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-   -   All borders to reopen. (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/632861-all-borders-reopen.html)

currawong 15th Jul 2020 11:38

Turnleft080 -

"Hence all your body organs are getting 20% less O2. Well that's really good for your brain."

Given this is a professional pilots forum I would urge you to reconsider that statement.

Or go back to pilot school.

You decide.

Australopithecus 15th Jul 2020 11:50

Turnleft080...

The whole point of masks is to prevent a pre-symptomatic or asymptomatic infected individual from spreading the virus. Its for the protection of others. Its a demonstration of civility and consideration for others.

Also...your assertion that a gas permeable mask somehow reduces your O2 intake is as astonishing as it is wrong.

LapSap 15th Jul 2020 11:51


Originally Posted by currawong (Post 10837777)
Turnleft080 -

"Hence all your body organs are getting 20% less O2. Well that's really good for your brain."

Given this is a professional pilots forum I would urge you to reconsider that statement.

Or go back to pilot school.

You decide.

Thanks currawong.
Beat me to it.
https://hypoxico.com/altitude-to-oxygen-chart/

Clearly been spending too much time at 8000 ft.

Turnleft080 15th Jul 2020 12:41

If that’s you, please feel free to ride the HK MTR at peak time without a mask.

I'II have a go at that. The more viruses I'm exposed to the better. That way you start to build up immunity. That way your anti bodies get more stronger.
Here is an interesting thought. Just say you put your new born in a space suit for 10 years and for the first time he/she takes the space suit off.
A cold, dirt under the finger nail, any food past it's used by date could kill. Why? No immunity build up. The immune system will not recognise these foreign bodies.
So before I go to HK,I will dose up on garlic/ginger,onion,Vit C, Vit D, (all that good stuff you get organically) and a stack of fermented food with trillions of good bacteria.
I will not forget to drink 8 glasses of water either. Don't forget what our mate Hippocrates said in 370BC. Food is your medicine and medicine is your food.

PS. I'm listing to a Melbourne radio station (3aw) as I type, they had a 40 year practiced doctor (Dr Ross) on. He mentioned sunlight alone kills Covid-19.
If you sneeze in the open in direct sunlight exposed to UVA/UVB the virus dies instantly within 30sec. If you sneeze inside a closed room the virus will
lurk around for 24 hours +. So when a government closes the beach they got know idea. As I mentioned before governments scare me not the virus.
Goodnight good health.

Turnleft080 15th Jul 2020 12:51


Originally Posted by Australopithecus (Post 10837782)
Turnleft080...

The whole point of masks is to prevent a pre-symptomatic or asymptomatic infected individual from spreading the virus. Its for the protection of others. Its a demonstration of civility and consideration for others.

Also...your assertion that a gas permeable mask somehow reduces your O2 intake is as astonishing as it is wrong.

I've actually seen people take off the mask, take a few deep breaths then put back on again.
I've seen people drive around windows up with a face mask on. It made me suffocate. Got to laugh
.

Stickshift3000 15th Jul 2020 13:06


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10837835)
If that’s you, please feel free to ride the HK MTR at peak time without a mask.

I'II have a go at that. The more viruses I'm exposed to the better. That way you start to build up immunity. That way your anti bodies get more stronger.
Here is an interesting thought. Just say you put your new born in a space suit for 10 years and for the first time he/she takes the space suit off.
A cold, dirt under the finger nail, any food past it's used by date could kill. Why? No immunity build up. The immune system will not recognise these foreign bodies.
So before I go to HK,I will dose up on garlic/ginger,onion,Vit C, Vit D, (all that good stuff you get organically) and a stack of fermented food with trillions of good bacteria.
I will not forget to drink 8 glasses of water either. Don't forget what our mate Hippocrates said in 370BC. Food is your medicine and medicine is your food.

PS. I'm listing to a Melbourne radio station (3aw) as I type, they had a 40 year practiced doctor (Dr Ross) on. He mentioned sunlight alone kills Covid-19.
If you sneeze in the open in direct sunlight exposed to UVA/UVB the virus dies instantly within 30sec. If you sneeze inside a closed room the virus will
lurk around for 24 hours +. So when a government closes the beach they got know idea. As I mentioned before governments scare me not the virus.
Goodnight good health.

Are you Pete Evans?

If not, you should meet up with him, you have a lot in common and could be friends.

Awol57 15th Jul 2020 13:25

I for one feel better knowing that "the virus dies instantly within 30sec".

