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-   -   All borders to reopen. (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/632861-all-borders-reopen.html)

43Inches 1st Sep 2021 01:12


It’s a ‘deplorables’ type moment. You won’t win over people speaking to them like that.
With that comment you just lost your credibility and obviously trying to make this political, poorly.

It's also not a headline, it's a tweet. Twitter is quite clearly aimed at those already listening to the FDA, not trying to win over crackpots who won't listen anyway. Again you are taking something out of context and getting offended by it, showing some personal investment in the anti idea.

If you want respect from mainstream society and not be treated like a joke, don't act like one in the first place. Govs don't reason with extremists, they just deal with them by ignoring them, mocking them or education programs, arguing with someone that's nuts never works. If you think someone is going to apply reasonable conversation when the opposition starts from an irrational point of view, well you might be kidding yourself. They get air time from media as they attract attention with their far out views, but even the media showing them often mocks them to the face with the tone of interview.

ExtraShot 1st Sep 2021 01:32


Originally Posted by 43Inches (Post 11104399)
With that comment you just lost your credibility and obviously trying to make this political, poorly.

It's also not a headline, it's a tweet. Twitter is quite clearly aimed at those already listening to the FDA, not trying to win over crackpots who won't listen anyway. Again you are taking something out of context and getting offended by it, showing some personal investment in the anti idea.

If you want respect from mainstream society and not be treated like a joke, don't act like one in the first place. Govs don't reason with extremists, they just deal with them by ignoring them, mocking them or education programs, arguing with someone that's nuts never works. If you think someone is going to apply reasonable conversation when the opposition starts from an irrational point of view, well you might be kidding yourself. They get air time from media as they attract attention with their far out views, but even the media showing them often mocks them to the face with the tone of interview.

Oh please. That comparison is absolutely valid. Hillary only needed a small percentage of those ‘deplorable s’ and things would have been very different. You don’t need all the anti vax extremists, that’s not realistic. You just want as many as you can, but you aren’t getting most of them past the headline of it starts out by giving them $h&t. Besides, The political comparison was already made above. It’s no secret that ivermectin is a favorite topic among many on the right.

I’ve implied repeatedly you’re going to struggle to get those people to change their minds, but if you want to win any of them over, use Honey, not vinegar.

It is not the government’s place to use people’s taxes mock any of their citizens.

43Inches 1st Sep 2021 01:37

Look up the Herman Cain Award if you want to see proper mockery of the dead.

'The Herman Cain Freedom Award'.

Qualifications for nomination:
  • Public declaration of one's anti-mask, anti-vaxx, or Covid-hoax views.
  • Admission to hospital for Covid.
Qualifications for award:
  • Award is granted upon the nominee's release from their Earthly shackles.


This is normal behaviour in the US for this type of thing, the FDA comment is not even close to mocking the dead.

ExtraShot 1st Sep 2021 01:54


Originally Posted by 43Inches (Post 11104406)
Look up the Herman Cain Award if you want to see proper mockery of the dead.


This is normal behaviour in the US for this type of thing, the FDA comment is not even close to mocking the dead.

Indeed. Both completely inappropriate IMO…

43Inches 1st Sep 2021 02:05

Regardless, the tweet is one of the highest rated tweets made by the FDA recently with over 110,000 likes and 70,000 retweets, 50% higher than their news that Pfizer was approved in the US. Is the wit appropriate? well that's personal. Did it get the message circulating? a resounding yes in FDA terms, therefore was it successful use of FDA resources, most definitely. Will a few people feel stupid and alienated, yes they will. Will a lot stay away from taking horse drugs to treat covid, most certainly yes. So did tax payers get bang for their buck, most certainly yes as the message was spread quickly and effectively.

De_flieger 1st Sep 2021 02:25


Originally Posted by ExtraShot (Post 11104409)
Indeed. Both completely inappropriate IMO…

Well, that's your opinion. If you really want to see inappropriate behaviour, check out - as mentioned by 43Inches - The Herman Cain Award for a neverending stream of people mocking and insulting doctors, public health efforts and insulting people who get vaccinated as cowards, weak, sheep and so on, then dying of an illness that could have been largely prevented with vaccination. A lot of them have been vehement defenders of freedom of speech, loudly insisting that anyone who gets offended by what they say are snowflakes and possibly communists, so it's only fair that their own words are remembered as being proven wrong in the most permanent of ways, surely they wouldn't be offended by others exercising that same freedom of speech by remembering their own words?

And why is it called the Herman Cain Award? Because after downplaying the seriousness of covid, insisting it was a media beatup and then proceding to die of covid, his pre-scheduled twitter post went out post-mortem, claiming that covid wasn't as lethal as the media claimed.

dr dre 1st Sep 2021 02:28


Originally Posted by ExtraShot (Post 11104409)
Indeed. Both completely inappropriate IMO…

Then what is an appropriate way to stop people thinking horse dewormer is better for Covid than a vaccine?

