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-   -   Virgin headed for another disaster, says REX chairman (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/632260-virgin-headed-another-disaster-says-rex-chairman.html)

normanton 7th May 2020 09:10


Originally Posted by chookcooker (Post 10775113)
essentially the same at VA
salary based on 69 hours/rp (NOT 60 as dopey said, was corrected on and STILL wouldn’t concede)
and then the hourly rate on top of that. It’s no like it’s Double time or anything

And yet QF made billions and Virgin lost billions. Hows that work?

chookcooker 7th May 2020 09:35


Originally Posted by normanton (Post 10775126)
And yet QF made billions and Virgin lost billions. Hows that work?

and there in lies the truth that the root of the problem wasn’t pilot conditions or wages (despite Dopey’s musing)

Icarus2001 7th May 2020 10:06


That graph is a 'generic', outdated to 2015.
It is meaningless currently. Airlines have a dynamic environment and it is certainly no reflection on VA expenditures.
It shows percentage of operating expenses in each cost centre. How can the year matter? Designed by Boeing & IATA who know a little about operating aircraft in an airline environment. Even if these figures are out by a few percent either way they are highly indicative of what EXFOCX said above...a 50% reduction in crew wages would not have saved VA from administration.

TBM-Legend 7th May 2020 10:33


Originally Posted by Icarus2001 (Post 10775016)
Well it certainly was not crew wages that drove them into administration.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....e0c1851fc8.png

Meaningless pie chart given it is a global average and does not reflect any one actual airline.

Section28- BE 7th May 2020 10:33

What Mr 'exfocx & Icarus' said/are saying, the 'said' problem IS way bigger 'than' that- to deliver 'this end result' right here/right now..................., for Mine/& for what that is not worth.

THE CREWING/Staff cost did, Not Deliver 'this' Result- yup, 'there' may have been a journey of 'we' are worth 'this', but none of that was in anybodies Best Interests (at 'that' time, given this point in time, as it were) and 'was' ultimately delivered by THE Head-Shed..............

Not, the first time 'that'/this' gig has gone around- if you get 'what' I mean......

Rgds all
S28- BE

ozbiggles 7th May 2020 10:48

I’m STRUggling to under/stand a lot of your....posts ‘theses’ days S/@B@%EB

Lead Balloon 7th May 2020 10:57

DITTo....ozbiggles. i 'have' / 'had' no idea what s28--bE post mean- if you don't.....get what i mean. not may have been-yup THE Head-Case...

SandyPalms 7th May 2020 11:00

Thanks biggles and lead. That made me laugh. I have never been able to understand him.

Section28- BE 7th May 2020 11:02

Good :ok:
Rgds
S28

Hoosten 7th May 2020 11:29


I’m STRUggling to under/stand a lot of your....posts ‘theses’ days S/@

B@%EB
Was gunna say that but would be accused of slander and being vicious.

Paragraph377 7th May 2020 11:42


Originally Posted by Section28- BE (Post 10775242)
Good :ok:
Rgds
S28

I quite like your posts and I understand around 8/10 of them so that’s pretty good. You have style and character and you’re not short on the brain cells either. Keep up the good work my cryptic friend!

Fliegenmong 7th May 2020 12:56

But try doing 70-80 hours a month for 12 months....
Yes.....my Brother in law was doing that every week until stood down, what support do you expect from him or countless others like him??

Ever noticed this country is so wildly expensive to live in now companies depend upon workers working many many unpaid hours?...slaves really....any unpaid work is an admission of a business that is failing under fair terms...they fail because the money they rely upon comes from people not paid enough to be customers of their business and so by underpaying them, and over working them, there is no discretionary spend?

Greed...its called greed...

Paragraph377 7th May 2020 13:05

Fuel costs are always the most expensive cost component of an airline, followed by labor.
Purchasing fuel at the right price can make or break an airline, particularly during a time of crisis. It really does not matter what the price of a barrel is today because the fuel you are burning was locked in at a set price perhaps last month, 3 months ago or 6 months ago. There are various hedging techniques and the whole process can be quite complex as many factors are considered as to what price you should pay. The outcome is a serious one. For example, an airline might lock in 80% of their fuel at a set purchase price for 3 months. The other 20% is set at today’s rate. So if fuel today is $60 per barrel but you hedged 80% of it at $22 per barrel 3 months ago, even though it has steadily climbed to $60 per barrel, you’ve still done well because only 20% of your fuel is at the higher price. But if it is the reverse situation, you have just blown many many millions of dollars by making a poor decision. Qantas has generally done well with its hedging over the years. It hasn’t always got it right, but more often than not it has had skilled analysts who have called the right shots. Not so with Virgin. On numerous occasions they have screwed up the hedge price and it has cost them tens of millions of dollars. The idiot Manny Gill buggered it up twice and it almost sent the then Virgin Blue to the wall. However, being one of ‘Brett’s Boys’ he lived to get paid for another day and was in fact promoted.






spektrum 7th May 2020 13:36


Yet another thread about Virgin's downfall and problems. It couldnt have been added to one of the other existing threads??

