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-   -   Jetstar to reopen NZ domestic from 01 JULY (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/632989-jetstar-reopen-nz-domestic-01-july.html)

Chris2303 4th Jun 2020 01:06

Jetstar to reopen NZ domestic from 01 JULY
 
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/ind...of-hibernation

ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE 4th Jun 2020 01:41

I think the article is a little misleading as the July schedule was never cancelled by JQ.

Once NZ gets to level 1 restrictions (where the middle seat doesnít need to be blocked) I have no doubt JQ will ramp up flying, as they are beginning to in Aus domestic.

Ragnor 4th Jun 2020 02:19

Is JQ ramping up in Aus also?

Lookleft 4th Jun 2020 02:57

A lot of NB pilots are getting revalidated in the sim. The word is they will be reestablishing a big chunk of their domestic network and TT but only out of the bigger bases.

Ollie Onion 4th Jun 2020 03:30

There is a new schedule for July published on Jetstar.com now for NZ so the article is technically right.

Chad Gates 4th Jun 2020 03:55


Originally Posted by Ragnor (Post 10801555)
Is JQ ramping up in Aus also?

itís a start


https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....8ca0f6156.jpeg

HOOROO 4th Jun 2020 08:27

Jetstar use the Air New Zealand sim centre in Auckland for training their pilots when they arenít required to be sent to Melbourne. A very reputable source has said that shortly after that article was published, the remaining sims planned by Jetstar were cancelled by Air New Zealand. After a discussion was had between CEOís and NZALPA, the sims were reinstated but the anticompetitive behaviour leaves a sour taste.

ElZilcho 4th Jun 2020 08:40

Or perhaps because Air NZ recently made approximately 100 Airbus FO’s redundant who need replacing via down-training as Domestic (and shortly Tasman) flying picks back up.

The SIMS (except for 777) will be working 24/7 to facilitate all the seat changes so reserving sim slots for the Aussies might not of been overly practical.

But hey, if we want to talk about anti-competive, let’s talk about the the Aussie Airline who ditched NZ Domestic during COVID (while we had to fly virtually empty Aircraft for essential services) swooping back in with $30 tickets after applying Australian laws to NZ employees and standing everyone down on zero pay. Seems fair.


ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE 4th Jun 2020 08:48


Originally Posted by ElZilcho (Post 10801763)
Or perhaps because Air NZ recently made approximately 100 Airbus FOís redundant who need replacing via down-training as Domestic (and shortly Tasman) flying picks back up.

The SIMS (except for 777) will be working 24/7 to facilitate all the seat changes so reserving sim slots for the Aussies might not of been overly practical.

But hey, if we want to talk about anti-competive, letís talk about the the Aussie Airline who ditched NZ Domestic during COVID (while we had to fly virtually empty Aircraft for essential services) swooping back in with $30 tickets after applying Australian laws to NZ employees and standing everyone down on zero pay. Seems fair.

werent those air NZ services subsidised by the govt?

ElZilcho 4th Jun 2020 08:53


Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE (Post 10801770)
werent those air NZ services subsidised by the govt?

They were a condition of the loan agreement, which hasnít been touched due to the eye watering interest rate attached to it.

Freight Flights were subsidised, as part a multi Airline arrangement.

HOOROO 4th Jun 2020 08:59


Originally Posted by ElZilcho (Post 10801763)
Or perhaps because Air NZ recently made approximately 100 Airbus FO’s redundant who need replacing via down-training as Domestic (and shortly Tasman) flying picks back up.

The SIMS (except for 777) will be working 24/7 to facilitate all the seat changes so reserving sim slots for the Aussies might not of been overly practical

But hey, if we want to talk about anti-competive, let’s talk about the the Aussie Airline who ditched NZ Domestic during COVID (while we had to fly virtually empty Aircraft for essential services) swooping back in with $30 tickets after applying Australian laws to NZ employees and standing everyone down on zero pay. Seems fair.

The timing of the sim cancelations after the article is too much of a coincidence. The New Zealand media have basically said nothing about Jetstar New Zealand over the last couple of months and then soon as an article comes out about Jetstar ramping up, the sims get cancelled

I agree with your point about practicality, but I would have thought Air New Zealand would be wanting as much revenue coming in as possible. A third party hiring the sim in the double figures this month alone seems like a good revenue stream.

I don’t make the decisions high up but I do know I’ve received full pay the last 2 months

ElZilcho 4th Jun 2020 09:11

How long ago were the slots booked? Was it always the plan to ramp back up now, or (like Air NZ) was it a case of last minute “wait, people can leisure travel now?” with the NZ government flip flopping every other day with their COVID restrictions?

The timing is an interesting coincidence, but as you alluded, I can’t see us turning down the revenue.

I often suspect situations such as this look sinister on the surface when in reality someone just F’d up! I can see some Air NZ manager reading the paper during their morning ablutions to suddenly realise “shit! Don’t we need those sim slots?”

ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE 4th Jun 2020 09:15


Originally Posted by ElZilcho (Post 10801775)
They were a condition of the loan agreement, which hasnít been touched due to the eye watering interest rate attached to it.