All the medical advice, studies, recommendations, awareness campaigns etc haven’t changed the minds of these people. The FDA trying to tell people in a joking manner that horse dewormer is bad is too offensive apparently. Trying to stop misinformation being pushed on Fox or Sky News is “denying freedom of speech” apparently.

So the message doesn’t get through, and it costs society through increased infections, healthcare costs and deaths.


Originally Posted by De_flieger (Post 11104416)
Well, that's your opinion. If you really want to see inappropriate behaviour, check out - as mentioned by 43Inches - The Herman Cain Award for a neverending stream of people mocking and insulting doctors, public health efforts and insulting people who get vaccinated as cowards, weak, sheep and so on, then dying of an illness that could have been largely prevented with vaccination. A lot of them have been vehement defenders of freedom of speech, loudly insisting that anyone who gets offended by what they say are snowflakes and possibly communists, so it's only fair that their own words are remembered as being proven wrong in the most permanent of ways, surely they wouldn't be offended by others exercising that same freedom of speech by remembering their own words?

True - the same types who’ve been crying about “snowflakes” and “don’t get so offended” over the last few years are now crying that their feelings are upset when they’re told to stop taking HORSE DEWORMER.

Torukmacto 1st Sep 2021 02:39

Murdoch has somehow registered sky news under entertainment. So he can say anything and no one can stop him as it’s just entertainment . No journalistic standards apply , no fact checking , nothing .

Gnadenburg 1st Sep 2021 02:42


Originally Posted by RodH (Post 11104355)
How about this for utter hypocrisy by the Qld. Premier.

The story below is an excerpt from the ABC news web site and it appears that again there are different rules for sports people and VIP's. and they are coming from a hot spot in Sydney

"The play in question is the NRL jetting in about 100 league officials, players' wives, girlfriends and children into Brisbane from the COVID-19 hotspot of Sydney. "

The Qld. Govt has sanctioned this little visit.

How can our citizens be told to take things seriously and how important it is to maintain social distancing etc. and that these rules are vital if we are to beat this Pandemic when things like this happen. The Premier even states that she is very concerned about " border hopping " that puts Queenslanders at risk!!! and yet this happens.

It's her hypocrisy that enables many to justify "border hopping". I was up on an unmanned border crossing yesterday and many people crossing over. Some for their work, others to see family. A lot of them Queenslanders who have livelihoods in NSW. It will only get worse. The State borders are porous.



ExtraShot 1st Sep 2021 02:54


Then what is an appropriate way to stop people thinking horse dewormer is better for Covid than a vaccine?
I don’t know if you necessarily have to convince everyone though? The best you can do is be open, honest, and provide the facts, repeatedly. Get to as many as you can. I mean, some people are going to ingest things they shouldn’t no matter what.

Theres always going to be people you can’t get through to. Especially in the US where people seem to have much more freedom to do what they like.

I’ve discussed ad nauseam with some friends who were anti vax or vax hesitant (surprisingly a couple of them I’d definitely classify as of the left of politics, one even pretty far left) about the efficacy of vaccines, vaccine safety, vaccines as a pathway to normality and an organisations’ rights for mandates… in spite of the evidence some people will believe what they will, I don’t know how you change that.

As long as you can get 80% plus of a total population and even higher for the most vulnerable, and the people who refuse to get it can’t attend high risk environments, how much more is suppose to be done? In the end they’ve taken the risk of not being vaxxed or relying on a substance that won’t work and they’re free to do it.


cLeArIcE 1st Sep 2021 03:11

No need to worry, our old mate Darwin will hopefully take care of all of this over the next few months.

On a different note, I don't understand this need for compassionate travel for funerals. To see loved one's before they die, of course but for the funeral?
Yeah, It's a nice to be with with family and grieve under normal circumstances but, it's hardly necessary. It's not going to bring them back is it? Especially If they died of Covid.
No better way to honour the dead of a pandemic then to bring a bunch Of people together in a church or building to hug, cry and touch each other whilst paying a small fortunate for the pleasure. :rolleyes:
If only there was another way of sharing that power point presentation full of old photos and sad music. Humans are weird. So emotionally needy.

Xeptu 1st Sep 2021 03:26


Originally Posted by cLeArIcE (Post 11104428)
No need to worry, our old mate Darwin will hopefully take care of all of this over the next few months.

On a different note, I don't understand this need for compassionate travel for funerals. To see loved one's before they die, of course but for the funeral?
Yeah, It's a nice to be with with family and grieve under normal circumstances but, it's hardly necessary. It's not going to bring them back is it? Especially If they died of Covid.
No better way to honour the dead of a pandemic then to bring a bunch Of people together in a church or building to hug, cry and touch each other whilst paying a small fortunate for the pleasure. :rolleyes:
If only there was another way of sharing that power point presentation full of old photos and sad music. Humans are weird. So emotionally needy.

So true, if only they would die all at once, then we could cremate them all at the same time, no need for funerals at all then, there is precedent for that you know.