I honestly believe some of you have serious mental problems. Cannot help yourself and cannot hide the enthusiasm of watching Virgin fail, with 10,000+ people losing their livelihood, houses and possibly life. Enjoy yours why you can........
Then turn off your computer. Don't read it. It's that simple. Clearly people feel like discussing it.

airdualbleedfault 7th May 2020 13:58

Despite the plethora of flogs (Inc Mr Lim) here that should be running merchant banks instead of flying aeroplanes, nobody has explained in layman's terms how Kwantarse can pay virtually all of their staff significantly more than Virgin and still turn a large profit, if indeed as the experts say the EBAs need to be slashed at VA???????

SHVC 7th May 2020 21:30


Originally Posted by airdualbleedfault (Post 10775441)
Despite the plethora of flogs (Inc Mr Lim) here that should be running merchant banks instead of flying aeroplanes, nobody has explained in layman's terms how Kwantarse can pay virtually all of their staff significantly more than Virgin and still turn a large profit, if indeed as the experts say the EBAs need to be slashed at VA???????

Well as much as anyone would hate to admit it, QANTAS are just better at the aviation business than Virgin ever will be. Hate it or love it it’s the truth. We need an AJ at at VA I don’t think Scurrah is the savior either he has already proved his incompetence.

Paragraph377 7th May 2020 22:16


Originally Posted by SHVC (Post 10775780)
Well as much as anyone would hate to admit it, QANTAS are just better at the aviation business than Virgin ever will be. Hate it or love it it’s the truth. We need an AJ at at VA I don’t think Scurrah is the savior either he has already proved his incompetence.

Qantas has had 100 years to hone their craft. Virgin a lot less time in the saddle. Qantas were always innovators or made the first step, Virgin are followers and ride coattails. Qantas has/was always stacked with analysts - fuel, economy, markets, etc, some very smart, savvy and experienced folk. They had people who knew every inch of the region, knew every Mayor or Council CEO and would engage often. Virgin often has specialists, wannabe’s and kiddies in those roles, and not many of them either. They don’t know the regions, markets, or key people. They were too busy getting wet spots over Federal Government politicians and famous people sitting in 1a. Qantas set up a large freight network with associated infrastructure and contracts. VA bought 777’s with no ULD freight capability. Big big big mistake. Another one to add to the list. You can’t compare VA with QF. It’s like comparing a vagina to a dick.

And before some sook starts accusing me of wanting to see VA collapse, get your emotions in check because that’s not what I want. I’m just stating my opinion on a rumour network. My later years after retiring from flying saw me managing businesses interests that gave me a full comprehension and accurate understanding of how both our national airlines and Governments and how they work. Qantas isn’t perfect and in my opinion they’ve made mistakes over the years. Deferring fleet upgrades for so long that they now have the oldest fleet they’ve ever had, and buying the Dugong are mistakes. AJ will be long gone with his bag of money under his arm when the fleet issues bite hard and they have to spend a motza which will impact profits, but that is a story for the not-so-distant future.








ozbiggles 7th May 2020 23:17

‘Full comprehension and accurate understanding of how both our national airlines and governments and how they work’.
You just outed yourself Mr Geoffrey Thomas.....or Neil Hanford, I can’t pick it.

Paragraph377 7th May 2020 23:24


Originally Posted by ozbiggles (Post 10775833)
‘Full comprehension and accurate understanding of how both our national airlines and governments and how they work’.
You just outed yourself Mr Geoffrey Thomas.....or Neil Hanford, I can’t pick it.

Neither, you fool, that’s why you can’t pick it. There are some of us that finished flying and then owned businesses that related to the industry mate. Neither of the two fools you mentioned have worked the frontline.

cunnamullafella 7th May 2020 23:36

Does anyone know how much of $300mil Regional Aviation Programs REX has been granted.

The Singaporean is firing a shot across his own employees bow using Virgin as an example.


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