Qantas suspends flights into Canberra
 

Heard part of a news item on the radio a few minutes ago that Qantas have suspended flights into Canberra - presumably due to poor visibility in smoke.

Also on ABC web site:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-...antas/11842038

Melbourne to Canberra flight flew through smoke and (fire induced?) turbulence. Passengers applauded on landing. Plane met by emergency services. Captain 'greeting' passengers as they disembarked.

I'm surprised flights have been able to continue to operate - visibility must have been close to limits for days.

Canberra is CAT II so the smoke won't stop you, but the southerly is more the problem which prevents using the ILS.

From staff at Qantas the company was handing out P2 masks....May be a little of the Workplace Health and Safety mantra that an employer cannot knowingly expose workers to environments where a hazard to health results.

”The other issue worth considering is that the pyrocumulonimbus clouds don’t show up on the weather radar. And if you’re descending in thick smoke - you’re every chance to fly straight into one. Which would be no fun at all!”

Quite true. Without wanting to beat up on the QF crew - it is still poor form to fly yourself into a PyroCu. Ive been operating into CB the last week with all the smoke and the pyrocu’s are VERY easy to identify during the day - they are the only thing with any structure above the strong inversion keeping the smoke blanket thick on the ground. Its pretty easy to work out whether one will be on your STAR path and to pick a route/heading that will keep you clear during the descent into 0 vis.

At night the PyroCu’s have been collapsing pretty quickly too. The reduced temps after sundown mist see the fire propagating the cloud die down in intensity and heat, leading to the PyroCu collapsing.

Send in Malindo - they'll have no probs getting in

The difference between Qantas’s and Virgin’s approach has been stark. Virgin arrivals and departures at YSCB have continued, unabated, while Qantas has cancelled. The Qantas announcements in the YSCB terminal have stated that the cancellations are for the purpose of avoiding unnecessary exposure of staff to the smoke.

The atmosphere in YSCB is appalling. ****ty conditions would be nice, but the conditions are beyond ****ty. The worst smoke haze I’ve ever seen (and smelt and tasted).

Will be interesting to hear what the ACT’s chief medical officer says about the health effects of hanging around breathing this ****.

So if the RVR apparatus isn't certified for smoke, what prevents an ARO going out and counting the lights to assess the visibility? I'm told the METAR gave the visibility and, if so, how was that obtained?

Where I once worked that (counting the runway lights) was how the crew determined if they had the required visibility for takeoff in poor conditions at airports where there wasn't any RVR equipment. Determining if the required visibility existed or otherwise was the crew's responsibility and counting the visible lights and multiplying the number seen by the known spacing got you the answer.

Doesn't an assessment of the visibility fall within the role of an accredited met observer?

That was the point Lead, it seems more WHS related rather than a flying limitation.
Despite Little Napoleon enjoying some a beach side interlude, resplendent in swimwear, he is responsible for the health and safety.
(Exactly why he wants three delivery flights classified as "research" -WHS defence if increased sickness results)

Nothing prevents anyone from making a realistic assessment of the visibility. It’s just that for low vis ops e.g. SA CAT I and CAT II in Canberra, RVR is REQUIRED. It CANNOT be replaced by RV assessed by pilot or other observer (e.g. counting runway lights). Also, from what we have been told, it’s not just that the RVRs are not certified in smoke, they have also been giving false readings, see below.

RVR AT YSCB MAY BE UNAVAILABLE DUE TO THE RVR EQUIPMENT IS DESIGNED FOR FG/BR - IT IS NOT RATED FOR FU AND HAS BEEN GIVING ERRONEOUS READINGS.
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YSCB TWR IS ADDRESSING THIS ISSUE BY INDICATING RVR NOT AVBL ON THE ATIS AND SUPPLYING INSTEAD, A VISIBILITY ASSESSMENT.
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NOTE - WITHOUT RVR INFORMATION, CAT II AND CAT I SA APPROACHES ARE NOT AVAILABLE.

Haven't there been issues in the past with this sort of smoke setting off cargo smoke alarms. I have a very vague memory of that from 767 days.

If we paid Qantas enough, could they cancel them permanently? Close the highways and cut off communications as well?

Sunfish, with tongue firmly embedded in cheek, what self-serving politician will stop J class junkets with more wine served in a 30 minute flight than a transcontinental five hour flight.
Boozy politicians and Chairman's lounge memberships..No influence at all your Honour.

Best thing they could do with Canberra is a build a big wall around it and let no one in or out.

And fill it with water.

So on this occasion Qantas are actually doing the right thing and looking out for the health of their staff but you are still having a whine about Joyce and have no issue with the other carriers who are doing the opposite???

Why am I not surprised. Your venom for Qantas leaves you blind to reality and zero credibility.

Given that Canberra (ACT) supplies 5 Federal politicians, we'd be very happy not to have "your" politicians cluttering up the place.

As for the water, we'll take all you send - no measurable rain since early November.

or other events may have altered “policy”

https://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...377f97936b5cda

Overheard a rather dramatic account from a passenger onboard the flight today (and by dramatic I mean melodramatic), and according to them the aircraft was damaged. My understanding was that it wasn’t. Now I’m curious! Can anyone provide the truth?