Air Cadet Gliding pix in the 80s (pre glass)
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I have to admit Guy, that when I first heard that you were going to camouflage her I was a bit horrified! However, looking at the pictures, I rather think it suits her. It'll be interesting to see the reaction she'll get at any fly-ins you attend!
All the best
SS
Beagle ... Without the Lewis guns, she used to cruise very nicely at 55 knots. She would do 65, but was very breezy at that and used a lot more fuel (about 2gallons/hour at 55kts but 3gallons/hour at 65kts).
All the best
SSBeagle ... Without the Lewis guns, she used to cruise very nicely at 55 knots. She would do 65, but was very breezy at that and used a lot more fuel (about 2gallons/hour at 55kts but 3gallons/hour at 65kts).
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I think the Motor Tutor conversion its a waste of what once was a useful glider! However, we are all allowed our own opinions and what the Motor Tutor has to do with this thread I just don't know. How about sombody posting some photos and putting us back on thread?
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Threads often drift a bit WE992. That's what keeps them going and makes them interesting, though I suppose a new offshoot thread is probabably a good idea sometimes.
As for the T31m, well I have to disagree, but like you say "we all have our opinion"
When I converted G-BZLK she was a little used glider that was out of permit. Like many T31 gliders, she was stuffed in the back of a hangar and rarely flown. Many T31's have just rotted away once their CofA's have expired! As a glider they were rubbish except for the job in which they were intended. However, the cadets have moved on and so have gliding clubs. They no longer want 2 minute circuits even though that was a pretty good way to learn IMHO.
So what's best? An original glider that rarely flies or even rots away .... or a very useful motor glider that flies and flies? I did over 100 hours in LK before selling her, attended about 25 fly-ins and had great fun in her. It looks like Guy is on his way to take the world by gun in her and I hope and expect she'll be FLYING for many years.
Just my opinion of course
SS
As for the T31m, well I have to disagree, but like you say "we all have our opinion"
When I converted G-BZLK she was a little used glider that was out of permit. Like many T31 gliders, she was stuffed in the back of a hangar and rarely flown. Many T31's have just rotted away once their CofA's have expired! As a glider they were rubbish except for the job in which they were intended. However, the cadets have moved on and so have gliding clubs. They no longer want 2 minute circuits even though that was a pretty good way to learn IMHO.
So what's best? An original glider that rarely flies or even rots away .... or a very useful motor glider that flies and flies? I did over 100 hours in LK before selling her, attended about 25 fly-ins and had great fun in her. It looks like Guy is on his way to take the world by gun in her and I hope and expect she'll be FLYING for many years.
Just my opinion of course
SS
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I didn't want to cause controversy.
I thought that a picture of WT873, as she is now was relevent. Especially to those who may have flown her.
Isn't 'difference' what makes the workd go round? This would be an awfully boring place if we all thought and did the same things.
Personally, I think there is a place for perfectly restored T31 gliders, just as they were, and a place for something different and unique.
Owning BZLK, has given me a taste for T31's, and I would now like to find one to restore and fly As a glider! Funny old world!
But I agree, lets have some more ATC pictures!
Guy
I thought that a picture of WT873, as she is now was relevent. Especially to those who may have flown her.
Isn't 'difference' what makes the workd go round? This would be an awfully boring place if we all thought and did the same things.
Personally, I think there is a place for perfectly restored T31 gliders, just as they were, and a place for something different and unique.
Owning BZLK, has given me a taste for T31's, and I would now like to find one to restore and fly As a glider! Funny old world!
But I agree, lets have some more ATC pictures!
Guy
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I always thought it would be nice to find a T31 fuselage and restore it and use LK's wings for both. There must be wing damaged T31's out there?
SS
SS
Thread Starter
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Well I've had a root around and these are the last of my collection. Apologies for the execrable quality of these and they really would be scraping the barrel but for the fact they depict the last flight in service of 617's Barge, XN155.
Al Tapsell and J.A.K. "Bill" Williams.
Up she goes.
VNE - ish!
Barge sunset.
Al Tapsell and J.A.K. "Bill" Williams.
Up she goes.
VNE - ish!
Barge sunset.
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Well done, I thought this thread had died!
Is that Rolf Harris in the Right hand seat????
