I know many times more about shares and investing than I do about airlines, which is why I no longer hold QAN and am a nervous but still in the money holder of VAH.

One of my family works for DJ. I'm incredibly glad about that.

It's too early for a good look at what the papers do, but this has to be one of Sandilands's stronger pieces.

Qantas profit downgrade shatters hopes for its future | Plane Talking

I hate to see good people hurt. I remember what it was like for family friends when Ansett died, when Kendell went sideways, when Lysaghts disappeared, and when Burns Philp got hammered. Qantas has to experience an internal revolution to escape from this dreadful dark pit into which it has dropped.

It's not all bad news. Shares had dropped to $1.15 but they have rebounded. Now sitting at $1.155.

Relief only temporary. Now $1.14.

Thanks for the compliment! :* The three largest shareholders in Qantas are all representing superannuation investments. Mum and Dad's retirement benefit superannuation ........ including unfortunately, a small investment by Tail Wheel's super fund! :yuk:

Bull s**t! The B@stards are still walking away with bonuses based on self generated KPI statistics - not hard core, bottom line company financial results.

Why should Joyce and his cohort earn one cent in bonus when no share holder has received a cent in dividend for three years?

I'm currently losing a few grand a week out of my Super due to economic chaos not of my doing and beyond my control. Don't get me riled up! :mad:

When you see about 10 jets of the international fleet sitting idle day after day at the jetbase, you can start to believe that international is making some big losses. Reduce the flying, reduce the revenue; without massive cuts in non-operational staff, then there is only one direction the outfit is headed at an ever quickening rate.

Even domestic appears to have a woeful jet utilisation, jets don't make money sitting on the ground for hours and hours.

Qantas needs massive change right now right from the top down, cull the board and senior management and trim all that fat all the way down to operational level (do they really need a person to staple the NOTAMS? Do they really need so many "project" pilots?)

Every section of the business needs a wake-up and a shake-up.

A lot more pain on the way - at every level.:sad:

From that article of Ben shadowlands

.

Says it all really! Anyone think they are watching ansett, united or pan am here.

The next they will be doing is callling emergency staff meetings and saying to all (pilots included) if everyone cannot take 30% wage cuts across the board we will have to make redundant 1000s and 1000s of workers. It has happened before don't worry. Although maybe that is truly what he wants. Drive it down to that point and try that on. What a colossal mess.

note SCHEDULED flights, they won't be ACTUAL flights.

You've all got it wrong.

This airline NEEDS a new fitout of it's headquarters and uniforms for frontline staff. Now, that's a strategy.

Tailwheel, I lost plenty in 2008's GFC 1, I feel your pain. Never again mate. Visit your accountant, set up a self managed fund (easier than it sounds), buy gold and silver through the Perth mint, control your destiny and to hell with these corporate assclowns. Buy a real investment, real metal, not shares, and store it there. You pay a small feel and the main requirement is that you audit, yes you heard it, audit the Mint yearly, will probably cost you around 5k (less than AJ is losing people per month). You can even claim the trip to Perth, in part, and have a holiday while you are there!
F#ck shares, particularly airline shres, especially when you 'risk' having someone like Herr Joyce at the helm.

@gobbledock...

Don't worry mate there is obviously no end to the corporate scam.

Trustee to Seize and Liquidate Even the Stored Customer Gold and Silver Bullion From MF Global | ZeroHedge

Edit due to first & second pages wouldn't open, try this one.

I'll have a guess
Write off all the bad management decisions and costs onto Qantas international, cry us a river and cut into what use to be a flagship operation.
Next separate the business.
Now not bearing the costs of Jetstar and trimmed to the bone, International makes a profit (or less loss).
Award massive bonus to all management.
Next management decision, merge the business again. Award massive bonus.

Maybe I'm a bit thick, but I understood all the profit was being made domestically. Given that QF doesn't really fly anywhere internationally much anymore, the domestic side of the business must dwarf international. How, then, is it possible that international business conditions and a high aussie dollar result in such a large fall in profit- with an 86% load factor and a large portion of your revenue in a "high Australian dollar", you'd expect them to be making money (which they are, let's not forget), but how do you make less money than a year ago? Alarm bells- great, big alarm bells. Even someone who knows absolutely nothing about airlines must see thru the sham that is now being perpetrated at QF? At the very least, the management strategy is wrong. No wonder even the institutions are heading for the door.

Having followed this thread, I have received yet another hard lesson in investing. I thought all the talk earlier about a $1.40 share price ludicrous. "Good management is very important - buy good businesses. If you don't believe in the management, don't buy the share"- Peter Lynch.

You buy shares for either growth or for their dividend. Which is QF? The answer should tell you what to do with their stock. Their management strategy has been to shrink the business and hoard cash (then either burn it or pay it to themselves). Seems obvious to me....I can't even make a case at $1.16, unless you see something like a management buyout on the horizon......

Wasn't there a lot of movement in Qantas shares just before Christmas.
Lo and behold Senior Management and the Board were purported to have bought up big.
What's the blackout period for insider trading?
Let me guess, around 6 months perhaps?
Will there be a takeover announcement in the very near future?:E

That's what I'm smelling and I don't think it will be by the QF Staff.

Takeover = New CEO.

Unfinished Business
 

Now that the share price has tanked and the Co. is valued at around $2.8billion Old Scrotum Face will be dusting off the paperwork and looking to strike.
Will he give Alan Joyce a big kiss this time?

Who would want to buy out this mess? Target price between 0.00 and 40c in 12 months.

It will look cheap many many times on the way.

Why buy this mess now when you could get it at half price in a year.

Don't think it can't happen?

Pfft. All a non-event.

Simple: find around 12,000 drunk grandmothers and fine them, and you'll be back to your original forecast! Seat on the board please! :D

What does your gut say?
 

Whilst ever the major stake holders of a company, remain major stake holders, you can bet all is going to plan. When a 'real' major investor hits the road, then you will know something is misfiring in the play dead engine room. One can only expect if a fiasco in a publicly listed company is in fact being played out to a master plan that does not reward all investors equally, and can be proven so, a senate inquiry would not be required in such instance. What would be, is a room full of men in funny white wigs. Should be interesting.

The only possibility of a turn around is if both Joyce and Clifford are booted with extreme force so they are unable to resurface. Maybe if someone followed the ALP/Rudd plan it may work.

It is going to have to be significant because DJ are making hay while the sun shines and doing a GREAT job delivering a quality product while the only competition self destructs and spins.