737..
 

My trusty old GPS shows 737km from Curtin to downtown Port Hedland..

Darwin weather at the time was no good (I was in it😏).

Curtin/Derby must hardly have any people there let alone permanent ARFF.

On the face of it looks like the tech crew did a good job to me.

'Shaking' Malaysia Airlines flight turns back to Australia
 

'Shaking' Malaysia Airlines flight turns back to Australia - BBC News

Sounds like a very unpleasant experience, but with a good outcome.
No explanation given though - any more inf out there?

EDIT:
Engine Failure? http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-1...prings/9341584

Track: https://www.flightradar24.com/data/f...mh122#102853f6

Not surprisingly, there is a thread already running the the Australian Forum!

There is a regular USAF milkrun flight for the Pine Gapians.

AirAsia didn’t divert and went to Melbourne. Got a thrashing on pprune for doing so.

Malaysian diverted to Alice instead of continuing. Got a thrashing on pprune for doing so.

:ugh::ugh::ugh:

What happened to land at the nearest :ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

Nearest what?

"What happened to land at the nearest ............" ????????

Nearest suitable is not necessarily the nearest physically. No-one here thus far has indicated what MH policy has to say. Might be smart to learn that before making comments..

Capt Fathom, you beat me to it - ".... land at the nearest" what?

The 777 QRH, for example, has many references to "Plan to land at the nearest suitable airport." Quite a few things to consider for an airport to be suitable, including being available for use, and weather commensurate with the types of approach that can be used.

"To land the airplane as soon as possible, if needed" tends to be limited to time critical things e.g. Smoke, Fire or Fumes, the priority being to get the aircraft on the deck quickly, before the event overwhelms the crew and/or aircraft.

But, 1a sound asleep, to cry "Whatever happened to land at the nearest" and bang heads against walls ...... well, you perhaps haven't given your comment as much thought as you should? Until it is clear(er) what happened to MH122, you aren't really in a position to criticise, are you?

I actually have/had that on VHS, one of the all time great TV interviews, unlike talkback radio, TV is "real time"(or was??).
Tootle pip!!

Only by prior arrangement or in an emergency.

The USAF milkruns are cleared elsewhere usually Richmond I believe.

Diverting to YBAS sounds like a perfectly reasonable decision to me, based on what has been reported. And since when does it matter whether it is an 'international aiport'? It's not as though they planned to go there!

From the AIPs, Gen, page 1.2-22. Suitable for international ops. in these circumstances..
"Alternate Airports to International Airports
Alice Springs
Serviced for international arrivals in the event of an emergency/stress"

Interesting the discussion here about where to land and particularly what the company policy is. If I was a passenger, or indeed the pilot with an engine failure on a twin engine aircraft, the last thing on the list of considerations to me would be company policy. the heroes who want to continue beyond the absolute nearest runway that can accept the aircraft in my opinion are crazy. An engine has failed, why? what has caused it? what is the condition of the other engine? will it fail also? Is the failed engine windmilling? will it suddenly seize? what are the consequences if it does? was the pylon damaged in any way during the event? If I am ever a passenger on an aircraft that you are flying and it has an engine failure (catastrophic by the sounds of it), please forget all the hero pilot **** and get the damn thing on the ground as soon as possible:rolleyes:

My definition of nearest suitable does not include maintenance facilities because the big book “ capts guide to maintenance facilities worldwide “ has been removed to save weight.

There is a grave yard at Alice if they want to leave it there......

I’d much rather the pilots,to use Gene Krantzs phrase
“ work the problem” rather than being distracted telling me as SLF they’re “working the problem”. The word nearest is interesting the Honeywell FMC alternates Page never gives less than 15mins if at cruising altitude. Nearest in distance is not necessarily nearest in time. If it’s ok with you Arnold I’ll fly an extra few minutes to have a 20kt HW v a 20kt XW OEI because I’m not a hero. I also know the other engine maybe suspect ( eg.ice crystal icing ) but again also know if I get to 1000R clean at 210kts the jet will autoland no engines.

Looks like it was handled well by the crew, kudos. Not surprising since MH from my understanding has very good standards and training. Just happen to be ‘Victims’ of two unfortunate events quite close together. I doubt the other KL based operator would’ve made the same decisions.....

Is Alice suitable for a chartered An-22 or B747-8F to bring in a spare engine, other bits needed and tooling to swap engines? And take the bad one to be investigated?

As a regular SLF, but someone who has never flown a jet above about 20 ft ;) (back in my days at BA Cranebank)
I'd respectfully suggest that the above argument is (merely) a logistics issue, and not a safety one.
(Plus I'm sure that any airline would rather face trucking whatever is needed to ASP in prefererence to recovering the debris from the middle of nowhere!)

Nearest SUITABLE
 

The Captain would have chosen to land at Alice Springs based on all the information available to him at the time. You can be sure the safety of the aircraft and occupants would have been paramount in his mind.