Turnleft080 15th Jul 2020 13:41

Who is Pete Evans? Got no idea. Never herd of him.
However as you mentioned him I googled him. He is a chef. Yes his website mentioned what I mentioned. Well, well, well. How about that.
Their you go I'm 55 and I studied Hippocrates when I had to do an assignment on him in primary school. I have never looked back.
Cheers for the info.

Cdash 15th Jul 2020 13:53

MEL preparing to become the sole entry point into the country very soon. Currently setting up 40+ hotels for quarantine and a hospital to be the dedicated covid hospital.

A week ago I would have said tough on Victorians as borders will remain shut for them but it had the potential to allow the wheels to keep turning in other states, also a bubble between those other states and NZ if they could manage to keep their cases down.
This week Sydney looking just as bad, the country can’t afford to close off the two largest cities for the foreseeable future.

interesting times my friends

Turnleft080 15th Jul 2020 21:50


Originally Posted by Awol57 (Post 10837867)
I for one feel better knowing that "the virus dies instantly within 30sec".

To back up your statement remember when the first lockdown occurred at the end of summer and thousands turned up on
Bondi & Manly beaches on that beautiful sunny day. The government or councils said you idiots, where closing the beaches.
Not one case showed up afterwards. Why? Due to UVA/UVB, sunlight penetrating your skin to make Vit D boosting your immune system.
That's why your body is innate. It's intelligent. It's designed to thrive on this planet. Food water oxygen exercise. Simple.
Then a few days later I think a boat called the Ruby Princess docked a boat with no HEPA filters with there air-conditioning.



ozbiggles 15th Jul 2020 22:47

There was plenty of sunlight available on the Ruby Princess so what does that say about your Vitamin D theory?

I don’t ask for your response for any other reason than a good laugh.

rmm 15th Jul 2020 22:50


Originally Posted by Cdash (Post 10837882)
This week Sydney looking just as bad, the country can’t afford to close off the two largest cities for the foreseeable future.

Lets hope the NSW govt ring fence these outbreaks early. I thought this was the plan all along for post curve flattening outbreaks.
I hope they don't sit back like dithering Dan and let the thing get out of control before acting.

Jeps 15th Jul 2020 22:55


Originally Posted by rmm (Post 10838228)
Lets hope the NSW govt ring fence these outbreaks early. I thought this was the plan all along for post curve flattening outbreaks.
I hope they don't sit back like dithering Dan and let the thing get out of control before acting.

Seen the new reports this morning? Think it might be already too late.

BNEA320 15th Jul 2020 23:34


Originally Posted by Jeps (Post 10838231)
Seen the new reports this morning? Think it might be already too late.

govts should stop trying to stop spread but protect the oldies & vulnerable & their carers. Open all borders & all businesses without any restrictions whatsoever.

ozbiggles 16th Jul 2020 00:02


Originally Posted by BNEA320 (Post 10838250)
govts should stop trying to stop spread but protect the oldies & vulnerable & their carers. Open all borders & all businesses without any restrictions whatsoever.

Because that is working so well...

You notice in Victoria we are now losing health care workers, police and others because they have to self isolate, which by world standards is a pretty small outbreak? To the extent already the plan is to have the ADF driving the ambulances because there will not be enough paramedics? Shortly if they don’t put the genie back in the bottle It won’t matter what is wrong with you. The probability of you dying will increase because you won’t be able to get a cop or paramedic to you in the timeframe you needed.




Turnleft080 16th Jul 2020 00:46


Originally Posted by ozbiggles (Post 10838264)
Because that is working so well...

You notice in Victoria we are now losing health care workers, police and others because they have to self isolate, which by world standards is a pretty small outbreak? To the extent already the plan is to have the ADF driving the ambulances because there will not be enough paramedics? Shortly if they don’t put the genie back in the bottle It won’t matter what is wrong with you. The probability of you dying will increase because you won’t be able to get a cop or paramedic to you in the timeframe you needed.


Ozbiggles your scaring me. You sound like a politician. All doom and gloom. Sounds like catching Covid is an automatic death sentence.
Aus numbers: 10500 cases: 8000 recoverd, 2400 mild condition, 28 in ICU, 111 deaths.
In bold is recoveries. How is that for a good number? Probably healthy people. The mild conditions: the healthy will recover the rest will go to ICU and your looking at 98% recovering.
Those with pre existing morbid conditions still have a chance of survival depending on their immune system. The chances are small for 10500 cases.
Regarding Vit D. Try living in the very high or very low lats with no sun for 6 months.
I think your primary school science teacher once said,"if we didn't have a sun we would not survive."
We would be prone to all viruses end of planet.