Not ATC, but I hope relevant. Here is BGA 668, the week I went solo. in this a/c at Portmoak in 1976. Sadly this a/c was damaged and used for spares at Upwood in 1985.
and BGA869, in front of Bishop Hill, Portmoak 1976. This T21 is evidently now in Delmenhorst, Germany awaiting restoration.
Guy
Is that Rolf Harris in the Right hand seat????
Not ATC, but I hope relevant. Here is BGA 668, the week I went solo. in this a/c at Portmoak in 1976. Sadly this a/c was damaged and used for spares at Upwood in 1985.
and BGA869, in front of Bishop Hill, Portmoak 1976. This T21 is evidently now in Delmenhorst, Germany awaiting restoration.
Guy
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ATC Gliding
Hi, I was just looking for info on my father-in-law/Typhoons when i found your post. Ian Ladley sadly died in 1990 and is sorely missed, He was indeed a great character. My husband and our son (Ian's son and grandson) have continued the family tradition, my husband glides and is a tuggy and my son also glides, I alsoglide on the odd occasion having been a solo pilot many years ago. We all fly from Shipdham Airfield in Norfolk being members of the '8' Ball Soaring Group which is part of Shipdham Flying club in sunny Norfolk. Up until 1995 we still flew from just beside Swanton Morley Airfield having been made to re-locate due to the Army taking over the airfield (not a popular move!).
Anyway, if you (or indeed anyone else reading this post) have any pictures/anecdotes/stories etc etc about Ian I would very much love to hear from you.
Happy landings,
Janet Ladley
Anyway, if you (or indeed anyone else reading this post) have any pictures/anecdotes/stories etc etc about Ian I would very much love to hear from you.
Happy landings,
Janet Ladley
Ian Ladley
Hi Janet
My instructor at No 1 CGS Hawkinge was Jeff Naylor, but I was checked to fly solo by Ian Ladley. When you are young and impressionable, these are the sort of people one aspires to. I then decided that I wanted to do what they did and become a Gliding Instructor!
I became a staff cadet and worked my way up the Air Cadet gliding instructor ladder and I flew with Ian a number of times on recat checks.
I worked long and hard and became CFI of an Air Cadet Gliding School. Well worth the hard work!
They are not forgotten.
My instructor at No 1 CGS Hawkinge was Jeff Naylor, but I was checked to fly solo by Ian Ladley. When you are young and impressionable, these are the sort of people one aspires to. I then decided that I wanted to do what they did and become a Gliding Instructor!
I became a staff cadet and worked my way up the Air Cadet gliding instructor ladder and I flew with Ian a number of times on recat checks.
I worked long and hard and became CFI of an Air Cadet Gliding School. Well worth the hard work!
They are not forgotten.
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Ian Ladley
The name Jeff Naylor rings a bell, I must have heard it mention in the family.
It's nice to know that the likes of Ian inspired so may folk, as we are still in touch with the 611 at Watton we know that that inspriration continues.
I'll pass your kind thoughts on to hubby and son.
Regards.
It's nice to know that the likes of Ian inspired so may folk, as we are still in touch with the 611 at Watton we know that that inspriration continues.
I'll pass your kind thoughts on to hubby and son.
Regards.
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Geoff Naylor
I knew Geoff Naylor at London Gliding Club Dunstable in the early seventies. A very nice chap, and a gifted pilot and instructor. He also was a talented artist, I still have two of his pictures on my wall. What happened to him after that?
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663 VGS RAF Kinloss 29th June 1986
This was taken on the second last day of "wood" at Kinloss
L-R Steven Laing, Geoff Smith, Terry McNeill, Roddy Kemp, Roddy MacRae, Laurie Beaton (The Boss), Gavin MacDonald, Paddy Cunningham, Gordon Crookshanks, Alan Gray, Duncan Sutherland, Jeremy Joynson, Mark Conway and Graham Morrison
Missing from the picture - Bob McGregor, John Hutchinson, Richard Osbourne, Ian Smith, Alan Docherty, Ken Thompson and Mark Shelly
The aircraft were WB961, WB974, XE785, XA290 and XN241 and the cadets were from 161 ATC Squadron Inverness.
It was quite a sad day as 663 VGS was the last operational school in the UK to finish on "wood". The penultimate school to finish on "wood" had been two weeks previously and ACCGS" had stopped flying "wood" on the previous Friday.
It had been planned to fly long into the evening of Sunday 29th June as it was our last chance before the airfield was to be dug up and we converted onto the Venture T2. As with many summer days at Kinloss, the wind was swinging round quite a bit. So at about 1530 it was planned to change ends from runway 08 to runway 26. This was done by launching all the aircraft and recovering them to the other end of the airfield.
I was last in line for launch and the wind had swung round quite a bit by the time i got the last cable. It took some time to get flying speed with the tail wind, but finally i got up in the air achieving a lofty 700ft before cable release. This was just enough height for a gentle 180 degree turn over the forest and land on the 26 end.
I had just pulled the aircraft off the landing site when i noticed a Sedbergh in a very nose down attitude at about 900ft above the airfield. It promptly pulled up into a very smart loop, leveled off and turned down-wind for landing. It was not the first time a Sedbergh had been upside down over Kinloss but it was the first time it had been done in front of the "Boss" Laurie Beaton (top bloke).
Probably quite rightly he thought the silly season was about to descend so flying operations were suspended early. There was one final Sedbergh flight with Jeremy Joynson and Roddy Kemp.
So it turned out, unknown to me, that i had just flown the last operational Kerby Cadet Mk3 flight in RAF service. It was XN241 and my passenger was cadet Kerr. It lasted 3 minutes.
Oh the looping pilot...................... was one P...y C........m (another top bloke) who had taught me to fly.
Last take-off and landing of Sedbergh at Kinloss 29 June 1986
The wings don't look too bent from its loop on the previuos flight
Lunch on the Sunday 29th - Waiting for the fog to lift
The p**s up on the beech to celebrate/commiserate the end of "wood"
Great times and i would love to do it all over again
This was taken on the second last day of "wood" at Kinloss
L-R Steven Laing, Geoff Smith, Terry McNeill, Roddy Kemp, Roddy MacRae, Laurie Beaton (The Boss), Gavin MacDonald, Paddy Cunningham, Gordon Crookshanks, Alan Gray, Duncan Sutherland, Jeremy Joynson, Mark Conway and Graham Morrison
Missing from the picture - Bob McGregor, John Hutchinson, Richard Osbourne, Ian Smith, Alan Docherty, Ken Thompson and Mark Shelly
The aircraft were WB961, WB974, XE785, XA290 and XN241 and the cadets were from 161 ATC Squadron Inverness.
It was quite a sad day as 663 VGS was the last operational school in the UK to finish on "wood". The penultimate school to finish on "wood" had been two weeks previously and ACCGS" had stopped flying "wood" on the previous Friday.
It had been planned to fly long into the evening of Sunday 29th June as it was our last chance before the airfield was to be dug up and we converted onto the Venture T2. As with many summer days at Kinloss, the wind was swinging round quite a bit. So at about 1530 it was planned to change ends from runway 08 to runway 26. This was done by launching all the aircraft and recovering them to the other end of the airfield.
I was last in line for launch and the wind had swung round quite a bit by the time i got the last cable. It took some time to get flying speed with the tail wind, but finally i got up in the air achieving a lofty 700ft before cable release. This was just enough height for a gentle 180 degree turn over the forest and land on the 26 end.
I had just pulled the aircraft off the landing site when i noticed a Sedbergh in a very nose down attitude at about 900ft above the airfield. It promptly pulled up into a very smart loop, leveled off and turned down-wind for landing. It was not the first time a Sedbergh had been upside down over Kinloss but it was the first time it had been done in front of the "Boss" Laurie Beaton (top bloke).
Probably quite rightly he thought the silly season was about to descend so flying operations were suspended early. There was one final Sedbergh flight with Jeremy Joynson and Roddy Kemp.
So it turned out, unknown to me, that i had just flown the last operational Kerby Cadet Mk3 flight in RAF service. It was XN241 and my passenger was cadet Kerr. It lasted 3 minutes.
Oh the looping pilot...................... was one P...y C........m
(another top bloke) who had taught me to fly.Last take-off and landing of Sedbergh at Kinloss 29 June 1986
The wings don't look too bent from its loop on the previuos flight
Lunch on the Sunday 29th - Waiting for the fog to lift
The p**s up on the beech to celebrate/commiserate the end of "wood"
Great times and i would love to do it all over again
Last edited by XA290; 21st Jan 2020 at 17:23.