Descent Procedure
 

Some technical questions - I see from the flightaware plot in post 2 and the altitude plot in post 63 that the aircraft did a 180 degree turn, and descended from 10,000m to around 7,000m. Is the 180 turn (to get out of the way of other aircraft,as I understand it) a Malaysian SOP, or is it pretty universal world wide? And what's the approximate OEI ceiling for an A330 - obviously depends on gross weight, etc.. (I already know the A330 ceiling with two engines out :)).

And from the linked ATC audio I thought I heard a request for a "high speed descent" - is that usual? No criticism intended - just interested in the technical details.

BTW, my personal experience affirms that engine failures/shutdowns in flight are very rare. I've done a lot of flying to Asia and Europe over the years, and the only engine shutdown I can remember was on a BA Bristol Britannia. (I bet there's not many people reading can say they've flown in a Britannia!).

yes
 

I have nice kite, nice ride.

:ok:

They used to stop in Alice to drop off vehicles and supplies in the 90's - pretty sure it was a Galaxy. In 95 they even delivered a flag pole for a local RAAF Radar Unit.

Alice Springs does have a road, the Stuart Highway. So they could bring a spare engine in by road. Looks like another Goose Bay type engineering problem, but a bit warmer.
.
http://www.airports-worldwide.com/im...lia_03_big.jpg
.

Retired aircraft park at Alice Springs.....Seems a good opportunity to swap planes and continue...

Folks,
Is there no end to surprises, I am agreeing with Bloggs about something??
Tootle pip!!

Britannia
 

Rob-Ginger. "Not many here who would have flown on a Bristol Britannia" ???

I serviced them in the early 1960's, along with Connies when they transited Adelaide. Also serviced and flew in Bristol Freighters, something which even fewer would have done I suspect.

As for the 180 degree turn and descent from 10000 metres to 7000 metres
the turn would simply to back-track toward Alice Springs and the descent may well have been the OEI driftdown altitude for the weight and ISA conditions prevailing.

Maybe I should have put "SOPs" instead of "policy" for your better understanding, Arnold, although there is usually not much between them.

Do you understand that these a/c are maintained to ETOPS/EDTO (or similar) standards which means the probability of both engines suffering a failure is reduced to an infinitesimal level? That is why they are certified to fly for 120/180/217 minutes (depending on the type) on one engine.

If you would like the crew to get the a/c on the ground as soon as possible (into an airport that is less than ideal i.e. suitable) when it is not required then I take it you would be extremely uncomfortable being in a twin-engined aircraft crossing the Pacific where the nearest aerodrome might be somewhere like Tarawa or Kosrae. They certainly might be nearer (achieving your "as soon as possible" desire) but they are not "suitable" for a number of reasons.

As to a failed engine windmilling and then seizing - what is the issue, it's not developing power anyway? Seizure would preclude any relight attempt but not many would want to try that seeing they've shut it down for good reason.


p.s Just commenting on your "the absolute nearest runway that can accept the aircraft". We don't know the circumstances that took WA coastal aerodromes out of consideration. Things like RFF, weather, available approaches, pilot familiarity (the crew may well have done sim famil into ASP for all we know) are all factors that contribute to an aerodrome being "suitable". It may well transpire that ASP was "the absolute nearest runway that can accept the aircraft". Why don't we wait until we have the facts.

.

My bet is that they were trying to back-track to Sydney. They first found out that they could not maintain 10000m so had to descend to 7000m. Then they realised that Sydney was going to be just too far away. So only then did they declare a Pan, and landed at the nearest airfield.


Does anyone have any details of what has happened to the aircraft at Alice, or are news sources limited there.
.

Get your arm out from between the cusion and the arm of the chair

Got an idea for you Arnold. The IFE could have a page, where if an emergency occurs, which could display a range of options. All the passengers vote, and the winning vote is what the crew does. After all, the crew has absolutely no idea of the best course of action, which your post so eloquently espouses. Of course you would need to pay extra when purchasing the ticket for access to this facility.

No it doesn't.

I can see exactly what Arnold is getting at and it doesn't involve having a vote or going to the nearest convenient airport.

Vote via facebook or Twitter would be better.

No, they reported that the aircraft diverted there and had footage of, and interviews with, the pax as well as footage of the a/c on the tarmac.
Not newsworthy any more so there'll be SFA from the press.

OBVIOUS - to all but "the great unwashed". Not even a "command decision".

"Got an idea for you Arnold. The IFE could have a page, where if an emergency occurs, which could display a range of options. All the passengers vote, and the winning vote is what the crew does. After all, the crew has absolutely no idea of the best course of action, which your post so eloquently espouses. Of course you would need to pay extra when purchasing the ticket for access to this facility."

Remember, years ago now, when PPRUNE was a place of intelligent discourse and not a vipers pit of of sm@rt @rssed replies?