Xeptu 16th Jul 2020 00:55

Try not to confuse Recovered with Cured, they are very different things. At this point in time, outcome is still a roll of the dice.

HabuHunter 16th Jul 2020 01:06


Originally Posted by Australopithecus (Post 10837568)
Kindly refrain from selectively quoting me. You clipped out the part where I wrote “Scandinavian neighbours”.

Its pointless to compare their death rate with countries run by populist clowns and populations intent on expressing their “freedumbs”

Denmark death rate 105/million pop
Norway death rate. 47/million
Finland death rate. 59/million

Sweden death rate 549/million

51/2 times higher than Denmark, 11 1/2 times higher than Norway.

sometimes post hoc, ergo propter hoc is a real thing.


Apologies mate, I didn’t mean to selectively quote you, I just did it for the sake of brevity.
But your reply makes me wonder because I did acknowledge your original comment re neighbours.

This is what I said and I still think it’s accurate. I don’t understand your comment about populist clowns and freedumbs.



“Sweden’s death rate while higher than its immediate neighbours is still lower than the UK, Belgium, Germany, Spain and Italy... all of whom locked down. Some other countries that did NOT lock down such as South Korea, Taipei and others have really low death rates.”

Correlation does not prove causation.


ozbiggles 16th Jul 2020 02:07


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10838280)
Ozbiggles your scaring me. You sound like a politician. All doom and gloom. Sounds like catching Covid is an automatic death sentence.
Aus numbers: 10500 cases: 8000 recoverd, 2400 mild condition, 28 in ICU, 111 deaths.
In bold is recoveries. How is that for a good number? Probably healthy people. The mild conditions: the healthy will recover the rest will go to ICU and your looking at 98% recovering.
Those with pre existing morbid conditions still have a chance of survival depending on their immune system. The chances are small for 10500 cases.
Regarding Vit D. Try living in the very high or very low lats with no sun for 6 months.
I think your primary school science teacher once said,"if we didn't have a sun we would not survive."
We would be prone to all viruses end of planet.

I agree, the Australian numbers are good. And that is my point, if we turn them into American numbers percentage wise then not so good.

Im all for the state borders opening and the ‘Tasman bubble’ ASAP, probably a small delay with Victoria now however. I now, used to be, in the aviation workforce. I would like nothing more than to see the remaining pilots flying their backsides off. But I don’t want to see the ‘good’ results we have now turn into what we see overseas.

I watched the ABC Australia American correspondent Kathryn Diss I think it is talking about her experience having just recently caught it in the news today. She looks good and admits it was a mild case. When she talks about it as a mild case it is pretty stuffed up. She still has a pulse rate sitting 20 beats per minute higher than it used to and some other lingering effects. She is 30 years old, listen to her describe what is going on and tell me you wish that on any young person.

As for my primary school science teacher, I think I was staring outside at 747s flying by when she spoke.

currawong 16th Jul 2020 04:20


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10837874)
Who is Pete Evans? Got no idea. Never herd of him.
However as you mentioned him I googled him. He is a chef. Yes his website mentioned what I mentioned. Well, well, well. How about that.
Their you go I'm 55 and I studied Hippocrates when I had to do an assignment on him in primary school. I have never looked back.
Cheers for the info.

55? Really? Couple of months ago you told us you were 60.

Gone back to pilot school yet?

Or do you still think 20% less oxygen is .... well, you know the rest.

jrfsp 16th Jul 2020 04:29

Getting back to the borders....the issue remains if VIC/NSW pursue an suppression strategy, the borders to the other states will not open while they have elimination. We need to have a whole country solution.

morno 16th Jul 2020 09:00

Would all the “it’s not a bad virus” people mind going and getting infected, then tell us about the aftermath and whether you’re still able to maintain a class 1 medical?

Because I certainly don’t want to follow your idea of just letting it run rampant, getting it, then finding that perhaps your ‘science’ (Pilots, we’re experts in everything right, just ask us) is incorrect and I’m now not able to keep my Class 1.

I don’t think our colleague in Vietnam who spent months on a ventilator (I think he was a fairly healthy bloke beforehand) and ECMO, would quite agree with the idea of letting it run rampant, especially now that his lungs are probably ruined for the rest of his life and unlikely to ever fly again.

Just have a think about all that.....

Section28- BE 16th Jul 2020 09:10

ex ABC: I covered America's coronavirus outbreak for months. Then I caught.....
 
