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-   -   QF Group Ground Handling Cuts (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/635020-qf-group-ground-handling-cuts.html)

T-Vasis 25th Aug 2020 03:02

QF Group Ground Handling Cuts
 
Jetstar is terminating 370 employees in a move to outsource 100% of their ground handling function. Qantas will go through a 'bid' process with internal and external groups for ground handling across Australia.

https://www.afr.com/companies/transp...0200825-p55p3o

https://www.smh.com.au/business/comp...25-p55p3l.html

dr dre 25th Aug 2020 03:22

It's pretty much what happened with Catering a few years back. Those jobs are outsourced and are technically not part of the group, which means the official headcount of employees reduces, but those people are still doing the same work for a new outsourcing provider.

T-Vasis 25th Aug 2020 03:33

Not exactly. Qantas sold their catering business (what remained) to Dnata. The Cairns and Sydney units to Gate Gourmet back in 2012.

This is a case of outsourcing versus insourcing. This enables competitive labour pricing pressure and greater workforce flexibility without the liabilities Qantas retains today. Whilst many of these workers will secure new roles at third-party handlers - not all will. And for now - most of them won't. What will be interesting is how much 'productivity' will be relinquished by the current in-house teams in order to avoid outsourcing to third-parties. That will be very interesting as I am sure the QF award is more favourable than say a Swissport or Menzies etc. But I don't know...

unobtanium 25th Aug 2020 04:14


Originally Posted by T-Vasis (Post 10869678)
Not exactly. Qantas sold their catering business (what remained) to Dnata. The Cairns and Sydney units to Gate Gourmet back in 2012.

This is a case of outsourcing versus insourcing. This enables competitive labour pricing pressure and greater workforce flexibility without the liabilities Qantas retains today. Whilst many of these workers will secure new roles at third-party handlers - not all will. And for now - most of them won't. What will be interesting is how much 'productivity' will be relinquished by the current in-house teams in order to avoid outsourcing to third-parties. That will be very interesting as I am sure the QF award is more favourable than say a Swissport or Menzies etc. But I don't know...

Ask any Dnata/snapfresh worker how happy they are being ineligible for jobkeeper as its foreign owned.

PoppaJo 25th Aug 2020 04:29

Itís the Tiger model. Outsource every single thing aside Pilots. Even Tiger went down the path of contract Cabin Crew via third party operators however ended in tears.

Swissport have plenty of Tiger Airbus equipment laying around.

non_state_actor 25th Aug 2020 04:31

From what I have witnessed outsourcing ground staff never really works and results in many unintended problems as a result. I am sure it's cheaper on paper though.

unobtanium 25th Aug 2020 04:36

I know afew AeroNOcare staff, and they were treated so badly turnover rate was ridiculous. Same with Swissport, Oceania or whatever they're called now. Basically if you don't like it, leave. Promotions, good shifts and management positions for mates only.

Adambrau 25th Aug 2020 05:47

Hoping AF keeps us in-house at JFK. We're the last of the foreign carriers at JFK to do so.

Ascend Charlie 25th Aug 2020 06:29

Why don't they outsource Joyce?

blubak 25th Aug 2020 06:32


Originally Posted by T-Vasis (Post 10869678)
Not exactly. Qantas sold their catering business (what remained) to Dnata. The Cairns and Sydney units to Gate Gourmet back in 2012.

This is a case of outsourcing versus insourcing. This enables competitive labour pricing pressure and greater workforce flexibility without the liabilities Qantas retains today. Whilst many of these workers will secure new roles at third-party handlers - not all will. And for now - most of them won't. What will be interesting is how much 'productivity' will be relinquished by the current in-house teams in order to avoid outsourcing to third-parties. That will be very interesting as I am sure the QF award is more favourable than say a Swissport or Menzies etc. But I don't know...

labour pricing pressure & workforce flexibility really works so well!!,lets take the aged care sector as an example,what can go wrong.

banana cucumber 25th Aug 2020 06:47

I just dont understand why the Board still retains AJ. Is he really that good in his job?

patty50 25th Aug 2020 06:58

Very few will want to stay on as Swissport, who in their right mind goes from full time hitting $100-120k/year to casual making $22/hr on 3 hour shifts. All ground crew knew this would happen eventually.

There will certainly be plenty of tears along the way for Qantas. If youíre ever flying on a Friday night or Sunday make sure you donít pack a bag because youíll be waiting awhile.