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663 VGS - RAF Kinloss - All Weather Gliding School
As you can see we would fly in all sorts of weather. Normally we would wait for the showers to pass but in between showers there was a chance for some fun. One of our pilots was called Bob. He was known affectionatly as Bob Knob.
While he was flying, large objects would be built in the snow or massive drawings would be made (as can be seen in the top picture) in the snow that could be seen from circuit height (not that high i guess).
Another wheeze was to build massive snow balls and give them to the PAX to lob over board at the top of the launch. The aim being to try and get it onto the grill on top of the winch thus covering the hapless winch driver in snow. I seem to recall on this day in March 86 we had quite a bit of success. It took practice though.
As you can see we would fly in all sorts of weather. Normally we would wait for the showers to pass
but in between showers there was a chance for some fun. One of our pilots was called Bob. He was known affectionatly as Bob Knob. While he was flying, large objects would be built in the snow or massive drawings would be made (as can be seen in the top picture) in the snow that could be seen from circuit height (not that high i guess).
Another wheeze was to build massive snow balls and give them to the PAX to lob over board at the top of the launch. The aim being to try and get it onto the grill on top of the winch thus covering the hapless winch driver in snow. I seem to recall on this day in March 86 we had quite a bit of success. It took practice though.
Last edited by XA290; 18th Jun 2009 at 14:46.
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.............. some more 663 VGS pics
Waiting for launch on the 08 end with the NMSU in the background
Down-wind left with Findhorn Bay in the background
IIRC this was taken on a mid week flying evening in May 1986 so the BBC could get some footage to use on a programme about Prince Andrew. It was to be put out before his wedding later in the year.
To achieve this picture, two Barges had to be launched in quick succession (the first one having to pole bend like b*gg**y) and then formate. I have to say it looked great from the ground. I cant remember who was flying at the time though.
Waiting for launch on the 08 end with the NMSU in the background
Down-wind left with Findhorn Bay in the background
IIRC this was taken on a mid week flying evening in May 1986 so the BBC could get some footage to use on a programme about Prince Andrew. It was to be put out before his wedding later in the year.
To achieve this picture, two Barges had to be launched in quick succession (the first one having to pole bend like b*gg**y) and then formate. I have to say it looked great from the ground. I cant remember who was flying at the time though.
Last edited by XA290; 25th Nov 2009 at 22:11.
Happy Days
This thread brings back memories - Primary "slides" on the school field with the RAF CCF (Harrow County), flying scholarship (Sywell) and then as I had 5 months to wait before Sleaford Tech I joined the local (Ruislip) ATC Squadron, and blagged a gliding course at Swanton Morley (Oct 62). Heard about the Cuban Missile Crisis in the middle of the airfield and we future pilots expressing the hope that they held the war off until we were through flying training - stupid youths!
Now living in France and aged 65 I am about to start gliding again at Fontenay le Comte in the Vendee - booked in for bapteme de l'air at 1500 next Sunday. Cannot wait!
Wander00
Now living in France and aged 65 I am about to start gliding again at Fontenay le Comte in the Vendee - booked in for bapteme de l'air at 1500 next Sunday. Cannot wait!
Wander00
Iron ArxE
How about a 4 hour aero tow in March from Cranwell to Weston Super Mare and return 10 days later - in T21s. We did that in either 63 or 64 and the trip required a landing at Weston Zoyland to refuel the Chipmunk tugs from cans. We had 2 flying suits on each with thermal underwear (woolly bears) and helmet inners and Mk1 bonedomes on for warmth (No, less cold). A couple of us helped with a retrieve from a field in the Mendips (NOT a T21) and we convinced the slightly slow witted barmaid in a pub that we were specialist vets looking after a trailer load of dachsund horses! Silly really.
Wander00
Wander00
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ATC Gliding School
I can't remember the Number but I had a wonderful time as a Staff Cadet at Langley Bucks, Hawkers Factory was building Sea Furies and BSAA flying Yorks and Lancs of the grass.
Must have been 48 &49 I guess.
Must have been 48 &49 I guess.