Shall 'just' leave, this here (and not engage, lock & load):

Link: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-07-...erica/12414554

Rgds all/be well!!!
S28- BE

Turnleft080 16th Jul 2020 09:37

55? Really? Couple of months ago you told us you were 60. ----- Sorry about my fluctuations depends on how I'm feeling in morning. Knee joints are 30. Off for a run.

Gone back to pilot school yet? ----- I'm thrusting on beautifully always looking for a lift though sick and tired of those that want to weigh me down and drag me in the mud.

Or do you still think 20% less oxygen is -well, you know the rest. ------ If only our lungs could speak- STOP GAGGING ME YOU DRONGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Will Dan wear a musk. Now that's a good Q&A.

glekichi 16th Jul 2020 11:10


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10837698)

1. Masks- should only be worn if you have or tested positive with covid. If you have 100 people tested negative masks are pointless.
Additionally they reduce your O2 by 20% because your recycling some of your CO2 which is a by product (waste) once the red blood cells have finished it's job of transporting O2.
Hence all your body organs are getting 20% less O2. Well that's really good for your brain.
If you get sneezed on your mask is supposed to protect you. Like hell. Your hair, ears, forehead, neck, shoulders, shirt, pants, are totally coated with the virus.
Then you touch your mask, enough said. Don't forget your swimming goggles if you wear a musk, tear ducts absorb everything that's in front of you.
Minor points they mentally drag you down, can't see your lips move while talking, and you feel claustrophobic adding emotional stress.

2. Social distancing- Who came up with 1.5m. Really WHO came up with this shizen. If you sneeze in still air your particles will travel 5-7m they are released at 200kph.
Kylie Mole/Billie Eilish "der."

So can you not see how your point no.2 contradicts no.1?

Absolutely people should be wearing masks to prevent such situations. Not 24/7 but definitely in crowded places and in close contact. The lack of O2 and CO2 buildup fake news has been debunked time and time again.

If sensible mask wearing and distancing (1.5-2m is enough for non-sneeze particles) can be implemented, you can keep the spread at bay without going full lockdown.
Flatten the curve without shutting down society.

The virus doesn't appear to be that bad compared to whats already getting around, except for the rapid spread causing a breakdown in the healthcare system.
Locking down borders forever is not sustainable. NZ is going to be hit very hard if they keep it up.
Countries and states should be opening up to places with similar levels of success in controlling the virus in their populations through practical measures, ie, social distancing and masks, etc.
It doesn't need to be zero.

That said I doubt Australians and Kiwis can adapt to wearing masks that are there to help others and are not for their own benefit.

People will go as far as to spread bullshit like O2 levels an CO2 concentrations to avoid it.
How dare we interfere with god's own perfectly designed respiratory system? (They say wearing clothes and sunscreen interfering with god's own perfectly designed skin)
We aren't good at frequent hand washing.
I still saw someone at Woolies, in the midst of this outbreak and well before it was under control, rub their nose on fruit in order to give it a really good sniff and make sure it was ripe...

Thus the huge initial spike we saw pre-lockdown that had us on a trajectory like that of Italy or the US.
I was against the lockdown, but if we cant adapt......

We need to change and adapt and learn to live WITH it to keep the curve flattened until its done the rounds and/or a vaccine is developed, or the alternative it to just build a big wall around the country to keep out those infected foreigners and forget tourism or business travel altogether for a couple of years.

morno 16th Jul 2020 12:13

I’ll just leave this here....

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-07-...weeks/12444716

Anyone concerned about contracting this and then possibly not being able to maintain a medical? I know I am. Run rampant? No thanks.

There’s a great bunch of clowns in here that make themselves think they have degrees in medicine and epidemiology.

Turnleft080 16th Jul 2020 13:48

Morno. My only concern for this women, as I read through the article was hoping I get to the part on what drugs she was administered throughout her 3 months.
At no stage throughout the article a doctor or a epidemiologist actually indicted or (she didn't say what she was taking) to recover from this thing.
She was blasé initially though i.e. she was fine, it will probably pass because I'm 31 and healthy.
Well if that was me I would very seriously nuke the bastard, no not sudafed it I'm talking 20 raw cloves of garlic chopped in half and swallow. Not all at once, over a day with food.
Plus 4 litres of water. This thing dehydrates you fast.
I know I'm not a med expert or an epidemiologist as you mentioned though that's what I would do. I would give it a shot see how it goes. With flu I always win.
I know covid is not the flu but the way I treat the very first symptom of URTI is garlic. In today's environment I would 10 fold the problem.
If you want to grill me or think I'm a nut case I can take that.
Theirs like 15 health benefits in taking garlic everyday.
Anyway glad she is recovering.
Good health everyone.


glekichi 16th Jul 2020 13:50

Wouldn't all of that in the article apply to most with any form of pneumonia?

ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE 16th Jul 2020 13:55


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10838790)
Morno. My only concern for this women, as I read through the article was hoping I get to the part on what drugs she was administered throughout her 3 months.
At no stage throughout the article a doctor or a epidemiologist actually indicted or (she didn't say what she was taking) to recover from this thing.
She was blasé initially though i.e. she was fine, it will probably pass because I'm 31 and healthy.
Well if that was me I would very seriously nuke the bastard, no not sudafed it I'm talking 20 raw cloves of garlic chopped in half and swallow. Not all at once, over a day with food.
Plus 4 litres of water. This thing dehydrates you fast.
I know I'm not a med expert or an epidemiologist as you mentioned though that's what I would do. I would give it a shot see how it goes. With flu I always win.
I know covid is not the flu but the way I treat the very first symptom of URTI is garlic. In today's environment I would 10 fold the problem.
If you want to grill me or think I'm a nut case I can take that.
Theirs like 15 health benefits in taking garlic everyday.
Anyway glad she is recovering.
Good health everyone.

There you have it ladies and gentlemen, tell the boys at Oxford to down tools, some nut job on PPRUNE just solved the COVID crisis. Garlic! The cure we’ve been looking for! Can’t wait to hear the Nobel Prize speech Turn Left!

Turnleft080 16th Jul 2020 14:16


Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE (Post 10838801)
There you have it ladies and gentlemen, tell the boys at Oxford to down tools, some nut job on PPRUNE just solved the COVID crisis. Garlic! The cure we’ve been looking for! Can’t wait to hear the Nobel Prize speech Turn Left!

Got to say I got a laugh out of that. A Nobel. If Greta Thurnburg can do it, anyone can do it. Thanks mate my shout

Sunfish 16th Jul 2020 19:42

Garlic! What a good way to enforce social distancing.

Stickshift3000 17th Jul 2020 01:16

440 new cases in Vic today.

Not surprising, as the numbers will continue to lag behind lockdown restrictions for at least another week.

Section28- BE 17th Jul 2020 01:26

ex ABC: I'm a doctor on Melbourne's coronavirus front line.......
 
And ex ABC today- link here: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-07-...ation/12462518

rgds
S28- BE

Turnleft080 17th Jul 2020 03:57

It turns out 428 cases. Just another point of view. Split the group. Put 214 on my garlic extravaganza and place 214 on standard medications.
Which group would recover faster.

Chris2303 17th Jul 2020 06:16

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/a...ectid=12348849

Covid 19 coronavirus: Winston Peters takes aim at Australia over virus 'looseness'

To be fair we have an election in 63 days


BNEA320 17th Jul 2020 06:59

Qatar to fly AKL/BNE/DOH from August 3 using an A350-1000. Don't think they have traffic rights AKL/BNE/AKL but maybe they'll get temporary traffic rights ?

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38...ighlight=qatar


ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE 17th Jul 2020 07:10


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10839289)
It turns out 428 cases. Just another point of view. Split the group. Put 214 on my garlic extravaganza and place 214 on standard medications.
Which group would recover faster.

hahaha

thanks for taking my comment in the spirit it was intended!

Very good idea

Stickshift3000 17th Jul 2020 07:56


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10839289)
It turns out 428 cases. Just another point of view. Split the group. Put 214 on my garlic extravaganza and place 214 on standard medications.
Which group would recover faster.

Perhaps you could also dose half of them with turmeric? Surely nothing could survive the garlic & turmeric 1, 2 knockdown combo?!

Dozens of research institutes and private companies working feverishly on vaccines and therapies, and the answer was in the bottom of our pantries and being added to our lattes all along...

wheels_down 17th Jul 2020 12:08

The Premier of SA spoke to the media tonight and said he will have his borders closed, on his words, for a very very long time to Victoria and NSW. I read this as months not weeks.

His first case in nearly three weeks of nothing, today, was none other than a Jetstar pax that flew in from Melbourne.

Looks like SA will join QLD with a monitoring period post lockdown of 4-8 weeks watching Victoria and see if they can handle it.

It appears that August to October the dial is not going to shift much at all on the capacity front. Hopefully the thing washes away in the back end of this timeframe so we can start opening up from November otherwise the ramifications are financially dire for the industry if we don’t. Anastasia is clearly going to play hardball with the southern states in terms of reopening.




Ragnor 17th Jul 2020 22:02

You hate JQ Wheels Down, could of been a pax on any flight even your beloved carrier.


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