Superman1 25th Aug 2020 07:10

Swissport will be rubbing their hands together with this one and VA will follow suit shortly and all ramp services in all Australian airports will be provided by third party contractors.

Sad day for those involved they will go from a heavily unionised workforce loading a 737 with 6 people on $100k a year each and great staff travel benefits to loading it with 3 people on a good day, being paid $60k each full time with no benefits and greatly reduced rostering benefits.

This will be a tough pill to swallow but likely was going to happen over the next 5-10 years anyway. COVID/19 has simply accelerated the process, provided justification and prompted QF and JQ to act in this exceptionally rare time there will be minimal operational impact.

if this was attempted outside of COVID the staff would have walked off the job by now with airports severely disrupted. The unions will be furious thatís a lot of their hardcore members gone.

blubak 25th Aug 2020 08:04


Originally Posted by Superman1 (Post 10869764)
Swissport will be rubbing their hands together with this one and VA will follow suit shortly and all ramp services in all Australian airports will be provided by third party contractors.

Sad day for those involved they will go from a heavily unionised workforce loading a 737 with 6 people on $100k a year each and great staff travel benefits to loading it with 3 people on a good day, being paid $60k each full time with no benefits and greatly reduced rostering benefits.

This will be a tough pill to swallow but likely was going to happen over the next 5-10 years anyway. COVID/19 has simply accelerated the process, provided justification and prompted QF and JQ to act in this exceptionally rare time there will be minimal operational impact.

if this was attempted outside of COVID the staff would have walked off the job by now with airports severely disrupted. The unions will be furious thatís a lot of their hardcore members gone.

100k a year for how many hrs a week?,not 38 i can tell u.
Maybe you would like to elaborate on the great staff travel benefits too?
Standby only with low priority,that does seen great,doesnt it!

lc_461 25th Aug 2020 08:25

Sure there are a few full time rampies pulling big bucks, but the vast majority of new hires for at least the last 5-10 years were already employed by a subsidiary, Qantas Ground Services.
This led to a workforce predominantly guaranteed 20h/week and salary generally equal to or in some cases, less than the ground handling companies they compete with.
Trying to break free from these conditions was an aim of the last EBA negotiations.
So i'm not sure how much $$ they will save on staff, but perhaps capital expenses.. if they have to buy 50 new tugs over the next few years I think they can easily get to $250K each.

Icarus2001 25th Aug 2020 08:39


to casual making $22/hr on 3 hour shifts.
Minimum casual wage is $24.80 per hour.

Based on the full time hourly rate of $19.84 with a 25% loading.

https://www.fairwork.gov.au/how-we-w.../minimum-wages



Why don't they outsource Joyce?
Because "they" benchmark management packages against New York and London but the workers wages against Mumbai and Dhaka.

flyingfrenchman 25th Aug 2020 08:42

Maybe they are factoring in the saving from reduced workerís compensation claims, itís rumoured the costs of this alone are huge.

patty50 25th Aug 2020 08:44


Originally Posted by lc_461 (Post 10869813)
Sure there are a few full time rampies pulling big bucks, but the vast majority of new hires for at least the last 5-10 years were already employed by a subsidiary, Qantas Ground Services.
This led to a workforce predominantly guaranteed 20h/week and salary generally equal to or in some cases, less than the ground handling companies they compete with.
Trying to break free from these conditions was an aim of the last EBA negotiations.

Having worked for both QGS and Aerocare I can promise you QGS will pay about double over a fortnight with plenty of time on your arse to watch football, play cards, study, whatever.

Pre-covid plenty of QGS part timers hitting 70-90k, itís significantly more than many other blue collar type full time jobs. A QAL full timer doing zero overtime will hit 80k, with sickies, LSL, 20th days, DILs and annual leave they only work 40 weeks a year.

On compo, for QAL it is self insured and the rorts are truly impressive. Smash out the overtime for 3 months pick your ailment of choice, tell Doc it hurts when you drive and stay home for 6 months doing whatever.

Icarus2001 25th Aug 2020 08:49


Maybe they are factoring in the saving from reduced worker’s compensation claims, it’s rumoured the costs of this alone are huge.
Normally covered by the obligatory insurance not the employer.

https://www.fairwork.gov.au/leave/workers-compensation

machtuk 25th Aug 2020 10:41

It's the way of doing business, max profits for the smallest outlay! Airlines exist to make money, they are not there to make everyone happy or doing it for fun!


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