PPRuNe Forums

PPRuNe Forums (https://www.pprune.org/)
-   Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific-90/)
-   -   All borders to reopen. (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/632861-all-borders-reopen.html)

Jester64 23rd Jan 2022 05:01


Originally Posted by turbantime (Post 11173893)
Definitely noticed this as well. I’m hoping the initial fear is subsiding as the general population gets used to living alongside the virus. The bed wetters are still pretty vocal on social media calling for more restrictions to keep them ‘safe’ though. It’s more likely people heading home after their holidays but one can only hope.

On the isolation requirements; one of our family member, who is a doctor, tested a ‘weak positive’. Had a “tickle in his throat” one morning and did a RAT as he works in ED. By next day, is completely asymptomatic and negative RAT. His wife is also an ED doctor. Both now have to isolate for 7 days despite both showing no symptoms and coming up negative on RAT. Both had boosters. We’ll need to treat this like any respiratory virus to get back to normal. Remember the days when you stayed home until you felt better? For some it was a few days, for others it was only one day and then back into it? That’s where this needs to be heading.

well said.

Hey SOPS, should PER go into lockdown or just let the current outbreak grow?

Chronic Snoozer 23rd Jan 2022 05:32


Originally Posted by Jester64 (Post 11173895)
well said.

Hey SOPS, should PER go into lockdown or just let the current outbreak grow?

"Let it grow, let it grow
Can't hold it back anymore"

.......sorry. :bored:

Torukmacto 23rd Jan 2022 05:36


Originally Posted by turbantime (Post 11173893)
Definitely noticed this as well. I’m hoping the initial fear is subsiding as the general population gets used to living alongside the virus. The bed wetters are still pretty vocal on social media calling for more restrictions to keep them ‘safe’ though. It’s more likely people heading home after their holidays but one can only hope.

On the isolation requirements; one of our family member, who is a doctor, tested a ‘weak positive’. Had a “tickle in his throat” one morning and did a RAT as he works in ED. By next day, is completely asymptomatic and negative RAT. His wife is also an ED doctor. Both now have to isolate for 7 days despite both showing no symptoms and coming up negative on RAT. Both had boosters. We’ll need to treat this like any respiratory virus to get back to normal. Remember the days when you stayed home until you felt better? For some it was a few days, for others it was only one day and then back into it? That’s where this needs to be heading.

Agree , it feels like the majority have had enough , fear fatigue setting in and the east coast have decided it’s time to take their life back . Daily infections coming down , deaths unfortunately will take awhile to come down but they will . Having an election has made things worse , politicians on both sides inclined to pander to the bed wetters instead of doing what’s needed . Media trying to wring the last out of it and once something else gets our attention they will change direction to stoke the fears again .


dr dre 23rd Jan 2022 05:50


Originally Posted by Jester64 (Post 11173895)
well said.

Hey SOPS, should PER go into lockdown or just let the current outbreak grow?

Won't make a difference now.

24 local cases, a doubling of last week's rate. I'd say it's starting to get away from them. Let's see how many FIFO workers test positive in preflight screening this week.

At this rate the border may even be open BEFORE Feb 5, as they have said that uncontrolled local spread will make it redundant.

Jester64 23rd Jan 2022 05:54

Exactly. Won’t be surprised to see a gradual reopening to start within the next 4 weeks.

Keg 23rd Jan 2022 05:56

There is no hiding under the doona until this passes over. It’s coming for everyone eventually. We’re one freaking nation. The internal borders should be open. End of story.

Jester64 23rd Jan 2022 05:58

When you have a significant part of the WA population, including the Premier turning their backs on the many stranded Australians abroad, sadly not all of us think of Australia as one.

aviation_enthus 23rd Jan 2022 05:59


Originally Posted by Xeptu (Post 11173885)
no-one would argue with that. but that's not what going to happen, everything stops, you still can't travel at least for very long and you are left with even bigger problems. We are used to make a call and it's delivered or nip down to the store and get it yourself, wait till it's, sorry mate I don't have any and don't know when I will. when that stops your own business/ activity, now what. Do what we are doing close up for a month re-access after that.

But you yourself have said the isolation requirements are what’s making everything fall apart.

It’s not the numbers that are actually sick to the point they can’t work. Most people could go back to work after a few days. While asymptomatic cases wouldn’t be off work at all. It’s the isolation requirements that are based on the old “COVID zero” idea.

So what do you hope to achieve by your suggestion of “closing the borders again” ??

That strategy made sense back in 2020 when there was hardly any cases in Aus, it makes absolutely no sense now.

And yes as others have said, freedom of movement and seeing family is a reason to open up after almost two years of this rubbish. We have vaccines, we have testing facilities, we have had 18 months or more to prepare health strategies. What more do we need? It’s not going away.

Xeptu 23rd Jan 2022 06:07


Originally Posted by Keg (Post 11173903)
There is no hiding under the doona until this passes over. It’s coming for everyone eventually. We’re one freaking nation. The internal borders should be open. End of story.

Not quite end of story. I agree with you but before you open the borders, it must not be with isolation requirements, to do so will only nobble the economy and that is vastly worse than any virus. When you open the borders you do so accepting that there will be hospitalisations and some of those will die, probably in the order of hundreds. If your not willing to accept that then don't open the borders.

dr dre 23rd Jan 2022 06:18


Originally Posted by Xeptu (Post 11173909)
Not quite end of story. I agree with you but before you open the borders, it must not be with isolation requirements, to do so will only nobble the economy and that is vastly worse than any virus. When you open the borders you do so accepting that there will be hospitalisations and some of those will die, probably in the order of hundreds. If your not willing to accept that then don't open the borders.

