PPRuNe Forums - SQ domestic confirmed??????

PPRuNe Forums (https://www.pprune.org/)

- Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific-90/)

- - SQ domestic confirmed?????? (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/68141-sq-domestic-confirmed.html)

Has anyone considered the possibility of a financial alliance between v.b and S.Q?

How would Q.F react to that ?

TIMMEEEE,

Seeing as you have asked your questions twice I guess you want an answer!

Do they have a confirmed AOC? Alliance Airlines have
( international too!)

Have they secured terminal space? Alliance Ailines have.

Have they recruited the requisite staff? Alliance Airlines have.

Have they commenced to advertise in advance? Alliance Airlines have the groundwork done.

Have they set up an operations base from which to run this mysterious airline? Alliance Airlines have.

Have they sought any tax concessions from the state or federal govts to date? Alliance Airlines have.

So the answer must be...................

Keg point taken re 3rd airline, thankfully I'm not the only punter to get it wrong.

Someone mentioned a possible tie-up between VB and SIA. This has been discussed to death some time ago on pprune. Yes SIA did buy 49% of Virgin Atlantic some time ago, and have lost a fortune through this investment. I could be wrong however I understand VB is a stand alone company in the Virgin Empire. As such SIA could invest sure, however why start an airline to compete against an empire you are an investor in ? Shoot yourself in the foot ?

TIMMEE - You have a habit of repeating points as facts that have already been successfully rebutted!

Just one for now. The reason SQ didn't buy Ansett when they wanted to was because ANZ stopped them by exercising their right to buy the remaining 50% that they did not already have.
SQ didn't withdraw, they were never allowed to compete.

:cool: Great sign-off Gaunty from a legendary show.

I'm yet to see evidence of direct singaporean funds behind alliance, unlike rex which is now over 35% owned by singaporean investors, and in major talks with Sia..... can somebody explain why Sia would use a few F100’s and a braz to enter the domestic market here.
Wouldn’t they be more interested in through traffic to a destination like Canberra rather than gladstone and rocky????

BlueEagle .

The points I raised were extremely relevant and were repeated because nobody could provide anything of real substance.
After much rumour/innuendo and blatant laughabale rumour mungering finally Q-duck answered my questions.

Blue Eagle - the points you made about Air NZ/SQ are a piece of obvious history which is dead and buried and common knowledge to one and all (especially those 16,000+ Australians that lost their careers).

Thanks Q-duck for answering the questions I asked.

Can anyone give a web-site for Alliance Airlines perhaps?

Aladdin,
From what I've been told Alliance have plans for many more F100 routes, but they need more aircraft. Once another 2 - 4 aircraft arrive than they will announce further routes. Another reason SIA would use Alliance and their F100's, is the F100's are fitted with Business seats.

There are many things happening in the background and the owners/investers in Alliance have been in the game for many years. From what I've seen they will not announce anything until it's signed and in the bag:cool:

TIMMEEEE – you asked (referring to Singapore Airlines) :

“Do they have a confirmed AOC?”

Yes – they do.

Australian AOC number F503421-08 was issued 30-May-2002 and is valid until 31-May-2005.

Although this AOC does not explicitly authorise domestic operations, and although the smallest aircraft type currently listed on the certificate is an A310-300, the variation of an existing AOC is generally much less painful (and is much faster) than obtaining a new AOC from scratch.

Mr Corrigan does not think a third carrier is likely

Virgin expects 30 pc
By Megan Neil
01oct02

LOW cost airline Virgin Blue expected to have 30 per cent of Australia's aviation market by the end of 2003, its half owner Patrick Corp said.

Patrick managing director Chris Corrigan also said the stevedoring and logistics group would not sell down its 50 per cent stake in the airline if Sir Richard Branson's Virgin Group went ahead with a float of Virgin Blue next year.
Mr Corrigan told investors in New York that Virgin Blue now had 20 per cent of the market, up from 10 per cent a year ago.

Qantas Airways Ltd currently held around 78 per cent, he said.

"We have aircraft on order which will be delivered before March of next year, which should take us to a 30 per cent market share we believe by December of 2003," Mr Corrigan told the Merrill Lynch Australasia investment conference.

But he said the target was dependent on better terminal access, particularly at the former Ansett terminal at Sydney airport.

"Hopefully reason will prevail there and we'll get access to the old Ansett facility there and that will allow us to expand," he said.

"It's not critical for us in the next 12 months but obviously the sooner it happens the better."

Mr Corrigan said Patrick did not have "any particular interest" in selling down its Virgin Blue stake, acquired for $260 million in March, but he noted that the Virgin Group was pursuing a secondary sale of its interest.

"If that occurs or not I don't know but it wouldn't surprise me if that occurred some time in the first half of next year."

He later told journalists that Patrick had an obligation to sell down five per cent of its stake if that occurred, but did not know if the company would be required to do so and it would not divest a greater share.

The airline was currently servicing 19 of the top 20 routes in Australia, which represented 85 per cent of all passenger movements in Australia.

The last - the Sydney to Canberra route - would follow when Virgin Blue gained access to the Ansett terminal in Sydney, Mr Corrigan said.

There has been talk of a third airline entering the Australian market, with Singapore Airlines the subject of much speculation.

But Mr Corrigan did not think a third carrier was likely.

"Do I think it's likely, no I don't think it's very likely but the airline business does seem to be notoriously unpredictable."

privacy © The Australian

I think you are drawing a long bow there BIK. That AOC is specifically for International operations and is the same one that any International airline gets.

A domestic operation is quite different and would probably require a specific AOC.

What about Virgin teaming up with someone like SIA and/or redefining/refining their product?

At the same time, negotiate a great deal from one of the manufacturers and/or various leasing companies for continued expansion?

The 737NG does an excellent job but would the A320 be a better choice if you had modified your business model to include a dual class service, similar to what Alliance is offering, i.e. a full business product plus a 'low cost' service in Y?

I think it would be hard for anyone to justify starting a sizeable (new) airline in Oz at the moment (or elsewhere!) however it would be a lot easier to slightly amend your product to allow higher yield pax to travel with you - as opposed to the competition. Just need to be careful about not spoiling what you already have...

TIMMEE - Your post said:

"I figured the ex AN guys would have learnt as they trusted SQ to be their Knight in shining armour some 18 months ago and it just didnt happen "

Quite what are you getting at? You mentioned 'trust' and imply that SQ let Ansett down and therefore possibly shouldn't be trusted in the future, not so, ANZ let Ansett down and yes, everybody, with the possible exception of yourself, knows this.

So, how is QF's AOC written? Do they have 2 AOC's for DOM & INTL or 1?

Domeair. Don't forget that DJ would never, ever want the loyal Aussie battlers to pay a cent more than they have to! It's why they are so charitable & in there fighting for us. That reminds me, can registered charities apply for an AOC??:rolleyes:

Judging by an article in the Fin Review today, it looks like SQ is waiting to see the result of a QF stake in Air Nz.

If Air NZ goes to One World, chances are that SQ would start in its own right domestically. According to the report, this would cost Air NZ around $ 40 million and forms part of the QF - Air NZ talks.

On the other hand, if QF can be lured to Star Alliance, forget any direct SQ domestic operation in Australia.

Anyone have other ideas on the subject ?

Is there a realistic chance of QF being lured to the Star Alliance? Would BA, with their holding in QF, be able to block it?

I have still got a case of Crown Lager in my shed, that says Singapore Airlines don't have the cods to start a new airline down here in Oz.

Any takers?

:D :D :rolleyes: