Duxford Tsr by making by hand panels to fit where holes had been made or panels not replaced.
Our lectures at the time pointed to Sunny Jim being threatened by the US government not to make this aircraft and buy one of theirs of the shelf I think I remember the F4 or F1-11 , no doubt some body will correct my old political lessons.
Peter R-B
Vfrpilotpb
My later Pater in law actually worked on the originalls and helped to repair the Duxford Tsr by making by hand panels to fit where holes had been made or panels not replaced.
Our lectures at the time pointed to Sunny Jim being threatened by the US government not to make this aircraft and buy one of theirs of the shelf I think I remember the F4 or F1-11 , no doubt some body will correct my old political lessons.
Peter R-B
Vfrpilotpb
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Not a million miles from EGTF
Age: 68
Posts: 1,579
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The story is well documented and it is abundantly clear that the TSR2 was caught in heavy cross-fire.
The Labour Govt couldn't afford the number of projects (the Tories would have cancelled them if they'd remained in office), the US were desperate to put pressure on the UK to cancel the project and buy the US types. Add to the mix, the Admiralty, in the shape of Lord Mountbatten wanted to ensure their role into the future.
There is a DVD of the story, and it is sickening to watch Roy Jenkins and Denis Healey denying that it was their fault.
It would be good to put together the balance sheet showing how much was wasted chasing the TSR2 replacements.
The worst of it is that Govt still hasn't learnt any lessons on aircraft procurement.
Oh, and if it hadn't been for the rock-solid contract with France, Concorde would have gone as well
The Labour Govt couldn't afford the number of projects (the Tories would have cancelled them if they'd remained in office), the US were desperate to put pressure on the UK to cancel the project and buy the US types. Add to the mix, the Admiralty, in the shape of Lord Mountbatten wanted to ensure their role into the future.
There is a DVD of the story, and it is sickening to watch Roy Jenkins and Denis Healey denying that it was their fault.
It would be good to put together the balance sheet showing how much was wasted chasing the TSR2 replacements.
The worst of it is that Govt still hasn't learnt any lessons on aircraft procurement.
Oh, and if it hadn't been for the rock-solid contract with France, Concorde would have gone as well
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Dunstable, Beds UK
Posts: 545
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In an earlier posting I was involved in moving the TSR2 that ended up in Cosford. In fact we put it on the trailers as you see in the photo in Henlow Beds.
RAF Henlow was a training airfield and how the TRS2 came to be there I don't know.
There were two hangers right at the bottom end of the airfield by the Hitchin Road.
We moved it across from the bottom of the airfield to the top of the airfield where the main hangers were and it was loaded onto the low loader as in the photo.
The second hangar had Shackletons in it being chopped up.
We moved the TSR on 4 Hoverplatforms with airbags and the whole ensemble was towed to the top by 2 tractors.
The Hoverplatform recovery system was made by AeroDocks in Southhampton
and worked very well
RAF Henlow was a training airfield and how the TRS2 came to be there I don't know.
There were two hangers right at the bottom end of the airfield by the Hitchin Road.
We moved it across from the bottom of the airfield to the top of the airfield where the main hangers were and it was loaded onto the low loader as in the photo.
The second hangar had Shackletons in it being chopped up.
We moved the TSR on 4 Hoverplatforms with airbags and the whole ensemble was towed to the top by 2 tractors.
The Hoverplatform recovery system was made by AeroDocks in Southhampton
and worked very well
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Dunstable, Beds UK
Posts: 545
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ZH875
When we got there the aircraft was complete and on its wheels.
I guess they must have trucked it in and then re-assembled it.
I dont know if you were familiar with Henlow?
The hangars at the top were typical solid brick built RAF hangers just as shown in the picture of the aircraft on the transporter.
The couple of "hangars" at the bottom were just the Nisson hut type.
It was almost as though th aircraft had been "hidden"
When we got there the aircraft was complete and on its wheels.
I guess they must have trucked it in and then re-assembled it.
I dont know if you were familiar with Henlow?
The hangars at the top were typical solid brick built RAF hangers just as shown in the picture of the aircraft on the transporter.
The couple of "hangars" at the bottom were just the Nisson hut type.