Or people rushing Emergency Departments or triple 0 calls for what are mild symptoms that don't require emergency care.

Those who have been infected but have no more symptoms should be able to return to work with a mask or negative RAT, not be out of action for 7/14 days.

Xeptu 23rd Jan 2022 06:24


Originally Posted by dr dre (Post 11173913)
Or people rushing Emergency Departments or triple 0 calls for what are mild symptoms that don't require emergency care.

Those who have been infected but have no more symptoms should be able to return to work with a mask or negative RAT, not be out of action for 7/14 days.

Agreed, to be clear, we made the decision to open up, we are vaxxed, we are ready. We didn't know there would be a govt/ health objective to still contain the virus, WHY, if you were going to do that, don't open the borders. 8 weeks ago we wouldn't have known about a virus in SA, just the same as WA is today. Today we are all closing down, we cannot operate under these conditions. It's going to take months to recover from this mess.

dr dre 23rd Jan 2022 06:27


Originally Posted by Xeptu (Post 11173882)
Tourism and Travel is the very last think on anybody's mind if at all. This is going to take months to recover from and more likely a year and it only started 8 weeks ago.

Nah it'll come back quicker than ever, it already has:

EU Commercial flights in December 2021: closest yet to 2019 figures

December Was Aviation’s Top Month In 2021 Despite Omicron


dr dre 23rd Jan 2022 06:29


Originally Posted by Xeptu (Post 11173914)
Agreed, to be clear, we made the decision to open up, we are vaxxed, we are ready. We didn't know there would be a govt/ health objective to still contain the virus, WHY, if you were going to do that, don't open the borders. 8 weeks ago we wouldn't have known about a virus in SA, just the same as WA is today. Today we are all closing down, we cannot operate under these conditions. It's going to take months to recover from this mess.

So it appears the problem isn't the virus but the countermeasures being used.

Therefore the impetus should be to change Covid measures rather than keep the border closed.


Xeptu 23rd Jan 2022 06:37


Originally Posted by dr dre (Post 11173915)
Nah it'll come back quicker than ever, it already has

I can't speak for figures and someone else's experience, all I can tell you we are shutting down all operations at the end of the month for a month, 16 staff directly effected, half pay and a mix of annual leave to get them through, if supply is restored I expect we'll be operational by about mid april, that's going into winter, our off season. This situation is a fair spanking among all of us in the business community in SA. All i'm trying to do is make you guys in WA aware of what to expect if you take the same path.

Jester64 23rd Jan 2022 06:44

Australia hit its vaccination target. If everyone stopped pissing their pants and didn’t RAT or PCR themselves due to fear for a virus that is currently giving an extremely high survival rate, and left the testing to those only in hospital, we would have just 5,000 active cases instead of 1.1 million

Xeptu 23rd Jan 2022 06:47

My commander and chief (she who must be obeyed) says we were at 130% of capacity 4 weeks ago, now we are at 20% those numbers won't be reported until after July and won't come up in the figures until October, those economic numbers as a state is going to be frightening.

Icarus2001 23rd Jan 2022 07:31


All i'm trying to do is make you guys in WA aware of what to expect if you take the same path.
Of course if WA waits another month, they will get the same result.

If WA waits another three months, they will get the same result.

This is the point you and SOPs seem to ignore, there will never be a better time to open.

dr dre 23rd Jan 2022 07:45


Originally Posted by Icarus2001 (Post 11173937)
Of course if WA waits another month, they will get the same result.

If WA waits another three months, they will get the same result.

Actually if they wait another three months the result will be far worse. Another three months will be the start of May. The peak efficiency of the vaccinations of the elderly is in late March. Open up in 3 months and the wave will go well into winter, combined with an Influenza and RSV wave. It'll really make hospitals suffer and McGowan's poll numbers too.

The best result will be an opening before the middle of March. Anything after will be noticeably worse.

Omicron is however well established in the community. If they theoretically did not allow another person to cross the border again there's enough local cases that there'll be a massive wave when winter hits. And the elderly boosters will have really waned by then. It'd be a disaster.

That's basically what the CHO himself has written in the advice presented.

There's so much fear now that people who test positive will panic and flood EDs and 000 like in the east. All they can do is ensure there are sensible rules for health staff to ensure the workforce isn't depleted and they can triage and calm down the "worried well" as they are called.

Any rules for other workers will have an effect on the economy as a whole. As does media fearmongering.

The direction of the pandemic in WA is pretty much set now. I'd say the only question is if the current wave takes off exponentially to render the borders moot, or if they can hold out to at the absolute latest mid March.

Icarus2001 23rd Jan 2022 07:53

Personally I would like to see an inquiry into the role of the media in making the C19 outbreak appear far worse than it is which in turn has led politicians to jump at shadows.
The behaviour of the media as a whole has been unconscionable. A disease with greater than 98% survival rate and they have people scared of leaving home.
They simply get away with saying whatever they want with never any consequences as no one polices the media. What a great system.

Xeptu 23rd Jan 2022 08:04


Originally Posted by Icarus2001 (Post 11173937)
Of course if WA waits another month, they will get the same result.

If WA waits another three months, they will get the same result.

This is the point you and SOPs seem to ignore, there will never be a better time to open.

OK you go ahead and do it, it's your business. knock yourselves out. We don't import anything from WA anyway, it has no impact upon us at all. It's solely a decision for West Australians.

So long as you understand all that's going to change is that you'll tank your economy and lose your localised freedoms.


All times are GMT. The time now is 00:15.


Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.