Freight Flights were subsidised, as part a multi Airline arrangement.

so how was JQ not flying for the 2 months of COVID restrictions anti competitive?

ANstar 4th Jun 2020 09:47


Originally Posted by ElZilcho (Post 10801763)
Or perhaps because Air NZ recently made approximately 100 Airbus FOís redundant who need replacing via down-training as Domestic (and shortly Tasman) flying picks back up.

The SIMS (except for 777) will be working 24/7 to facilitate all the seat changes so reserving sim slots for the Aussies might not of been overly practical.

But hey, if we want to talk about anti-competive, letís talk about the the Aussie Airline who ditched NZ Domestic during COVID (while we had to fly virtually empty Aircraft for essential services) swooping back in with $30 tickets after applying Australian laws to NZ employees and standing everyone down on zero pay. Seems fair.


I believe the choice was redundancy or leave without pay... what option would you choose? The poor guys at Air NZ didn't get the same choice did they?

And the devil Aussie airline wasn't being underwritten by the NZ govt to allow services to continue. NZ was only operating as they were being underwritten by the government.

ElZilcho 4th Jun 2020 09:48


Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE (Post 10801790)
so how was JQ not flying for the 2 months of COVID restrictions anti competitive?

A selective quote from my original post taken out of context.

JQ did not suffer the same cash burn on this side of the ditch as Air NZ and avoided redundancy costs. I’m all too familiar with the QF group cherry picking between NZ & AUS employment laws and regulations when it suits them. They fend off FWA with one arm claiming NZ contracts while brushing the ERA aside with other citing they’re an “Australian company”.

Anyway, NZ and QF are dealing with their own battles at home, but as J* is such a small operator here they’ve avoided the spotlight. While we deal with a grumpy public demanding refunds for flights, many Longhual and some nit even cancelled yet, JQ comes to the rescue with below cost Airfares having spent the last few months ducking for cover.

BOTH Air NZ and QF can be as bad as each other. My original post, which you cherry picked one line from, simply gave a less sinister explanation as to why Air NZ might of cancelled the SIM slots. If we go looking for it, it’s not hard to come up with potential examples of Anti-Competitive behaviour from both Airlines over the years, as I just did. Let’s be honest, anyone selling tickets for $34 post COVID will be raiding the piggy bank to do so.


Originally Posted by ANstar (Post 10801827)
I believe the choice was redundancy or leave without pay... what option would you choose? The poor guys at Air NZ didn't get the same choice did they?

And the devil Aussie airline wasn't being underwritten by the NZ govt to allow services to continue. NZ was only operating as they were being underwritten by the government.

Well that also be a case of constructive dismissal as you cannot force an employee to accept LWOP in NZ. J*/JC & VANZ Pilots fell through the cracks between Wellington and Canberra. If Air NZ tried that on it’d be before the ERA and on the front page of every paper in the country.

As for those flights being underwritten, the loan hasn’t been touched due to the interest rate. We’re still burning our own cash at the moment.

Lookleft 4th Jun 2020 09:53

They have always advertised the lowest fare which get sold out very quickly its been a part of the marketing from day one. What most people will discover is that those cheap seats are sold very quickly and the $150.00 one way to Dunedin fare will be the norm. Not anti-competitive just marketing.

ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE 4th Jun 2020 10:02


Originally Posted by ElZilcho (Post 10801829)
Letís be honest, anyone selling tickets for $34 post COVID will be raiding the piggy bank to do so.

So youíre upset that a low fares airline is offering low fares?

If you look closely next time you taxi us youíll see it written on the side of the plane!

All day, everyday!

ElZilcho 4th Jun 2020 10:22


Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE (Post 10801840)
So you’re upset that a low fares airline is offering low fares?
If you look closely next time you taxi us you’ll see it written on the side of the plane!

All day, everyday!

Again, take my whole post in and not one line of it.

Air NZ cancels sim slots for J* ahead of the largest down-training programme any of us will (likely) see in our careers but the first mention of it here is that it’s anti-competitive.

JQ (QF) apply Australian employment regulations (LWOP) to NZ crew through way of an ultimatum, with Billions in the bank, but that’s not anti-competitive, just good business. Bit like Ryan Air having all their Pilots “self employed via companies setup in Ireland” so they can avoid the majority of the EU laws and taxes.

Anything can be claimed as anti-competitive or just good business practise if we squint hard enough and look at it sideways... as is often the case here. Strange how JQ is basically the devil when we’re talking about Australian aviation, but over this side of the ditch? Nah it’s all good mate.

ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE 4th Jun 2020 10:41


Originally Posted by ElZilcho (Post 10801863)

JQ (QF) apply Australian employment regulations (LWOP) to NZ crew through way of an ultimatum, with Billions in the bank, but thatís not anti-competitive, just good business.

No, they had a vote to amend their agreement to include stand down provisions in line with NZ industrial relations law.

In doing so there have been no redundancies (thus far) as opposed to Air NZ and VANZ.

StudentInDebt 4th Jun 2020 13:43

So, anyway, flying or not flying from July 1st? :)


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