It was almost as though th aircraft had been "hidden"
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Home
Posts: 1,948
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Peter - RB
You could not have seen several TSR2's over the Ribble Valley as only one TSR2 (XR219) ever flew. Two other examples were complete prior to the project cancellation (XR220 & XR222) but sadly neither made it into the air.
You must have been fortunate enough to see XR219 several times.
You must have been fortunate enough to see XR219 several times.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 71
Posts: 713
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
An aviation 'Old Boy' told me many years ago that the Henlow TSR2 was brought there under secrecy of preservation, because instructions had been given to destroy it. As a young teenager I was lucky enough to gain access to the hangar in question and crawled all over the airframe (I was an Air Cadet at that time). Alongside the airframe were many crates of spares; all bagged in ploythene bags with a distinctive TSR2 label attached. I recall being very tempted to 'nik' a small bag with a bolt in it; just for the TSR2 label! A spare engine also lay alongside the airframe. Whether or not it's true or not I don't know, but our guide told us that the aircraft was very capable of flying again (at that time).
I have a couple of fabulous pictures of the aircraft, taken from the 'chase' Lightning and with Salisbury in the background; however, I'm not sure how to post them here?
I have a couple of fabulous pictures of the aircraft, taken from the 'chase' Lightning and with Salisbury in the background; however, I'm not sure how to post them here?
The hangars at the top were typical solid brick built RAF hangers just as shown in the picture of the aircraft on the transporter.
I saw the TSR-2 sitting on its wheels but by the time I had been to work and then bought some film, it was in pieces on the trailer. The second trailer carrying the wing had already left.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: On the Rump of Pendle Hill Lancashi
Posts: 614
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
TSR,
I quite possibly worded my reply badly, I only ever saw one TSR2 with a chase plane but saw the TSR2 with chase plane on several occasions on different days, nearly always flying in a Northerly direction up the Ribble Valley and turning or starting to at a point just south of Penyghent from there over the top and side of Ingleborough and then streaking out towards the coast, and obviously down to Warton, was very impressive to see such fast A/c over such wonderful terrain! Whilst my school was in the Settle Valley we used to do twice weekly cross country runs up to Giggleswick Scar and over towards Little Stainforth, at the top of Gigg Scar the view is breathtaking!!
PeterR-B
Vfrpilotpb
l
I quite possibly worded my reply badly, I only ever saw one TSR2 with a chase plane but saw the TSR2 with chase plane on several occasions on different days, nearly always flying in a Northerly direction up the Ribble Valley and turning or starting to at a point just south of Penyghent from there over the top and side of Ingleborough and then streaking out towards the coast, and obviously down to Warton, was very impressive to see such fast A/c over such wonderful terrain! Whilst my school was in the Settle Valley we used to do twice weekly cross country runs up to Giggleswick Scar and over towards Little Stainforth, at the top of Gigg Scar the view is breathtaking!!
PeterR-B
Vfrpilotpb
l
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Dunstable, Beds UK
Posts: 545
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Chitterne
Yes that was the story we heard as well and the situation did seem to confirm that.
Was there a Shackleton in the next hagar?
wub.
Yes the bottom hangars had an access gate down on the Hitchin Road.
Memory fading ! what year was that ?
Yes that was the story we heard as well
and the situation did seem to confirm that.Was there a Shackleton in the next hagar?
wub.
Yes the bottom hangars had an access gate down on the Hitchin Road.
Memory fading ! what year was that ?
Zeb
The first thing thats strike you about the TSR2 when you see it is its size.... much bigger than you expect. Some 60% longer than the Tornado and not far short of the length of a Vulcan.
If you compare weights an empty TSR2 came in at about 25,000 kg not far short of the max take off weight of the Tornado at 29,000 kg and some 2.5 times the empty weight of the Canberra it was supposed to replace.
The size no doubt reflects the demanding, and probably too ambitious, specification.
I was impressed by the example at Cosford - it makes a Tornado look like a silly toy.
If you compare weights an empty TSR2 came in at about 25,000 kg not far short of the max take off weight of the Tornado at 29,000 kg and some 2.5 times the empty weight of the Canberra it was supposed to replace.
The size no doubt reflects the demanding, and probably too ambitious, specification.