43Inches 1st Sep 2021 03:34


On a different note, I don't understand this need for compassionate travel for funerals. To see loved one's before they die, of course but for the funeral?
Yeah, It's a nice to be with with family and grieve under normal circumstances but, it's hardly necessary. It's not going to bring them back is it? Especially If they died of Covid.
No better way to honour the dead of a pandemic then to bring a bunch Of people together in a church or building to hug, cry and touch each other whilst paying a small fortunate for the pleasure. https://www.pprune.org/images/smilie...n_rolleyes.gif
If only there was another way of sharing that power point presentation full of old photos and sad music. Humans are weird. So emotionally needy.
While I share your point of view regarding death many don't. The need for funerals is a complex ideal based on your culture, religion, beliefs, morals, and many other things. It's very hard to understand an individuals feeling for this so it really has to be accommodated for. You could apply the same to all religions because if I don't believe in it, why should other people, so does half the population have to stop being religious.

How we grieve is very much up to the individual, some can write it off and move on, others need finality and closure, which is what a funeral represents. Some cultures the grieving goes on for years beyond the funeral with multiple dates you gather and remember. You just have to be tolerant of others sensitivities and if they are not hurting anyone, why not try to make them feel better about a bad situation.

Xeptu 1st Sep 2021 03:36


Originally Posted by 43Inches (Post 11104434)
While I share your point of view regarding death many don't. The need for funerals is a complex ideal based on your culture, religion, beliefs, morals, and many other things. It's very hard to understand an individuals feeling for this so it really has to be accommodated for. You could apply the same to all religions because if I don't believe in it, why should other people, so does half the population have to stop being religious.

How we grieve is very much up to the individual, some can write it off and move on, others need finality and closure, which is what a funeral represents. Some cultures the grieving goes on for years beyond the funeral with multiple dates you gather and remember. You just have to be tolerant of others sensitivities and if they are not hurting anyone, why not try to make them feel better about a bad situation.

I do think it was written in the same context as my response, A WARNING!

Xeptu 1st Sep 2021 03:43

A Nation in Crisis is a Nation vulnerable

Step one. create a mandate everyone will agree with.
Step two, enforce the mandate
Step three remove anyone and anything that does not support the mandate
Step four delegate responsibility for any further mandates to a single entity
Step five create any mandate that entity wants.

43Inches 1st Sep 2021 03:55


A Nation in Crisis is a Nation vulnerable
The biggest worry is McGowan, any real push for the commonwealth to 'punish' WA for not opening borders can only strengthen his position. With his approval ratings and some good spin he could easily push a move to secede from the commonwealth and align with more lucrative foreign trade. If you want a conspiracy look there. WA is more likely to hold the commonwealth to financial ransom than the opposite. What would the feds do without the massive boost they get from WAs mining trade.

KRviator 1st Sep 2021 04:06


Originally Posted by 43I
What would the feds do without the massive boost they get from WAs mining trade.

Not have to give WA their "fair share" of the GST revenue, worry about Fleet Base West, or the other defence assets deployed to WA, Ronny could be relocated from Pearce to Sale and they could offload the maintenance for the Trans-Australian Railway from the border back to WestRail.

All at a time the iron ore price looks like heading south in the next few years. Perfect time to do it!

The more important question would be for McGowan: How you gonna run a surplus with iron ore prices back around $60/tonne?

cLeArIcE 1st Sep 2021 04:06

Look I'm not saying to hell with humanity As you can probably tell I am not a religious person ,:E nor am I particularly emotional kind of person. A Millennial that still embraces the "stiff upper lip" approach to most things in life. ( I don't know if that unusual or not).
But I 100% believe in live and let live. If you are not hurting anyone, you do what you want to do through life. I acknowledge we all deal with grief and death very differently. I couldn't care less if my family throw my body in a dumpster. I'm dead. I don't need it. But I'm aware I'm not normal in that regard.
All I'm asking is that right now, at this moment in time, is this nicety really necessary?

Xeptu 1st Sep 2021 04:06


Originally Posted by 43Inches (Post 11104438)
The biggest worry is McGowan, any real push for the commonwealth to 'punish' WA for not opening borders can only strengthen his position. With his approval ratings and some good spin he could easily push a move to secede from the commonwealth and align with more lucrative foreign trade. If you want a conspiracy look there. WA is more likely to hold the commonwealth to financial ransom than the opposite. What would the feds do without the massive boost they get from WAs mining trade.

WA doesn't need to do that, all it needs to do is build desal plants all the way up the coast and feed an unlimited water supply into about 200km's inland, then open that up to agriculture, Cities would emerge all along the coast which would make it the biggest population in the biggest state that will dwarf Eastern Australia. To secede would be plain dumb.

The plan is to be the biggest state, with the biggest population, in one country on one continent.

Xeptu 1st Sep 2021 04:19


Originally Posted by cLeArIcE (Post 11104443)
All I'm asking is that right now, at this moment in time, is this nicety really necessary?

Yes it is! and it can still be conducted safely in the same way football teams come into the state, no differently.


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